How many of you that had bad marriages to Thai women would try again but do things differently if you had a time machine?

[Nojohndoe]

3 hours ago, WhiteBuffaloATM said:

kwasaki: not the grammar police here but seriously, 2 words from your 3 word trip -induced post are misspelled.…..if “ wow” is even a proper word……and no , I am not “weird” just 65 year old conservative educated professional expat father ….who has lived a broad life….. probably I have 40  (or 50) years extra experience on you, judging  y your limited “comment”. wise people have learned to take lessons from older folk not to judge them……

So you got burned but as a "professional expat father" with 40 <50 years soured experience you actually believe it qualifies you to Teach (take lessons from) ?

Since the age of 21 I have been married  3 times with an unmarried intervening 7 year relationship with a much younger woman. The first lasted 19 years and ended due to gross infidelity, Then 7 years unmarried relationship which ended amicably. Next 3 years and ended due to presentation of financial manipulation on behalf of her extended family. That was in the Western arena.

I then spent 5 years in various parts of Asia until I came to Thailand for a look see.

It was then I met my Thai wife of now 20 years duration. Not always pure bliss but genuine.

There is nothing about my experiences I could ever or would ever use to "educate" anyone other than to say "learn to live with your own choices" because work or fail you can not "own" a partner nor they you! If it is not mutual or ceases to be then so is the failure.

[Headgame]

No clue why so many are compelled to get married. Almost zero upside here in TH. And then move to the village and try to build a life. Not going to be easy and not for me. Then the failure to use the word “no” from the get go with family members. I admit I’m an all about me person but I’m at a stage of my life where I tolerate zero <deleted>. Not going to spend precious time trying to smooth over “problems” and experiencing anxiety about relationships. Works for me but making no recommendations.

[zzaa09]

11 minutes ago, Headgame said:

No clue why so many are compelled to get married. Almost zero upside here in TH. And then move to the village and try to build a life. Not going to be easy and not for me. Then the failure to use the word “no” from the get go with family members. I admit I’m an all about me person but I’m at a stage of my life where I tolerate zero <deleted>. Not going to spend precious time trying to smooth over “problems” and experiencing anxiety about relationships. Works for me but making no recommendations.

Sure. Quite understood. 

For some, it can be a game of survival - others, not so much. 

 

Have to keep in mind that every situation will differ from the next. 

[WhiteBuffaloATM]

 

“So you got burned but as a "professional expat father" with 40 <50 years soured experience you actually believe it qualifies you to Teach (take lessons from)”

 

you seem unable to process plain english without drawing absurd conclusions about my life, beliefs and qualifications (which then bizarrely get “ liked” ). you have no clue what you are talking about.

it is precisely because I have always protected myself that I have NOT been “ burned” or “soured” for 50 years …..or any years…. seems you have been though……. being married three times is nothing to publicize either……

[khunPer]

2 hours ago, Jackie Malone said:

Most of these reply posts are male. Here’s a female Ex-Pat perspective.

I’m sure that, among the Expat (farang) males, there are many who treat women as equals -  in intellect, capability, etc.  And, that must mean that Thai women are not treated as chattels, in those cases.

 

However, when I read posts in “ASEAN Now” about Thai women (as wives, girlfriends, etc.), I rarely see respect for women. I see comments about Thai women as manipulative. I have to ask myself where the manipulation originates.

 

Does it start with farangs’ promises of an easier life? What were you thinking? You were truly noble, while securing a guaranteed root and servility? And, all of this, on your pension?

 

You eschewed women from your home country for a reason. They challenged your machismo!

Thanks for you post, it nice to read a woman's reply in this male dominated forum.

 

I see comments about Thai women as manipulative.

 

Probably because many village ladies considers a relationship/marriage with a farang equal to winning a big price in the lottery, wealth coming to both her life and her family, and she might need to be manipulative to get her part of it; Thai women talks, and they talk a lot, so she quickly learns it from other more experienced ladies.

Often a farang man-Thai woman relationship is a win-win situation. Many a mature man still dreams about sexy teens - facts show it when looking at Internet searches - but in his home country it can only be a dream, as it would be embarrassing, especially for the younger girls, if an elder man in his 40s, or even older, looks at very young ladies, if not teens; he might even risk to be considered as pedophile in some countries. The only exemption is if the man is famous, or rich, preferably both, then he's cool when having an extremely young partner...???? 

 

When a middle aged man comes to Thailand the petite women often looks - and also acts - like teens, even they are way up in their 20s. The dream becomes possible as win-win, where the man get his dream fulfilled, and the lady moves up in social status because of a financial better off boyfriend, and hopefully husband. It might not be love, at least from her side, but it might be as I've heard from Thai ladies, "I don't love him, but I can stay with him", meaning that the life with her farang husband is better than whatever life she otherwise can get, as long as he can support her. Others say that "love comes by time, if the man has a good heart", meaning that the man financially can take care of a family, and behave nice; i.e. don't drink (too much), and don't gamble, and don't have too many small giks (side girls), and don't beat his wife.

 

My lovely Thai girlfriend says that a cleaver girl don't take a lot of money fast - i.e. like the gold digger girls - but takes money in small lots over a long time; i,e, she is patient and perhaps manipulative.

 

A Thai lady friend, who recently had finished with her farang husband, because he didn't want to - or could - come up with another 3 million baht for her business, said that "if he cannot provide, why do I need him!"

 

Does it start with farangs’ promises of an easier life? What were you thinking? You were truly noble, while securing a guaranteed root and servility? And, all of this, on your pension?

 

I've met a number of younger single men in the 30s - some of them well off in good career positions - that gave up on Western girls, as "they are too demanding". i.e. the dream-man for a Western lady might be close to the impossible. Reminds me of Marlene Dietrich's statement that "most women start changing a man, and once they have changed him, they no longer like him."

 

I'm originating from a Scandinavian country, where we some years back had a rich man - he made his money from selling cheap charter-holidays to people that otherwise could not afford a holiday in the Mediterranean area - and he spent a lot of his fortune on a harem of young ladies. He lived like many a man would dream about - even many of the men would never dare to live like that for real, but dreaming is Okay - and was very popular, because he paid his income tax from the money he made, and he didn't try to hide his wealth, and he paid the younger ladies well, when he got tired of them. He made a very wise statement, saying that "you cannot buy love for money, but you can buy something that looks exactly like it!"

 

So this is how the win-win situation often works: You buy something that feels exactly like love, and as long as the performance is played well enough to receive an Academic Award, does it matter if it's true love, or the man just live like he is in the 7th Heaven?

 

Having a wife the little more old-fashioned way - meaning the man is the provider for the family - also costs money in Farang-world. Having a wife in more modern way where "we share", and the relationship goes south, can be extremely expensive for the man. So in fact, having a little bit "manipulative" Thai partner is often "same-same but different".

 

For many Thai ladies - a number, if not many, are single mothers with a child, and in the Thai culture it's often the girls taking financially care of the parents - a provider and stability are more important factors than true love, just it's a kind man the lady can live with; and if he lives up to her expectations, love might often grow. A promise of taking care of family can mean all, and even on a relative modest retirement pension it's actually possible when living in Thailand; i.e. you can have a good family life after Thai standard for 40,000 to 50,000 baht a month. And don't forget that many Western retirees actually have pensionplans and saving, and more likely an income of the mandatory 65,000 baht a month, or much more. And some men are business entrepreneurs, either abroad or in Thailand, and can make a lot more money.

 

There are of course numerous other possibilities than what I mentions - I cannot generalizing, but it's my impression that what i said counts for quite a number of relationships, I've met more of them than I can count - and even that horror stories about broken relationship makes headlines, there are probably way more boring success stories, which never gets close to the news.

 

You eschewed women from your home country for a reason.

 

Apart from the more demanding Western women I've been told about - and that makes sense to me - I can only talk from my own experience.

 

I worked too much - as small business owner and entrepreneur you sometimes need to work hard - so my long time girlfriend dumped me after 13 years; but luckily we continued as best friends. Even that my age stated that I was in medical terms "middle aged" - i.e. in my 40s - was my mind still young, perhaps too young. Lots of women in same age level as me, actually beautiful women, were interested in me, but I didn't turn on; the worst thing was that I might rather be attracted by their teen daughters. I was also little scared if these ladies would be too demanding for what I could afford of lifestyle. Furthermore I've never been married, and not having any heir(s), a middle aged woman - a single mom in her 40s - was not a solution if I finally would like to have a family.

 

Turning my view to South East Asia all doors were open - apart from I always liked South East Asian women - so this became an option. As "blue eyed" farang, first time alone in amazing Thailand, I was an easy target for a gold digger, i.e. one of the manipulative young Thai ladies. I was not in love, just would not let go of this young 22 year old dream girl, who actually had lied about her age and only was 19 years old. I later mentioned it for a friend, who ended up with a manipulative gold digger-type, Thai wife, and he said that it was exactly the same he was feeling, didn't want to let her go.

 

The manipulating gold digger didn't work for me - luckily in the always unbearably crystal bright light of hindsight - and from friend's advise to find a little older model, it later worked very well, 17+ years so far...????

[mokwit]

10 hours ago, 1FinickyOne said:

never tried to do that... in 20 years my wife and I have never had 1 conversation about our relationship... and no real issues of control... or jealousy. 

Obviously you will be writing a book for the benefit of the rest of us as you have the perfect marriage. Even in marriages between people of the same culture, socioeconomic grouping etc a marriage requires work and communication to make it work. It sounds to me like one of you is completely subservient to the other. That is a model that works and it seems Thai men find women with no spirit preferable - maybe for that reason.

 

Or were you insinuating that I must have something wrong with me?

[Darksidedude]

Im happily married with a 6 year old daughter, was 48 when she was born been single all my life up until 10 years ago.

 

If i had my time again i would not have done this, not saying i have done the wrong thing my wife for a Thai is awesome well has its moments but what i see other guys going through i would hate that and thats not the situation i am in thanks god and my daughter, well thats the reason and only reason why anyone should get married is to have kids love her to bits.

 

The reason im writing here is ive basically been a whoremonger all my life and the way i see it a leopard never changes his spots, its very hard to control myself in hooking up with other women especially if im on the <deleted>, i do not at all do anything at home because its just to risky.

 

Up until 2 years ago i was working 4:4 rotational work, that is 4 weeks home in Thailand and 4 weeks work outside of Thailand basically as soon as i was on some R and R in whatever country i was at i would be acting like a single man and running amok, what they dont know wont hurt them eh.

 

I say up until 2 years ago, now me and my family have moved to a middle east country i have a live in job now that is i work as a expat working in a office like a normal job, i do not have that window where i can play up anymore.

 

So far so good ha ha

[1FinickyOne]

1 hour ago, mokwit said:

Or were you insinuating that I must have something wrong with me?

not you in particular, but we all have something wrong with us... and I understand my relationship is totally atypical and also not for everyone... most of 'you' would probably not be happy in my relationship. It allows plenty of freedom but caring and responsibilities as well... and it does not happen overnight.. shared family experiences continually deepen feelings and trust. Being part of a functional large family is not a Western concept anymore - my family in the West was pretty dysfunctional as most everyone else. So, for me, there are comforts in a large family... 

 

We are both pretty independent and if I had to define it, have both separate and together lives.  We rarely 'need' each other which does not mean we don't enjoy doing things together... or come together in a strong manner when a family member is in need. 

 

We have had lots of good luck, she has a wonderful family that I consider my own - and from what I read here on TVF that alone would upset many members but it works great for me.... so many farang here seem to treat family as enemies, which is not the case for me... 

 

So, enjoy what you make of your life - - others here seem to feel that they are 100% pure and in the right - and the family is 100% bad and evil - - wild guess, but there is usually going to be another side to the coin... 

[thaibeachlovers]

11 hours ago, observer90210 said:

Just forgot one more detail, so sorry to barge in again ????

 

One can never buy love or respect.

 

Just like money, they have to be earned and given to the worthy,  unconditionally.

 

 

Assuming we wanted love or respect. I just wanted sex.

In return I expected to make her life better, which I did, till she stopped fulfilling her side of the bargain.

[thaibeachlovers]

34 minutes ago, Darksidedude said:

The reason im writing here is ive basically been a whoremonger all my life and the way i see it a leopard never changes his spots, its very hard to control myself in hooking up with other women especially if im on the <deleted>, i do not at all do anything at home because its just to risky.

I've read a lot about men that seem to be able to get as much casual sex as they want, but I've never found women to be that easy.

Where are all those women willing to have sex without commitment? Not talking about P4P.

[scorecard]

On 10/1/2021 at 10:32 AM, Hummin said:

Make sure I know her family (mom, dad, brothers), and also her friends. 

From my family experience, a good point.

 

My Thai son married a wonderful Thai lady, they met at university. Now married about 8 years, 3 kids, great marriage, great mother, good communicator. She's never asked for anything from me, always asking if I want coffee, snack and more. Before she goes shopping etc., always asks if I need anything.

 

However her family are a nightmare. She's the youngest. Four older.

 

Her elder sister is a dragon. First time she ever came to son/his wife's new house she was about to step into the house, noticed that a lady was riding her mocy into the carport. She assumed this was our maid. Time about 8.10 am.

 

Dragon sister instantly loudly attached the maid 'your late, you have to come to work on time', then she made nasty/racist comments about hilltribe people.

 

My son quickly intervened, apologized to the maid and told his older sister-in-law that the maid was actually early. Her agreed start time is 8.30 am at son's request.

 

Dragon sister loudly insisted 'you cannot do that, maids have to start work at 8.00 am by law, she's late'.

 

Son noticed the maid was crying. Son pushed his sister-in-law in to the house then quickly went back to the carport and told the maid she had done nothing wrong. In fact she's a good worker and great with son's kids.  Son repeated you have done nothing wrong and I apologize for his sister-in-laws comments. Then he told the maid to take the day off and please come tomorrow morning and sister-in-law will be gone.  

 

Son then told his sister-in-law to be gone the same day and not return for 6 months. In fact she didn't return for about 1 year.

 

Son's wife's elder brother is a full on loud brain dead ladyboy (nothing wrong with that), most of the time dressed half men's / half women's clothes (not being judgmental about that, his choice).

 

When he comes to the house he tries to loudly interfere with everything including instructions my son or his wife have given their kids.  When he visits son/wife/kids/me never go out to eat because of ladyboys behavior including saying very suggestive things to young waiters, silly unwarranted loud complaints about the food/service/drinks.

 

On one occasion I ordered a gin/tonic, when it came ladyboy demanded the same. When the drink came he sipped the drink then yelled at the waiter 'no sugar'. Waiter tried to explain it's not normal to add sugar to gin/tonic. I intervened and confirmed 'mai tum na da' (not normal to add sugar). 

 

Ladyboy called the manager and complained. By this stage everybody in the restaurant was focused on our table.

 

Son and his wife very embarrassed, son cancelled the food order and asked for the bill and left a good tip and found the waiter, apologized and gave the young waiter a tip. Bill paid we quickly departed the restaurant.

 

Son's wife called a pizza joint and said she would pick up the food in about 30 minutes. When we were outside the pizza place ladyboy insisted he go inside and take the pizza, and asked for the money. Son's wife said 'NO, I will go in'. Ladyboy threw a loud/long tantrum. I quickly/quietly got out of son's car and went in and quickly returned with the pizzas.

 

And many more incidents.

 

 

 

 

[BritManToo]

1 hour ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I've read a lot about men that seem to be able to get as much casual sex as they want, but I've never found women to be that easy.

Where are all those women willing to have sex without commitment? Not talking about P4P.

Where did he say it was free?

[BritManToo]

1 hour ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Assuming we wanted love or respect. I just wanted sex.

Agreed, I just want sex, and maybe a bit of laundry and washing up.

Love and companionship I can get from my rabbits

[Darksidedude]

1 hour ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I've read a lot about men that seem to be able to get as much casual sex as they want, but I've never found women to be that easy.

Where are all those women willing to have sex without commitment? Not talking about P4P.

P4P is what im talking about 

 

[brianthainess]

On 10/1/2021 at 8:36 AM, Kenny202 said:

No, just hope can help some of the many who come here mostly with good intentions, thinking they are saving a girl when in reality it is they who need saving. Meet the family and try and blend in if possible 100%, and I have met some lovely Thai families where the caring sharing thing really works and no one is using anyone else, but have also seen the opposite more often where all you will be is an easy avenue for gambling / grog money. Amazing how many well educated guys come here...have been cautious all their life and put their life savings / future / life in the hands of someone has little more than a 6th grade education and maturity / intelligence level to match. Admittedly a lot of no good farang too. 

When I met my wife, who had not lived at the village she was born Isan or in fact visited it for 10yrs+ she lived with her beloved husband (who for her sadly died) I told her never tell your family you have a falang BF they will only want money, she has kept it from them for more than 12yrs. (I do know her hard working) adult kids who live in BKK ). Her family (siblings) still ring her occasionally for money though, but get told "Me no hab" She owns the land they live on which I paid 35,000b for 8 ria. Now it's up to them. 

[khunPer]

4 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Where are all those women willing to have sex without commitment?

A lot of younger people have talked about Thailand, especially when working in Bangkok. Otherwise being a pop/rock musician - or perhaps just look like one... - is an excellent way to meet more than enough of "all those willing women to sex without commitment"; I talk from experience...????

[RafPinto]

12 minutes ago, khunPer said:

A lot of younger people have talked about Thailand, especially when working in Bangkok. Otherwise being a pop/rock musician - or perhaps just look like one... - is an excellent way to meet more than enough of "all those willing women to sex without commitment"; I talk from experience...????

I know.

[NoshowJones]

I did come to Thailand to find a wife and settle down here, but if I knew that there would be a coup and there would be all the negative issues that this unelected ex soldier caused, I would have found another country.

It is only my loving wife, house and possessions that are keeping me here now.

[zzaa09]

2 minutes ago, possum1931 said:

I did come to Thailand to find a wife and settle down here, but if I knew that there would be a coup and there would be all the negative issues that this unelected ex soldier caused, I would have found another country.

It is only my loving wife, house and possessions that are keeping me here now.

Shoulda been here 40-45 years ago..????

[spidermike007]

16 hours ago, Salerno said:

That's the bit that baffles me. If, as you say, a vulnerable guy turns up (whether it's after a bad breakup, always been lonely, after a spouse has passed, whatever) I just can't fathom the amount of fast marriages/"defactos" that appear to happen (I say "appear" as it may just be my unconscious bias tainting my thoughts as I can't fathom it at all; maybe not as many as I think but there does appear to be a shedload).

There are alot. I know many men who come here, abandon all the guidelines set forth on these forums, in countless books written about the subject, advice from friends, etc. And they dive head first into the whirlwind of quick romance, and infatuation. Real men, who make the effort to educate themselves, take their time. Emasculated men, desperate men, and foolish men allow the woman to set the agenda, follow her lead, and end up in a world of trouble, financial difficulties, and sorrow. 

 

I also know many men here who have been with their Thai wives for years, some for decades, and they allow her to dictate nearly everything, as they would in the West. That is simply not required here. Thankfully. And many of those same men are abused by those women. Treated with disdain and disrespect, and they tolerate it. No wonder these women do not respect them.

 

A woman here prefers a real man. One with will and strength, and backbone. One with the kind of self esteem, that does not allow for abuse and one that demands that you have my back, I have your back, we live in harmony, or else. 

[thaibeachlovers]

5 hours ago, BritManToo said:

Agreed, I just want sex, and maybe a bit of laundry and washing up.

Love and companionship I can get from my rabbits

If I want unconditional love I'll get a dog.

[thaibeachlovers]

17 hours ago, Headgame said:

No clue why so many are compelled to get married. Almost zero upside here in TH. And then move to the village and try to build a life. Not going to be easy and not for me. Then the failure to use the word “no” from the get go with family members. I admit I’m an all about me person but I’m at a stage of my life where I tolerate zero <deleted>. Not going to spend precious time trying to smooth over “problems” and experiencing anxiety about relationships. Works for me but making no recommendations.

IMO most get married for sex, and in my case I thought it would be easier than trawling the bars. I wuz wrong.

[thaibeachlovers]

1 hour ago, spidermike007 said:

A woman here prefers a real man. One with will and strength, and backbone. One with the kind of self esteem, that does not allow for abuse and one that demands that you have my back, I have your back, we live in harmony, or else. 

If it really takes that to make a "good" marriage I'm happy to have decided not to get romantically involved with another woman, ever again. Too cold blooded for me and lacking in passion.

[473geo]

1 hour ago, spidermike007 said:

 

A woman here prefers a real man. One with will and strength, and backbone. One with the kind of self esteem, that does not allow for abuse and one that demands that you have my back, I have your back, we live in harmony, or else. 

I think you missed out the part "with sufficient funding" to sustain a long term relationship.

 

A guy can behave as you say but he better have the means to back it up or he is on the back foot from the start!!

On so many levels actions tend to speak louder than words in Thailand 

[473geo]

6 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

IMO most get married for sex, and in my case I thought it would be easier than trawling the bars. I wuz wrong.

On both counts I think, most get married for sex and to spend the non sex time with someone they enjoy being around.

[thaibeachlovers]

18 hours ago, Jackie Malone said:

Most of these reply posts are male. Here’s a female Ex-Pat perspective.

I’m sure that, among the Expat (farang) males, there are many who treat women as equals -  in intellect, capability, etc.  And, that must mean that Thai women are not treated as chattels, in those cases.

 

However, when I read posts in “ASEAN Now” about Thai women (as wives, girlfriends, etc.), I rarely see respect for women. I see comments about Thai women as manipulative. I have to ask myself where the manipulation originates.

 

Does it start with farangs’ promises of an easier life? What were you thinking? You were truly noble, while securing a guaranteed root and servility? And, all of this, on your pension?

 

You eschewed women from your home country for a reason. They challenged your machismo!

As in every walk of life, respect has to be earned and has to be renewed daily. If a woman treats a man as an ATM she doesn't deserve respect, IMO

 

I left my western partner because she was a user, and I didn't find another western woman "worth it" after.

 

Every situation is different, and has to be treated on it's merits. I'm sure there are many successful farang Thai marriages, but happy people don't normally contribute on these threads, so what you see are those that did get burned, treated badly, used and abused, cheated and humiliated, stolen from and denied sex.

What else did you expect?

[spidermike007]

9 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

If it really takes that to make a "good" marriage I'm happy to have decided not to get romantically involved with another woman, ever again. Too cold blooded for me and lacking in passion.

If you are fulfilled living on your own, it is a lifestyle that is hard to beat. 

[thaibeachlovers]

3 hours ago, khunPer said:

A lot of younger people have talked about Thailand, especially when working in Bangkok. Otherwise being a pop/rock musician - or perhaps just look like one... - is an excellent way to meet more than enough of "all those willing women to sex without commitment"; I talk from experience...????

Funny that!

How many willing women would have rocked with Mick Jagger if he wasn't famous and very rich?

[spidermike007]

8 minutes ago, 473geo said:

I think you missed out the part "with sufficient funding" to sustain a long term relationship.

 

A guy can behave as you say but he better have the means to back it up or he is on the back foot from the start!!

On so many levels actions tend to speak louder than words in Thailand 

True that. The financial stability aspect of the puzzle was simply assumed. But, the foolhardy ways some blow that huge blessing in life is not! 

[Rampant Rabbit]

Only  been married  once to the same  woman although I did wait  until early 40's to do it........17  years  ago 12  year age  difference, Ill  let you  know if it  goes teets  up. ps  wouldnt hold  my breath on that though.