Buriram becomes first Thai province to penalize refusal for COVID-19 vaccine

[sungod]

30 minutes ago, Nanaplaza666 said:

If you are confused about that then you might not be the smartest bulb of the lot . Having the chance to choose for your vaccine and willingly taking it is something different then being forced to take whatever !@#$ they put inside you .

You could always pop off to your own place where there may be more choice if you are not happy with whats available here.

[Kwaibill]

7 minutes ago, TheFreqFlyer said:

Sorry but you are completely incorrect.

 

Personal and religious exemptions can be legally used in most states for school children. 

 

There are NO federal vaccination requirements. For green card applicants, you can absolutely use a personal or religious waiver to get out of the requirement. 

I don't know how you have detemined that "exemptions" is the same as " no requirements".

You are 100% incorrect.

"Chapter 9 - Vaccination Requirement | USCIS" https://www.uscis.gov/policy-manual/volume-8-part-b-chapter-9

 

I will not go through the many cases proving there are many legal requirements for vaccinations, religious "exemptions" not withstanding.

One example I used, and again "exemptions" do not obviate requirements:

"Yellow Fever Vaccine | Passport Health Travel Clinics" https://www.passporthealthusa.com/vaccinations/yellow-fever/

[Nanaplaza666]

14 minutes ago, Kwaibill said:

Total Tucker Carlson BS, entirely untrue.

Cite your "sources".

Here is one of mine:

"No, The Death Rate For Vaccinated People Is Not Higher Than That Of Unvaccinated People - capradio.org" https://www.capradio.org/articles/2021/05/10/no-the-death-rate-for-vaccinated-people-is-not-higher-than-that-of-unvaccinated-people/?__cf_chl_jschl_tk__=fd40dbfaacffbd032ebffc447630aecdb38a0bb4-1621055380-0-AWhkdLy56YKtED-EXsF8dIp47h7gPgoEtj_WGDld6XWsGseM1d-36_-VwkDD0j4562fU9yL5fNNstqum5DsFPgceXAhsPNfS0oOXaVEWfQlgh95Boo9uNJ8ImIroIYesQWffqHkZYv5gNoe3f3iTdi2H2Wz6uBK3THr7coC3E2dBmpTtYRqzvEJ1n8k6xFLL74_3YGx-cOh0AYWCv0dGTkS7v_l2n2r9dbTRBWCyuBskuGj0FlPI_CP_XSop1MEFClH3TQXbAyMbMSWgxPFyvR43e_fL6gOkxbVIqgkiqqIdGWsVoTPpl1TwA3xsDZmKrmFiIPZyFv_YdeKcBSW_c0kSwFHqVmT8vgDWCe2hZG51tZSSofyClQ8dfSM2uM4WFVYwOOyQOSZfw8N9HhwZ9A7JoBZdRqNpX-ViEJrEgX2y755M327U1utCrvoVEJ5xRcYXr2z1RjabP8XKiZ9QmkRo1nrWjV36DxO54H8iy27BOhI_ufdlv6geO2lu-g1TQ8kY5uYpNcmMqnO0O7oy2vAO3_HOcLwjTAW_Cw4FE8Z6cSvBT2Z5ctQNp22vJFpfHZtlp55AMwDz5qw2Hd6mbOMxOm8UFztlLvrpqqjo8j-z

I am talking about dying from the vaccine not the deathrate of vaccinated or unvaccinated . And the source of my quote is the CDC , maybe you've heard of them . 

[zhounan]

What right do they have to impose experimental treatments?

 

Thais have literally lost their minds.
 

I hope that Mr. Thatchakorn Hatthathayakul will take criminal responsibility for what he says and does, and not avail himself of any "criminal shield".

Edited May 15, 2021 by zhounan

[Rimmer]

Some off topic bickering and baiting also troll posts removed

[Nanaplaza666]

Just now, Andrew Dwyer said:

What ? and risk a ban ????

555555

[Bradmeister]

Let's see....hmmmm What do we have in Buriram thats so terribly important that the governor is threatening incarceration..... 

 

 A worldclass GP race track, a Popular Soccer Club, or would it be the Mechnized Army Bases? 

 

Yes, it may be he does not want a repeat

of last year (maybe the year before) where small arms went missing and people began liberating themselves....and doing some killing.

 

It may behoove the Ministry of Defense and of the Interior to start innoculations on all military bases. 

 

THE 9 DASH LINE IS LESS THAN 1000 Nautical MILES AWAY..... last thing we need is for our military to be weakened and our boarders wide open for an invasion.  

[sawadee1947]

16 hours ago, ThailandRyan said:

Insanity and utterly ridiculous when vaccines are not available for all people who may need them.  Sorry sir you get to go to jail because you did not sign up to be vaccinated and you broke the law 

But your honor I tried and no one would help me Said the 70 year old blind man.  To bad said the judge, its off to Klong Prem prison you go......

APPLY doesn't mean you'll get the jab NOW

[cjinchiangrai]

6 minutes ago, Nanaplaza666 said:

I am in my own place i live here ever thought of that sungod . 

On a non-resident visa. That means you are free to leave at any time, including after you fail to produce vaccination documents for your extension. No rights violated, no problem.

[holy cow cm]

This is not just an issue of parents to their kids making them eat their vegetables for their own good, this is an issue of Human Rights abuse. Thai are not little marching commie ducks and they have no right to force anyone. Anutin and his piddly little governor have steed way way over the line. If it comes to CM me and the family will tell them to <deleted> off. We will choose what vaccine we want, not them! an d it will not be some inferior Chinese vaccine from a country where the virus was born!

[Danderman123]

2 hours ago, 248900_1469958220 said:

Absolutely. I would like to know if I have HAD Covid. I suspect I may have last year. Anyone know where you can get reliable antibody tests done? Again, I ask the same question: What if you have had it already and recovered? 

Antibodies don't last very long. 

[BritManToo]

17 hours ago, holy cow cm said:

This is not just an issue of parents to their kids making them eat their vegetables for their own good, this is an issue of Human Rights abuse. Thai are not little marching commie ducks and they have no right to force anyone. Anutin and his piddly little governor have steed way way over the line. If it comes to CM me and the family will tell them to <deleted> off. We will choose what vaccine we want, not them! an d it will not be some inferior Chinese vaccine from a country where the virus was born!

If it comes to CM I'll do what I always do, agree to everything then prevaricate until they get tired of chasing me up.

Worst case scenario, I try and bribe the nurse holding the needle to inject the bin and not my arm.

But I doubt it would ever get that far.

[TheFreqFlyer]

10 minutes ago, cjinchiangrai said:

On a non-resident visa. That means you are free to leave at any time, including after you fail to produce vaccination documents for your extension. No rights violated, no problem.

That's what I've been saying and happy to do, if it ever comes to that, especially since Thailand seems to be turning more into a totalitarian police state by the day. I have a business in Myanmar but fat chance of being able to go there anytime soon and with the political violence in that country I can probably kiss that goodbye.

 

It doesn't look like the good old days will ever come back. At least not in authoritarian SE Asia. 

 

Countries like Australia and America are looking mighty fine right now (relatively speaking, at least). I'll always have the memories of my travels, both for business and pleasure, in this part of the world. It was a nice ride but the time has come to consider moving on. I just don't see a positive future for Thailand (or it's neighboring countries, such as Cambodia or Myanmar). 

[BritManToo]

Just now, Danderman123 said:

Antibodies don't last very long. 

You seem to be going against traditional science.

I've had mumps, measles, chicken pox, COVID all once but never a second time.

So far my disease antibodies seem to have lasted me a life time.

[zhounan]

So, after the healthy stickers on National ID card, now mandatory vaccination for all the residents.

 

My compliment to Mr. Thatchakorn Hattathayakul and his dictatorial, anti-scientific, anti-rational and discriminatory behaviour. These kind of people must be removed from all public office.

[dave moir]

The voluntary consent of the human subject is absolutely essential. This means that the person involved should have legal capacity to give consent; should be so situated as to be able to exercise free power of choice, without the intervention of any element of force, fraud, deceit, duress, overreaching, or other ulterior form of constraint or coercion; and should have sufficient knowledge and comprehension of the elements of the subject matter involved

as to enable him to make an understanding and enlightened decision. This latter element requires that before the acceptance of an affirmative decision by the experimental subject there should be made known to him the nature,

[Bkk Brian]

39 minutes ago, sungod said:

You could always pop off to your own place where there may be more choice if you are not happy with whats available here.

Ah the easy fall back to any challenge, pop back to your own country, no reasonable debate available.

 

Where does a Thai go?

[chiman]

The news coming out of the Seychelles is quite concerning.  They used Sinovac for the younger and AZ for the older parts of their population, opened back up to tourist and are having COVID outbreaks. 

 

Compare this to countries that used Moderna and Pfizer 

[Bkk Brian]

11 minutes ago, Danderman123 said:

Antibodies don't last very long. 

For those who recover from COVID-19, immunity to the virus can last at least 8 months and maybe longer, research shows.

https://www.healthline.com/health-news/how-long-does-immunity-last-after-covid-19-what-we-know

[TheFreqFlyer]

34 minutes ago, Kwaibill said:

I don't know how you have detemined that "exemptions" is the same as " no requirements".

You are 100% incorrect.

"Chapter 9 - Vaccination Requirement | USCIS" https://www.uscis.gov/policy-manual/volume-8-part-b-chapter-9

 

I will not go through the many cases proving there are many legal requirements for vaccinations, religious "exemptions" not withstanding.

One example I used, and again "exemptions" do not obviate requirements:

"Yellow Fever Vaccine | Passport Health Travel Clinics" https://www.passporthealthusa.com/vaccinations/yellow-fever/

You still don't get it. These are not so much requirements (law) as orders. As I said, being the USA there are a myriad of ways of getting out of it. There is no universal, Communist style vaccination policy that applies in that country. A couple of states have even tried to remove the school vaccine mandate altogether. North Dakota being one I believe. 

 

And please spare me the whataboutism. Yellow fever is NOT mandated or even recommended in the USA at any level, not even if you return from a country with endemic yellow fever status. You might be asked for a yellow fever certificate for entering Ghana or Nigeria (or pay US$150 to get out of it) but it will NOT be requested upon returning home. No vaccines are required to enter the USA just as there is no current requirement to quarantine.

 

Although the USA has been moving more towards socialism and authoritarianism in recent decades, it still has fundamental freedoms in place that countries like Thailand can only dream of. 

[soalbundy]

I showed this to my wife, she just laughed, ''This is Isan, it won't happen'' was her response.

[ThailandRyan]

7 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

You seem to be going against traditional science.

I've had mumps, measles, chicken pox, COVID all once but never a second time.

So far my disease antibodies seem to have lasted me a life time.

+1 what @BritManToo says.  I was just at the hospital for an endocrinology and gastroenterology appointment, They checked everything and were surprised to see I had Hep B antibodies and did not need a booster after 10 years.  I was vaccinated for Hep B 20 years ago, had a booster 10 years ago, but no need for one now.  Antibodies if one had Covid already will still be shown in your system, whether or not they are at levels which may assist is another item.  No one knows what the amount of antibodies needed is to fend of a Covid infection.  All new territory.

[smedly]

I suggest everyone do a search and see what an official in Brazil said about the Chinese Sinovac Vaccine 

 

it sums it up nicely 

[TheFreqFlyer]

3 minutes ago, dave moir said:

The voluntary consent of the human subject is absolutely essential. This means that the person involved should have legal capacity to give consent; should be so situated as to be able to exercise free power of choice, without the intervention of any element of force, fraud, deceit, duress, overreaching, or other ulterior form of constraint or coercion; and should have sufficient knowledge and comprehension of the elements of the subject matter involved

as to enable him to make an understanding and enlightened decision. This latter element requires that before the acceptance of an affirmative decision by the experimental subject there should be made known to him the nature,

Exactly. Which is a problem in a country like Thailand with it's large undereducated underclasses. This is not an insult but a statement of fact. The working classes, which make up the majority of the population of the province of Buri Ram, simply don't have the capacity to make an informed decision on vaccination. Sure, some individuals do have this capability, but most don't. That said, those individuals who have heard of severe side effects after vaccination are in my opinion informed enough to decide for themselves whether they want to take the risk. They should also have this right granted by law. 

 

Problem is, in a country like Thailand where governors and the national government in general rule with fear and intimidation, rather than reward, fearful local villagers may cave to these demands and suffer serious consequences and the government can get away with it. 

 

Unfortunately, most Thais, especially the working classes, have zero awareness of their rights and even fewer are likely to sue (or even be aware of that possibility). 

[TheFreqFlyer]

4 minutes ago, cjinchiangrai said:

Not too bright posting on a public forum that you intend to do something illegal.

 

It's not illegal. This is Thailand. Everything is illegal except money talks. 

[dave moir]

1 minute ago, TheFreqFlyer said:

Exactly. Which is a problem in a country like Thailand with it's large undereducated underclasses. This is not an insult but a statement of fact. The working classes, which make up the majority of the population of the province of Buri Ram, simply don't have the capacity to make an informed decision on vaccination. Sure, some individuals do have this capability, but most don't. That said, those individuals who have heard of severe side effects after vaccination are in my opinion informed enough to decide for themselves whether they want to take the risk. They should also have this right granted by law. 

 

Problem is, in a country like Thailand where governors and the national government in general rule with fear and intimidation, rather than reward, fearful local villagers may cave to these demands and suffer serious consequences and the government can get away with it. 

 

Unfortunately, most Thais, especially the working classes, have zero awareness of their rights and even fewer are likely to sue (or even be aware of that possibility). 

At the end of the day everyone educated or uneducated has a right to decide whether or not they want the so called vaccine!

[TheFreqFlyer]

7 minutes ago, dave moir said:

At the end of the day everyone educated or uneducated has a right to decide whether or not they want the so called vaccine!

Absolutely. Just that the uneducated are put in an even more precarious position since informed consent isn't given. 

[PolarAttack]

Any chance Uncle Nivan is behind this push?  Then he can bring back Moto GP later this year. 

[terryofcrete]

17 hours ago, ryane66 said:

They don't need to fine or punish. Offer incentives. Maybe free lottery tickets.

To insist that anyone must not refuse the Chinese vaccine is terribly unfair as it is  unsafe and not efficient. … nonsense ? … lots of online evidence of post vaccine deaths and serious illness … It’s the main vaccine being offered in Thailand .. for political and economic reasons as life isn’t as important as kudos and profit in some countries … 

If it was announced that the Chinese Vaccine was now available by any developed country there would be a national day of laughter and jokes declared . 

[Boomer6969]

22 minutes ago, TheFreqFlyer said:

That said, those individuals who have heard of severe side effects after vaccination are in my opinion informed enough to decide for themselves whether they want to take the risk. They should also have this right granted by law. 

This sounds a bit like my Grandad and my Dad claiming the right to decide for themselves to fight the germans or not.

 

This is a war against Covid and from an epidemiological point of view it makes perfect sense to make the vaccination mandatory. And more so in a country that has limited health care resources. I agree though that for softened  millennials and some of their elders this could suck from a human rights point of view. 

 

On a personal note, I live in Buriram and my beloved wife got me an appointment at 10am on the May 31st. Doubt I'll get the shot, but I'll keep you posted.

Edited May 15, 2021 by Boomer6969