Digital nomads to be allowed to work in Thailand without needing a work permit

[Dart12]

Sure, but have they made it legal to  flog the public Youtubers?  That would make my day.

[rozand]

7 hours ago, ThailandRyan said:

Most digital nomads I know are either high-school or college dropouts who are self taught coders and system builders. They started out making their own computers, designing games and web pages.  So none of them would qualify even though they make more than the needed income stream.

they would have intellectual copyrights

[connda]

Digital nomads to be allowed to work in Thailand without needing a work permit

 

7 hours ago, webfact said:

New proposals from the Tourism Authority of Thailand (TAT) would allow so-called digital nomads to legally work and stay in Thailand, without needing a work permit.

There are huge differences between
"Digital nomads to be allowed to work in Thailand without needing a work permit" and
"New proposals... would allow so-called digital nomads to legally work and stay in Thailand, without needing a work permit."

[wwest5829]

7 hours ago, DLock said:

What we have here is a clear lack of understanding of what a digital nomad is, and why they chose to work from Thailand in the first place.

 

Good thinking, but as most things in Thailand...poorly executed.

You know, while I do not blame Thailand for reaching for those who are wealthy, I have a hard time imagining these proposals will be appealing to those who could afford the requirements and have any international living knowledge. Seems to me, the “sweet spot” is in attracting the larger pool of retirees having the ability to sustain at least a million baht a year to be brought into the country. And a nod of recognition might be given to those who are supporting Thai families (perhaps no more foolishness of 90 day reports and equal pricing as Thai full-time residents).

[malibukid]

58 minutes ago, Stubby said:

So, what you're saying is that poorly educated, low income earners are riffraff? Most people who have low earning potential tend to be less fortunate rather than lazy and or stupid, don't you think?

But I've come across plenty of educated unemployable a-holes in my time…

there called attorneys 

[n00dle]

6 hours ago, Hyna said:

Some are just misfits with a laptop.

Once they run into financial or health problems they realize there is no safety net. (In the third world,  family is the safety net.)

They come crying home to mommy.

Don't many TV members think their embassy should vaccinate them? 

 

 

what does someone who worked as a dive master have to do with digital nomads?

 

[n00dle]

6 minutes ago, wwest5829 said:

You know, while I do not blame Thailand for reaching for those who are wealthy, I have a hard time imagining these proposals will be appealing to those who could afford the requirements and have any international living knowledge. Seems to me, the “sweet spot” is in attracting the larger pool of retirees having the ability to sustain at least a million baht a year to be brought into the country. And a nod of recognition might be given to those who are supporting Thai families (perhaps no more foolishness of 90 day reports and equal pricing as Thai full-time residents).

 

but enough about me, lets talk about you.

[bipper]

The think tank after the Harvard educated.....must have watched The Social Network too.

[capriole]

2 hours ago, SymS said:

I'm not sure they understand who "digital nomads" are... Most of them are self-employed, and not working for publicly listed companies with 50m+ USD in income...

 

Most likely they are confusing digital nomads with telecommuters hence the listed companies etc. Many companies have changed their policies in the last couple of year due to Covid and started allowing employess working remotely. My company is one of them where they closed down the local office and switched my contract to a telecommuter from office based employee. That changes allows me to work from wherever I want for prolonged periods of time as all I will require is a decent internet connection and my laptop plus a couple of monitors to make things easier.    

[andyman57]

Good job other countries don't apply the same rules for Thais working abroad

[DirtyFarang]

I know plenty of "digital nomads" here.  What a bunch of nonsense.  None of them would have anything to do with this program.  They work from home, work for international concerns, use VPN's and are undetectable.  Actually, they work from wherever they wish -- maybe on a bus, on the beach or poolside.  

 

What a bunch of wishful horsepucky these folks keep coming up with.  it starts out sounding good, but once you get through all the conditions and red tape involved. nobody wit a brain would have any part of it.

 

If they can't come up with something that actually offers something, they should give it up.

[wwest5829]

10 minutes ago, n00dle said:

 

but enough about me, lets talk about you.

Cute

[Advocatus Diaboli]

But let’s wait and see if Thai follows Vietnam and suddenly stops tourist visa, and gives them a month to leave the country. This would cause a bit of grief to the digital nomad community, just like it is in Vietnam. 

[BananaGuy]

First one in will :-

(1) hack the Immigration system, grant him(herself) a 100-year permit and

(2) sell loads of 10-year permits online to whoever.

 

(1) is optional if they're not fussed about visiting LoS ... they can do (2) from wherever home might be right now.

[mlmcleod]

8 hours ago, webfact said:

To qualify for the ‘digital nomad visa’, applicants will need to have a minimum personal income (salary, investment income, etc.) of at least $80,000 per year for the past 2 years or $40,000 per year with a master’s degree or above/intellectual property ownership or have received Series A funding.

 

They will also need 5 years working experience and have health insurance $100,000 or more of medical expenses. 

 

For companies which apply for the scheme, they will need to be listed on the stock exchange of their respective country or have been trading for at least 3 years and have a total income of 50 million US dollars over the past 3 years.

 

If the applicant is able to meet the requirements, the ‘digital nomad’ visa would grant a 10 year stay in Thailand, and give the holder permission to work in Thailand without needing a work permit. 

Digital nomads have been working in Thailand for years without all these requirements.  They specifically and extremely hate bureaucracy of any kind.  I sincerely doubt that the Thai government realizes how much they alienate the very people they want to attract!

I predict less than 10 ever take "advantage" of this visa.

[The Cipher]

1 hour ago, Stubby said:

So, what you're saying is that poorly educated, low income earners are riffraff? Most people who have low earning potential tend to be less fortunate rather than lazy and or stupid, don't you think?

 

Comment was mostly tongue-in-cheek. But on a serious note, $40-80k per year isn't exactly knocking it out of the park.

 

There's a very good case to be made that if a full time worker isn't clearing $40k/yr they might not be the most appropriate candidate for a country to give a 10 year visa to.

 

The only group that I am concerned might be missed, are talented people without much capital who have a good business idea and want to move to Thailand to cut costs while they work on building it out. Might be worth exploring a type of shorter-term visa with less strict requirements to capture folks like that.

 

Edit: Forgot to add, if someone wants to take issue with the policy as currently proposed, the eligibility requirements on the business/employer, and the cutoff income spread between masters and non-masters holders are much more obvious issues than the target income range.

Edited June 7, 2021 by The Cipher

[LivinLOS]

1 hour ago, incnoi said:

At 17% of a minimum of $80k this is a very expensive visa, Digital Nomads would pay $13,600 a year for what exactly?

17% of domestic sourced income.. 0 for non domestic.. 

Some people really have basic reading comprehension issues... 

[LivinLOS]

19 minutes ago, DirtyFarang said:

 

If they can't come up with something that actually offers something, they should give it up.

 

10 year visa, with presumably a path to citizenship because there's tax history.. and the right to own land.. 

What more do you expect ??? For 0 tax on non domestic income ?? 

[ExpatDraco]

4 minutes ago, LivinLOS said:

17% of domestic sourced income.. 0 for non domestic.. 

Some people really have basic reading comprehension issues... 

 

But, if the work is done on Thai soil it's domestic sourced income.

[James105]

1 minute ago, ExpatDraco said:

 

But, if the work is done on Thai soil it's domestic sourced income.

 

It's not that simple.   Supposing I wrote a book here.   I then got it published by a US publishing company.    I receive royalties from book sales which were predominantly in the USA.   Would that be Thai sourced income because I happened to write the book here?  Or would it be US sourced income? 

[AJR3RD]

Digital nomads have been working legally in Thailand for at least 15 years, that I am personally aware of, and likely much longer. There has never been a law restricting the earning of money by persons not working for companies in Thailand. A person who writes songs in Thailand, a person who writes books in Thailand, a person who's sold a screenplay to a Hollywood company while living and writing in Thailand, a person teaches online from in Thailand - I've made money from them ALL, completely legally, completely open. I have never made a DIME from an employer in Thailand without a work permit. So, I don't know what they're talking about, but earning money from outside of Thailand ONLINE has NEVER been an issue, and this is not news.

[jspill]

8 hours ago, ThailandRyan said:

So none of them would qualify even though they make more than the needed income stream.

 

Can probably just pay yourself the required monthly income and show the bank statements and be accepted, doubt it'll need to come from a registered company, they should know nomads are often self employed.

[LivinLOS]

11 minutes ago, ExpatDraco said:

 

But, if the work is done on Thai soil it's domestic sourced income.

 
In the usual sense of taxation law yes.. 

However as it is near impossible to prove in any way what fraction of a persons earnings derive from what amounts and efforts they have made or when they made them, unless the nomad spends 365 days inside Thailand each year it is then back to being impossible to determine 'which' earnings are domestic v non domestic.. Without simply falling back to the logical outcome that they do perhaps mean 'sourced' as stated in this case. 

There is literally no point in the '0% non domestic' clause if thats not what they mean. 

The devils in the implementation details on this one, but I would guess it leans much more the english version of sourced than the legal tax statute version of domestic sourced. 

[LivinLOS]

8 minutes ago, AJR3RD said:

Digital nomads have been working legally in Thailand for at least 15 years, that I am personally aware of, and likely much longer. There has never been a law restricting the earning of money by persons not working for companies in Thailand. A person who writes songs in Thailand, a person who writes books in Thailand, a person who's sold a screenplay to a Hollywood company while living and writing in Thailand, a person teaches online from in Thailand - I've made money from them ALL, completely legally, completely open. I have never made a DIME from an employer in Thailand without a work permit. So, I don't know what they're talking about, but earning money from outside of Thailand ONLINE has NEVER been an issue, and this is not news.

Working while inside Thailand without a work permit is not legal. 

It is however almost impossible to obtain a work permit in the situation you outline and hence it has rarely (not never) been prosecuted. 

Not being enforced is not legality, only a fool confuses the former for the latter.  

[Shocked farang]

8 hours ago, ThailandRyan said:

Most digital nomads I know are either high-school or college dropouts who are self taught coders and system builders. They started out making their own computers, designing games and web pages.  So none of them would qualify even though they make more than the needed income stream.

Good luck trying to explain this to the Thai generals who rule the country now. 

[AJR3RD]

3 minutes ago, LivinLOS said:

Working while inside Thailand without a work permit is not legal. 

It is however almost impossible to obtain a work permit in the situation you outline and hence it has rarely (not never) been prosecuted. 

Not being enforced is not legality, only a fool confuses the former for the latter.  

I'm afraid you are not familiar with the legal definition of "working." I'm a lawyer. I am. You are wrong.

[janetdoe]

Never a good idea for a tourism authority to get involved in something they know knowing about.

[thanaka]

2 hours ago, BestB said:

Last time i checked, data entry does not pay $80 000 neither does SEO or even coding when its contract work

Your average wordpress developer and Yoast configurator will not earn 80'000, yes. A specialised web-, app- or backend developer will earn this money. Professional SEO is extremely expensive because it overlaps with many other aspects like Marketing and Development and takes a lot of time, knowledge and money to build a network and pay for the tools you need to do your job.

 

Your average joe, who at the age of 35 decides to visit a web design workshop and since then buys themes of themeforest to sell finished products to customers, will probably not earn 80k a year. 

Professionals who work in their field of expertise since many years and have established themselves within the industry will earn that money, without a single doubt. Especially on a contract base.

 

Edited June 7, 2021 by thanaka

[Blumpie]

So what?

I'll do what I do and you won't know anything about it.  

[LivinLOS]

14 minutes ago, AJR3RD said:

I'm afraid you are not familiar with the legal definition of "working." I'm a lawyer. I am. You are wrong.

We can both play that game.. 30 year specialist in cross border labour supply, taxation issues, payrolling and the determination of permanent establishment / residency here.. Did 8 million EUR turnover on the topic in 2019 pre covid. 

On this issue, I am not incorrect. ????

Work, outside of the very narrowly specified exceptions, all requires a work permit. That work permit is however not always available. 

 

Edited June 7, 2021 by LivinLOS