Police suspect murder in hanging death of retired Dutch teacher

[webfact]

Police suspect murder in hanging death of retired Dutch teacher

 

Picture: Daily News

 

Daily News reported that a retired Dutch teacher found hanged from a chicken coop next to a luxury house in Kamphaeng Phet in northern Thailand might have been murdered. 

 

Sixty one year old Herb Elmes (name transliterated from Thai) was found hanging outside a house that he shared with his 40 year old wife Cha-orn Elmes and her younger brother Precha Jaidee, 38.

 

He was hanging from a nylon cord. Both his hands were secured with cable ties and there was evidence of bruising from injuries to the right side of his rib cage. 

 

Lt Col Yuthana Phuksuk of the Klong Khlung police and rescue services were called to the house in Ban Sap Manao in Wang Sai sub-district. 

 

They determined that Herb had been dead for several hours. After the body was examined locally it was sent to Naret Phitsanuloke for a more detailed autopsy. 

 

Precha gave evidence that the couple had been married for two years. Four days ago they had argued and his sister had gone to Bangkok and not returned. He said that despite living in the same house he had little to do with Herb who kept himself to himself. 

 

It emerged that relatives of the deceased had been contacted by email and had been told that Herb wanted to kill himself as he could not contact his wife.

 

The relatives contacted their embassy services who contacted the Thais. Through a Wang Sai official the local Phu Yai Ban was contacted and he went to the house to investigate. When he arrived the people there did not know where Herb was and the air-con was on in his bedroom. 

 

A search outside by the chicken coop found him hanging there. 

 

Police want to interview the wife and all concerned and have not ruled out murder in the case. They think this may have been a case of murder with a staged hanging to conceal the crime.

 

Thai Rath further reported that the couple lived separate lives in the same two story house. They had separate bedrooms and other separate areas and kept themselves to themselves. 

 

They said that Herb was a kindly guy who like to teach the locals language and making robots.

 

Source: Daily News | Thai Rath

 

-- © Copyright Thai Visa News 2019-05-28

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[Kadilo]

Unlikely suicide I would of thought if his hands were cable tied first. Added to that bruising on his body. Poor guy.


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[Happy Grumpy]

8 minutes ago, webfact said:

found hanged from a chicken coop next to a luxury house

Wow. I wonder what happened. ????

[RotBenz8888]

22 minutes ago, webfact said:

that the couple lived separate lives in the same two story house. They had separate bedrooms and other separate areas and kept themselves to themselves.

Not sustainable to live like that in the long term, someone had to go....

[AGareth2]

suspicous

[soalbundy]

staged suicide ? if he was murdered one would have thought that the perpetrators would have untied his hands after his death.

[sweatalot]

2 hours ago, soalbundy said:

staged suicide ? if he was murdered one would have thought that the perpetrators would have untied his hands after his death.

yes for sure - if they were intelligent enough

[paulbrow]

I'm not an expert, but it seems to me that it would be very difficult to: 1) tie your own hands behind your back, and 2) then hang yourself.... just saying...

[stevenl]

11 minutes ago, paulbrow said:

I'm not an expert, but it seems to me that it would be very difficult to: 1) tie your own hands behind your back, and 2) then hang yourself.... just saying...

Neither am I an expert, but: hang a rope around your neck, connect the cable tie behind your back, tighten the cable tie (lots of excess plastic so easily doable, kick away or jump from the chair you're standing on, and you're hanging there with no way to get back on.

[Sonhia]

How will he, yet another murdered farang, pay for being killed? Will a Thai pay!!!

 

This is how it is, in money greedy Violentland. .

 

RIP

 

 

 

 

[Baerboxer]

23 minutes ago, stevenl said:

Neither am I an expert, but: hang a rope around your neck, connect the cable tie behind your back, tighten the cable tie (lots of excess plastic so easily doable, kick away or jump from the chair you're standing on, and you're hanging there with no way to get back on.

 

Indeed. I remember reading a long time ago that many suicides by hanging involved securing the hands. Apparently, if not, instinct kicks in and the struggle for life such that many would-be suicides would prevent their own hanging attempt.

 

However reading all the circumstances here, separate lives after 2 years of marriage, younger "brother" living-in; wife away; bruising to ribs - hmmm, Seems the police are right to be suspicious.

[Crash999]

50 minutes ago, paulbrow said:

I'm not an expert, but it seems to me that it would be very difficult to: 1) tie your own hands behind your back, and 2) then hang yourself.... just saying...

Happens a fair amount if you google it. Provided you don’t have a big gut you tie your hands in front of you and then step over one leg after the other. 

[malcoml]

5 hours ago, Happy Grumpy said:

Wow. I wonder what happened. ????

The same that happens to a lot of guys. They all got on cheap Thai whiskey, he likely asked them to keep the noise down, then one decided it was time for him to go.

 

stay at home guys! If you want the company of a girl get a hooker, there are plenty in every village.

[from the home of CC]

37 minutes ago, stevenl said:

Neither am I an expert, but: hang a rope around your neck, connect the cable tie behind your back, tighten the cable tie (lots of excess plastic so easily doable, kick away or jump from the chair you're standing on, and you're hanging there with no way to get back on.

it definitely would negate any second thoughts.. 

[madmen]

4 hours ago, RotBenz8888 said:

Not sustainable to live like that in the long term, someone had to go....

I was just about to post that. I would guess most couples end up that way after the honeymoon period after the excitement of building a house and pick ups all around

 

RIP

[dotpoom]

5 hours ago, Kadilo said:

Unlikely suicide I would of thought if his hands were cable tied first. Added to that bruising on his body. Poor guy.


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It would depend if they were tied in front or behind.

  Either way, a very tragic story. Sometimes, now that I am at the doorstep of my 70th birthday, I look back over my life and all the things I wished had gone differently and can get a bit remorseful....then I read a story like this and it fairly quickly brings me back down to earth.

  No matter how we appear to others on the outside...a lot of folk in general can be a lot worse off than ourselves ...despite appearances.

  May this poor man RIP and may his family muster up the strength to cope with this tragedy.

[BritManToo]

I'd be investigating her 'younger brother'.

[Katipo]

Poor guy. But at least they haven't tried to sweep this one under the table. So there is a chance his family and friends can get some justice, and some closure ????

[davidst01]

55 minutes ago, malcoml said:

The same that happens to a lot of guys. They all got on cheap Thai whiskey, he likely asked them to keep the noise down, then one decided it was time for him to go.

 

stay at home guys! If you want the company of a girl get a hooker, there are plenty in every village.

ha ha and you can still end up with the same fate

[outsider]

6 hours ago, webfact said:

the couple lived separate lives in the same two story house. They had separate bedrooms and other separate areas and kept themselves to themselves. 

 

After two years of marriage? Or perhaps the couple have been seeing each other for longer, which can explain them being bored of each other but, in that case, why get married? Not saying this has anything to do with the suicide/murder - it's just an interesting observation about the relationship.

 

[phantomfiddler]

My money would be on the "brother" being her Thai husband, and obviously a murder, come on !

[atyclb]

3 hours ago, sweatalot said:

5 hours ago, soalbundy said:

staged suicide ? if he was murdered one would have thought that the perpetrators would have untied his hands after his death.

yes for sure - if they were intelligent enough

 

 

"if they were intelligent enough"

 

u hit the nail right on the head

[Dogmatix]

It should be relatively easy for competent forensic pathologists to establish whether it was suicide or not but Mr Precha should definitely be a person of interest. 

 

Sounds like he got himself into a pretty horrible situation.  Must have met a not so young bar girl in Bangkok somewhere and went to live with her in the sticks, probably putting a chunk of his retired teacher life savings into a 'luxury house' in the village into which she invites her wastrel elder brother to come and live off the largesse of the farang she netted for the family. At some point in the two years, probably quite early on, the relationship unsurprisingly goes sour and they live separate existences in the house but she constantly demands money from the Dutchman who is totally isolated in the poor village but has no funds to up sticks and start again somewhere else. He might even have still felt some type of romantic attachment to her, never having understood that that there was never any reciprocation from her side, and was possibly reluctant to leave, even if he had the money.  Then they have a bigger bust up than normal and she says she is going back to Bangkok to work the bars again.  Poor guy.  RIP.

[RobbyXNorway]

Same old story ????

 

I would say the "younger brother" is the biggest suspect, but probably not the mastermind of the incident.

 

R.I.P.

[NightSky]

why is the uniformed man in the photo laughing at the murder scene?

[Kadilo]

12 minutes ago, Dogmatix said:

It should be relatively easy for competent forensic pathologists to establish whether it was suicide or not but Mr Precha should definitely be a person of interest. 

 

Sounds like he got himself into a pretty horrible situation.  Must have met a not so young bar girl in Bangkok somewhere and went to live with her in the sticks, probably putting a chunk of his retired teacher life savings into a 'luxury house' in the village into which she invites her wastrel elder brother to come and live off the largesse of the farang she netted for the family. At some point in the two years, probably quite early on, the relationship unsurprisingly goes sour and they live separate existences in the house but she constantly demands money from the Dutchman who is totally isolated in the poor village but has no funds to up sticks and start again somewhere else. He might even have still felt some type of romantic attachment to her, never having understood that that there was never any reciprocation from her side, and was possibly reluctant to leave, even if he had the money.  Then they have a bigger bust up than normal and she says she is going back to Bangkok to work the bars again.  Poor guy.  RIP.

https://images.app.goo.gl/JdncA2AtELE4gvSo7

[fforest1]

Well if the police are investigating then it is most likely a real suicide...

 

Over the years a massive number of farang deaths have screamed for a closer look but were given a 5 minute investigation and laughably called a suicide...

[Dogmatix]

6 minutes ago, phantomfiddler said:

My money would be on the "brother" being her Thai husband, and obviously a murder, come on !

Once knew a Thai girl who married a German and went to live in Germany and worked as a waitress in a Thai restaurant.  After a year or two she admitted she had a daughter from a Thai husband and asked if the daughter could come and live with them. Despite the dishonesty involved, the German guy generously agrees and adopts the daughter he only just found out about and puts her into a German school. A year or so after that she asked if her brother could come and stay with them for three months which was easy in those pre-Schengen days because Thailand and Germany had a reciprocal agreement allowing three months visa free stays.  The brother comes over and starts working without work permit as a cook in the same restaurant as the girl.  Needless to say, of course, the brother is really the husband and the father of the daughter who has been adopted by the German guy. For several months the Thai family is happily reunited under the roof of the unknowing German guy.  Since he works during the day, and the restaurant is only open for dinner, the real married couple are able to enjoy their conjugal rights during the day time, while the German hubby takes the late shift.  All comes to an end one day when the Polizei arrive at the door and bundle the Thai husband off to Frankfurt airport and put him on the next THAI flight to Bangkok without even letting him pack a bag for overstaying and working illegally.  They also blacklist him.  Soon afterwards the German guy was admitted to a mental hospital and institutionalised for life. I guess the pfennig had finally dropped and it was too much for his brain to handle. 

 

When I met her, soon after her husband had been consigned to the loony bin, she talked quite openly about this as if it was just something she had to do for her family while she had the opportunity.  She said her German husband was a good man but she had no feelings for him at all from the beginning.  Guys who come to Thailand on the rebound from broken marriages at home, should beware that bar girls are more likely than not to be like this and they can be reasonably convincing actresses.  

[xtrnuno41]

6 hours ago, soalbundy said:

staged suicide ? if he was murdered one would have thought that the perpetrators would have untied his hands after his death.

No , they got it from news. In BK sometime ago there was also a guy hanging with his hands tight and plastic bag over his head.

The concluded: suicide . 55555555555555555555

[khunpa]

35 minutes ago, outsider said:

 

After two years of marriage? Or perhaps the couple have been seeing each other for longer, which can explain them being bored of each other but, in that case, why get married? Not saying this has anything to do with the suicide/murder - it's just an interesting observation about the relationship.

 

 

I knew a couple Here in Thailand who lived the same way. He was over 60 and she was 30 years younger.

 

My wife often talked with the woman, who was bored to death about the relationship, but seemed very interested in his house.

 

Heard he signed over the house to her not long ago. So guess she is now happy and just waiting for a heart attack ????

 

Its amazing how some couples live.