Border Run Alternatives

[transam]

1 hour ago, drbeach said:

Are you really implying the Savannakhet economy is primarily based on Thai expats making visa runs?

 

I don't know about that. There is an industrial park nearby, also a logistics center, seeing that Savannakhet is probably one of the busiest cross-border logistics points in the whole country, connecting Thailand with Vietnam.

 

Perhaps some hotels would close, but I don't see that being a criteria that determines whether or not border runs will be allowed or not. All countries are following UN/WHO guidelines, many of which I don't think the general public is being made aware of right now.

 

This includes the possibility of bringing in new travel requirements that will be in place permanently, after the pandemic is declared as over. What these requirements will be, I can't say. Plenty of articles in the media have given us some idea of what they may entail, but it's purely speculative at this stage.

 

My point is that I think that anyone who reckons that governments will go to all this trouble to implement these unprecedented shutdowns, quarantines, lockdowns and border closures and then just roll them back to the way they were before this started is quite naive.

 

Things changed permanently for air travel after 911 (although that was relatively minor), and things are even more likely to change after this is all over.

Savv used to do visa's the same day, months later it stopped, wonder why, Savv hotels, taxis not having customers......????

[BritTim]

1 hour ago, transam said:

Savv used to do visa's the same day, months later it stopped, wonder why, Savv hotels, taxis not having customers......????

Increased number of applications, and not having time always to get the applications done the same day was the main reason. Believe it or not, the Thai consulate is not overly concerned about the health of the Savannakhet economy.

[transam]

2 minutes ago, BritTim said:

Increased number of applications, and not having time always to get the applications done the same day was the main reason. Believe it or not, the Thai consulate is not overly concerned about the health of the Savannakhet economy.

Perhaps, but who knows what goes on behind the scenes....????

[Denim]

7 hours ago, drbeach said:

Are you really implying the Savannakhet economy is primarily based on Thai expats making visa runs?

 

Yes certainly , at least as far as the tourist industry goes. Hotels , restaurants , taxis etc. Then consider that almost every hotel room has to be built and equipped with furniture and WiFi.

Thais cross for the casino so not much income from them but every tourist that goes over pays a lot for their visa (dollars or baht )

 

They don't call it the ' tourist industry ' for nothing.

 

The local economy might have other contributors but certainly , tourism is way up there.

[drbeach]

2 hours ago, Denim said:

 

Yes certainly , at least as far as the tourist industry goes. Hotels , restaurants , taxis etc. Then consider that almost every hotel room has to be built and equipped with furniture and WiFi.

Thais cross for the casino so not much income from them but every tourist that goes over pays a lot for their visa (dollars or baht )

 

They don't call it the ' tourist industry ' for nothing.

 

The local economy might have other contributors but certainly , tourism is way up there.

Sure. I mean I don't discount the fact that tourism contributes in a large way to the Savannakhet economy, and without it, the city would only have it's logistics and industrial park, which are small in comparison to anything in Thailand or Vietnam.

[Caldera]

2 hours ago, Denim said:

Yes certainly , at least as far as the tourist industry goes. Hotels , restaurants , taxis etc. Then consider that almost every hotel room has to be built and equipped with furniture and WiFi.

 

I can see how you could get that impression if you stay at one of the hotels that are most popular with visa runners and go to the nearby restaurants - as most people you see there are other visa runners. Been there, done that.

 

However, I've occasionally staid at other hotels and it's a much different picture there. As far as Savannakhet as a whole is concerned, it's certainly sleepy but I'd say most hotel guests are business people from Laos and Thailand, neither regular tourists nor visa runners.

 

As most visa runners seem to optimize their trips to spend as little time as possible in Savannakhet and often head straight from the consulate to the border come collection time, their contribution pales in comparison to business travelers who frequent the "karaoke" places etc.

[ThailandRyan]

Be prepared to hand over $3,000 USD upon arrival, be tested for Covid at a cost of $100 USD, stay in one of there hotels with security, and pay for it all, if testing positive you will be put in a hospital and or quarantined.  After all is said and done you may get some of the money back or you may not.  Looks like it will be a crapshoot with quarantine there and then here.  1 month out of your life and lots of cash down the tube.  Looks like the new normal is going to suck for awhile unless your a 5 Star Hi-Brow tourist and go to Phuket....

[Jatujan]

I had an education visa scheduled to last me to the end of the year that was just canceled by immigration last week. Yeah, ouch. It doesn't look like there are any legitimate travel destinations, especially not for Americans. I'm hoping they extend amnesty to at least buy me some more time. Even so, given that "new normal" article, it doesn't seem like it will be easy to re-enter Thailand. ????

[drbeach]

On 6/20/2020 at 12:36 AM, Jatujan said:

I had an education visa scheduled to last me to the end of the year that was just canceled by immigration last week. Yeah, ouch. It doesn't look like there are any legitimate travel destinations, especially not for Americans. I'm hoping they extend amnesty to at least buy me some more time. Even so, given that "new normal" article, it doesn't seem like it will be easy to re-enter Thailand. ????

or any other country. I read that the Maldives may offer an easy entry route come July 1, but that's probably for 2 main reasons: 1) the lifeblood of the Maldivian economy is tourism, making up 75% of GDP 2) social distancing is easy. Practically everyone that goes there is heading to an isolated all-inclusive resort and spends all their time there.

 

Other countries like Cambodia, Laos, Vietnam? Probably similar or more stringent entry requirements to Thailand, in the initial opening phases.

[acenase]

If the amnesty extends past 31 July, this has got to be the only way for tourist visa holders to actually live in Thailand long-term without doing visa runs anymore. Quite amazing if you think about it since you don't even have to leave the country anymore so long as the amnesty keeps extending.

Edited June 21, 2020 by acenase

[Jatujan]

18 hours ago, drbeach said:

or any other country. I read that the Maldives may offer an easy entry route come July 1, but that's probably for 2 main reasons: 1) the lifeblood of the Maldivian economy is tourism, making up 75% of GDP 2) social distancing is easy. Practically everyone that goes there is heading to an isolated all-inclusive resort and spends all their time there.

 

Other countries like Cambodia, Laos, Vietnam? Probably similar or more stringent entry requirements to Thailand, in the initial opening phases.

Yeah, to leave Thailand as a U.S. passport-holder right now more or less means going back to the States. I read similar things about the Maldives in addition to St. Lucia and Aruba in the Caribbean—very random. European countries are starting to open up but don't seem eager to accept Americans. 

[acenase]

12 hours ago, Jatujan said:

Yeah, to leave Thailand as a U.S. passport-holder right now more or less means going back to the States. I read similar things about the Maldives in addition to St. Lucia and Aruba in the Caribbean—very random. European countries are starting to open up but don't seem eager to accept Americans. 

 

I don't believe Americans will be allowed to travel to any country anytime soon due to the fact that the numbers for covid-19 are still crazy. Some places are still reporting 3,000+ cases daily (new york, arizona, florida to name a few).

 

Thailand has pretty much got covid-19 under control, and the only way to allow tourists to travel into the country again will with a travel bubble and in phases. so even when the borders do open up again, immigration isn't going to just accept americans to fly into the country. they will most likely start with asian countries first and then see how the community is and if they can keep the spread of infection under control with just a few countries being allowed in.

Edited June 22, 2020 by acenase

[drbeach]

6 hours ago, acenase said:

 

I don't believe Americans will be allowed to travel to any country anytime soon due to the fact that the numbers for covid-19 are still crazy. Some places are still reporting 3,000+ cases daily (new york, arizona, florida to name a few).

 

Thailand has pretty much got covid-19 under control, and the only way to allow tourists to travel into the country again will with a travel bubble and in phases. so even when the borders do open up again, immigration isn't going to just accept americans to fly into the country. they will most likely start with asian countries first and then see how the community is and if they can keep the spread of infection under control with just a few countries being allowed in.

Portugal is apparently already letting them in and the rest of Europe won't be far behind. France may be next (starting next month) and the rest of Europe will likely admit Americans if not in July then August. Of course, this is tentative at this stage, but the sources I've been following seem to indicate this.

[BritTim]

9 minutes ago, drbeach said:

Portugal is apparently already letting them in and the rest of Europe won't be far behind. France may be next (starting next month) and the rest of Europe will likely admit Americans if not in July then August. Of course, this is tentative at this stage, but the sources I've been following seem to indicate this.

The world is evolving into two groups: a smaller group that has opted for virus elimination, and a larger group that is giving up and allowing virus transmission with only some minimal controls aimed at moderating the rate of infections. The rules on entering Covid-19 free countries are going to be very different from entry into countries that place little importance on Covid-19 control.

[drbeach]

3 hours ago, BritTim said:

The world is evolving into two groups: a smaller group that has opted for virus elimination, and a larger group that is giving up and allowing virus transmission with only some minimal controls aimed at moderating the rate of infections. The rules on entering Covid-19 free countries are going to be very different from entry into countries that place little importance on Covid-19 control.

Could be, and while it's too early to say where this is heading, what I know is this: SE Asia needs tourists, investors and the outside world much more than Europe needs the outside world. It's a simple fact. Obviously there are differences in governing styles, with most SE Asian countries ruled by rather autocratic governments, but at the end of the day, if SE Asia decides to remain closed for another 6 months or whatever, until they declare the last of the "virus" cases gone, they'll have to stay closed forever.

 

We've had devastating flu epidemics, we've gone through ebola, SARS, swine flu and several other pandemics, none of which ever involved anything as draconian as a co-ordinated worldwide shutdown of businesses and borders, which goes on for months and months and could drag on indefinitely. This is totally unprecedented. And the flu is with us every year. Why is this covid thing being blown out of proportion, it can only be because this is some kind of deliberate reset, whereby the global economic structure is being changed for a different future to the one we've known before. As they say a "new normal".

 

SE Asia can do what it wants, but I feel that if they continue with the current shenanigans of opening at their glacial pace, despite very few infections compared to European countries, their economies will collapse and investors will pull out. And forget about any tourist willing to do quarantines or submit for testing, tracking or whatever. Especially come October, when Europe will be entirely open without any such requirements. Tourists will simply gravitate to countries where they feel welcome and aren't burdened with restrictions that are more suited to a prison camp than a touristic or business visit.

[BritTim]

On 6/23/2020 at 3:06 PM, drbeach said:

We've had devastating flu epidemics, we've gone through ebola, SARS, swine flu and several other pandemics, none of which ever involved anything as draconian as a co-ordinated worldwide shutdown of businesses and borders, which goes on for months and months and could drag on indefinitely. This is totally unprecedented. And the flu is with us every year. Why is this covid thing being blown out of proportion, it can only be because this is some kind of deliberate reset, whereby the global economic structure is being changed for a different future to the one we've known before. As they say a "new normal".

The last time there was a comparable epidemic was the flu epidemic of 1918-1920. The world's population at that time was somewhere between 1.5 and 2 billion (compared to 7.8 billion today). The death toll estimates vary from 17 to 50 million. That would be equivalent to 85 to 250 million deaths today considering the difference in population.

 

Ebola was deadly, and draconian methods were used in those places where it took hold. It never became a worldwide epidemic, or you would have seen at least the same level of control we have seen with Covid-19.

 

The eventual death toll from Covid-19 is, as yet, unknown. Many factors will be involved. However, a US toll of over a million is not unlikely, and it will possibly be worse in countries like India and Brazil. Lockdowns cause immense economic damage, and this will indirectly result in premature deaths in the future. However, I consider a decision to kill hundreds of thousands of your own citizens to prevent an economic recession to be the act of a psychopath. And, it is far from clear that allowing this kind of carnage will successfully protect the economy in the long term. Will China allow tour groups to Covid-19 infected countries? What effect will high rates of infections have on consumer confidence in affected countries? There are many unknowns.

[JimGant]

On 6/23/2020 at 3:06 PM, drbeach said:

Why is this covid thing being blown out of proportion, it can only be because this is some kind of deliberate reset, whereby the global economic structure is being changed for a different future to the one we've known before. As they say a "new normal".

Well, your argument was holding water, until you got to the "who shot Kennedy, US Gov't involvment in 9/11, etc" conspiracy theories. Nobody is using corvid19 as an excuse to reshape world order. Yes, maybe corvid 19 isn't as deadly as originally supposed -- and reactions have been overly cautious....A bad thing -- maybe. Understandable -- completely.

Looking today at the resurgence in cases in the Americas -- maybe a bubble over a corona free Asia is the way of the future -- as the only spot in the world to vacation corona virus free. Now, that's an advertising ploy to pursue...

[drbeach]

7 hours ago, JimGant said:

Well, your argument was holding water, until you got to the "who shot Kennedy, US Gov't involvment in 9/11, etc" conspiracy theories. Nobody is using corvid19 as an excuse to reshape world order. Yes, maybe corvid 19 isn't as deadly as originally supposed -- and reactions have been overly cautious....A bad thing -- maybe. Understandable -- completely.

Looking today at the resurgence in cases in the Americas -- maybe a bubble over a corona free Asia is the way of the future -- as the only spot in the world to vacation corona virus free. Now, that's an advertising ploy to pursue...

Well you are ignorant aren't you? And umm, Kennedy, 911? Please do stay on topic. You're making yourself look rather foolish.

 

Yes they are. International travel may never be the same again; look at all the new requirements to get on a plane they're proposing. https://www.forbes.com/sites/ceciliarodriguez/2020/05/10/future-air-travel-four-hour-process-immunity-passes/#4e3b5d4772da

 

Large multinationals buying up SMEs for cents to the dollar. If you think this will all go away in 6 months as if nothing happened, you'll receive a rude wake up call quite soon.

 

The world will NEVER be the same again and this is proof that something is going on behind the scenes.

[Rimmer]

Off topic post and replies removed

[JackedUpAndgoodToGo]

I was just at Mae Sai and Chaen Sen (the river crossing for the casino in Laos). I can tell you that Mae Sai was closed up solid. NO ONE WAS THERE. The border crossing for the casino in Laos in the golden triangle is another story. That gate was open and there were two officers there who took a two hour lunch break (I was waiting and saw them carrying food in after two hours). There was also a military officer in the customs section. But when we asked about crossing they stated that no one was being allowed.  My question to them was this: What are all of you doing here?????? You have the AC cranked up at Thai tax payer expensive, no one is there, the boats are all docked, but there is close to a full complement of border officials. My guess would be that this border is not closed (see Mai Sai all boarded up) to VIP's. Thusly, why you need the military (customs) and immigration. Just a guess.

 

 

[RubbaJohnny]

On 7/3/2020 at 6:42 PM, JackedUpAndgoodToGo said:

I was just at Mae Sai and Chaen Sen (the river crossing for the casino in Laos). I can tell you that Mae Sai was closed up solid. NO ONE WAS THERE. The border crossing for the casino in Laos in the golden triangle is another story. That gate was open and there were two officers there who took a two hour lunch break (I was waiting and saw them carrying food in after two hours). There was also a military officer in the customs section. But when we asked about crossing they stated that no one was being allowed.  My question to them was this: What are all of you doing here?????? You have the AC cranked up at Thai tax payer expensive, no one is there, the boats are all docked, but there is close to a full complement of border officials. My guess would be that this border is not closed (see Mai Sai all boarded up) to VIP's. Thusly, why you need the military (customs) and immigration. Just a guess.

 

 

May be to do with the 5 slain at shoot out escaping from the casino?

https://bangkokherald.com/asia/asean/trigger-happy-laotian-cops-kill-5-chinese-grab-1-3-billion-kip/

[drbeach]

On 7/3/2020 at 6:42 PM, JackedUpAndgoodToGo said:

I was just at Mae Sai and Chaen Sen (the river crossing for the casino in Laos). I can tell you that Mae Sai was closed up solid. NO ONE WAS THERE. The border crossing for the casino in Laos in the golden triangle is another story. That gate was open and there were two officers there who took a two hour lunch break (I was waiting and saw them carrying food in after two hours). There was also a military officer in the customs section. But when we asked about crossing they stated that no one was being allowed.  My question to them was this: What are all of you doing here?????? You have the AC cranked up at Thai tax payer expensive, no one is there, the boats are all docked, but there is close to a full complement of border officials. My guess would be that this border is not closed (see Mai Sai all boarded up) to VIP's. Thusly, why you need the military (customs) and immigration. Just a guess.

 

 

Pretty sure freight is being allowed through the second Mae Sai bridge. Obviously the first one is closed, as it's only for passengers and private vehicles.

[audaciousnomad]

On 7/10/2020 at 6:03 PM, drbeach said:

Pretty sure freight is being allowed through the second Mae Sai bridge. Obviously the first one is closed, as it's only for passengers and private vehicles.

You are correct. A Thai website (use google chrome to translate) has confirmed that some border checkpoints restrictions have been eased to allow trade to resume.  No 3rd country passports allowed to exit/enter yet, so effectively no visa running for foreigners that are not from the region.
https://www.prachachat.net/local-economy/news-498456

Edited July 30, 2020 by audaciousnomad

[peter0106]

I am sure it is a no.  Can you go to a land border, and get a stamp out and in, if you have a friend on the other side.  Ie my friend is in Myanmar, can I pass my passport through and get it stamped back in?  Is there any way to pay for a service like this, when you are there in person?  A long shot I know, but wanted to ask.

[ubonjoe]

10 minutes ago, peter0106 said:

I am sure it is a no.  Can you go to a land border, and get a stamp out and in, if you have a friend on the other side.  Ie my friend is in Myanmar, can I pass my passport through and get it stamped back in?  Is there any way to pay for a service like this, when you are there in person?  A long shot I know, but wanted to ask.

That certainly would not be possible.

[poloshirt]

Please don't go to Hatyai and think you could go to Malaysia from there. I went to Hatyai from Bangkok on the 22 july 2020, thinking I could go to Malaysia . In Hatyai I found  (1) no train go to Pedang besar (2) No taxi wants to take you there, the drivers said, "the border no open". (3) Air Asia said no flight to Penang from Hatyai and don't know when they will have flights.

I wasted my money for the train fare from Bangkok to Hatyai and stayed in Hatyai for a week hoping anytime the border would open. Hatyai is so boring. Women? I lost interest in women when I have problem crossing the border, totally lost interest in any of those 2 ladies soap bath or whatever they called it. I got back to Bangkok to a more normal life. Just don't go to Hatyai because the border is not open. Don't waste your money like I did.

 

[Okis]

1 hour ago, poloshirt said:

Please don't go to Hatyai and think you could go to Malaysia from there. I went to Hatyai from Bangkok on the 22 july 2020, thinking I could go to Malaysia . In Hatyai I found  (1) no train go to Pedang besar (2) No taxi wants to take you there, the drivers said, "the border no open". (3) Air Asia said no flight to Penang from Hatyai and don't know when they will have flights.

I wasted my money for the train fare from Bangkok to Hatyai and stayed in Hatyai for a week hoping anytime the border would open. Hatyai is so boring. Women? I lost interest in women when I have problem crossing the border, totally lost interest in any of those 2 ladies soap bath or whatever they called it. I got back to Bangkok to a more normal life. Just don't go to Hatyai because the border is not open. Don't waste your money like I did.

 

Why on earth would you randomly try and cross a border in the current situation? 

[david555]

3 hours ago, peter0106 said:

I am sure it is a no.  Can you go to a land border, and get a stamp out and in, if you have a friend on the other side.  Ie my friend is in Myanmar, can I pass my passport through and get it stamped back in?  Is there any way to pay for a service like this, when you are there in person?  A long shot I know, but wanted to ask.

I think any Th.I.O.  would look at that stamp twice later , and ask how you could manage to get it , with borders closed and stamp dated …..

[poloshirt]

6 hours ago, Okis said:

Why on earth would you randomly try and cross a border in the current situation? 

I was desperate because I worry my money run out . I hope by early September they open the border.

[Bruntoid]

Has a date been announced for land borders to open for border runs ? 
 

Presumably before Sep 26th if I’ve missed it ?