Assault on Kiev: Russian helicopters swoop above Ukraine's capital

[Chris.B]

Assault on Kiev: Russian helicopters swoop above Ukraine's capital as Putin launches all-out invasion from north, south and east, with cruise missiles hitting airports and military bases, tanks rolling in and scores killed

• Russia has invaded Ukraine in a massive attack coming from south, east and north, both by land and air 
• Helicopters have reached Kiev where they have seized an air base, and taken a power plant on the Dnieper 
• Russian tanks broke through lines at Kherson, near Crimea, and were driving freely towards Dnieper River 
• But Ukrainians were putting up a fight around Khakriv, where Russian tanks and armour were destroyed 
• Volodymyr Zelensky branded Russia 'evil and vowed to fight back, promising a gun to every citizen willing to have one while calling on them to donate blood to treat wounded soldiers
• Boris Johnson branded Putin a 'dictator' while vowing a 'massive' package of sanctions targeting Russia

 

Daily Mail

 

[Kwasaki]

What's new, it's been on the news all day.

[tomazbodner]

Challenge is how do you get out of it? Putin was long threatening action if NATO expands further East and Ukraine was his main target.

 

It is therefore my guess that Russia would either take over entire Ukraine, or replace Ukraine leadership with the Pro-Russian side. They are unlikely to stick to only the 2 eastern republics which they just recognised. That said, one thing is for certain: for all that talk of how the West will support and protect Ukraine - it's clear they were just empty words.

 

Now for the fallout - Ukraine is obviously the biggest loser, followed by Europe which will be sinking under the price of gas from Qatar and US, especially if both, NordStream and pipeline over Ukraine are shut off. 10x price increase in gas affects everything. Russia? Well, they already turned to China for new market. That's what purpose of Beijing trip was for Putin at the start of Olympics.

 

 

 

 

[thaibeachlovers]

3 hours ago, Kwasaki said:

What's new, it's been on the news all day.

I don't watch the news routinely, and I haven't been listening to the radio recently so first I knew about it was this thread. I'll switch on Al Jazeera for an update.

I doubt this thread will survive long though, given it can only become political.

[thaibeachlovers]

I'll just add that I had thought it was Putin saber rattling to deflect attention away from any problems he may have been having, so I'm a bit surprised he went through with it.

 

The biggest danger IMO is that the west may actually get involved in the fighting, and if that happens covid would be the least of our problems, IMO.

[gargamon]

Putin is getting old. Senility is obviously kicking in. With no controls on his power, and his finger on the button, the future of the EU and the remaining west-oriented former eastern European are in peril. 

 

Putin's goal is to reconstitute the former USSR. NATO countries are in his path, so this will likely grow exponentially.

 

Russia - Ukraine 2022 is the same as Germany - Poland 1938. Learn from history or be destined to repeat it.

[thaibeachlovers]

1 hour ago, gargamon said:

Putin is getting old. Senility is obviously kicking in. With no controls on his power, and his finger on the button, the future of the EU and the remaining west-oriented former eastern European are in peril. 

 

Putin's goal is to reconstitute the former USSR. NATO countries are in his path, so this will likely grow exponentially.

 

Russia - Ukraine 2022 is the same as Germany - Poland 1938. Learn from history or be destined to repeat it.

I see it more along the lines of the Gulf war #2. Intention of going in and changing the leadership then getting out, but it didn't work in Iraq and may not work this time either.

[chang1]

6 hours ago, tomazbodner said:

Challenge is how do you get out of it? Putin was long threatening action if NATO expands further East and Ukraine was his main target.

 

It is therefore my guess that Russia would either take over entire Ukraine, or replace Ukraine leadership with the Pro-Russian side. They are unlikely to stick to only the 2 eastern republics which they just recognised. That said, one thing is for certain: for all that talk of how the West will support and protect Ukraine - it's clear they were just empty words.

 

Now for the fallout - Ukraine is obviously the biggest loser, followed by Europe which will be sinking under the price of gas from Qatar and US, especially if both, NordStream and pipeline over Ukraine are shut off. 10x price increase in gas affects everything. Russia? Well, they already turned to China for new market. That's what purpose of Beijing trip was for Putin at the start of Olympics.

 

The biggest winner? US and their gas companies just found a new market that now has no choice but to buy their gas, whatever the price. China, for getting a much higher amount of gas at probably lower price, now that Europe is out of the picture.

 

Next question is - what happens with Taiwan now?

 

Of course, no story is complete unless former president chips in: https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2022/02/23/trump-praises-putin-ukraine-refuting-claims-tough-on-russia/

China should be being watched as much as Russia. China can support Russia, making sanctions useless and will do invade Taiwan. 

If Russia does collapse in a few years, the west needs to break it up and remove all military capabilities. Russia and now also China need their dictatorships ended.

Of course this cannot happen as the West has too many dreamers who think doing nice things for others is going to give us all a happy future. 

 

[RJRS1301]

KyivNotKiev is an online campaign started by the Ukrainian Ministry of Foreign Affairs (MFA) together with the 15 member center for strategical communications "StratCom Ukraine" on October 2, 2018. Its goal is to persuade English-language media and organizations to exclusively use Kyiv (derived from the Ukrainian language name) instead of Kiev (derived from the Russian language name) as the one true name of the Ukrainian capital.^[1][2] It is a part of the wider campaign "CorrectUA".

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KyivNotKiev#:~:text=Its goal is to persuade,name of the Ukrainian capital.

 

[RichardColeman]

One things for sure, Nato are about to build some huge bases in Russian bordering countries now 

[RJRS1301]

39 minutes ago, chang1 said:

China should be being watched as much as Russia. China can support Russia, making sanctions useless and will do invade Taiwan. 

If Russia does collapse in a few years, the west needs to break it up and remove all military capabilities. Russia and now also China need their dictatorships ended.iOf course this cannot happen as the West has too many dreamers who think doing nice things for others is going to give us all a happy future. 

 

I understand the sentiment, however I question under what current laws "the west" would have to demilitarise any country?

"The west" would then be the dominator of a sovereign country.

"The west" then becomes the dictator. 

[sammieuk1]

Time to add a new ace of spades in the axis of evil deck of terrorists ???? 

[Berkshire]

I had thought that Putin was mostly about trying to revive the old Soviet Union in the hopes of regaining past glory.  But some suggest that his motives are much simpler:  it's about protecting his energy interests.

 

[To understand the Kremlin’s motivations in regard to its smaller, and relatively impoverished, neighbor, the key fact to know is that Russia supplies 40% of Europe’s heating-fuel supplies — namely, natural gas.]

[To get it there, Russia relies mostly on two aging pipeline networks, one of which runs through Belarus and the other through Ukraine. For this, Russia pays Ukraine around $2 billion a year in transit fees.]

[Russia is a petrostate and relies on oil and natural-gas sales for about 60% of its export revenue and 40% of its total budget expenditures. Any crimp on Russia’s ability to access the European market is a threat to its economic security.]

 

It's always about money and power, and Putin craves for both.

 

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/i-m-a-former-moscow-correspondent-don-t-let-vladimir-putin-fool-you-russia-s-invasion-of-ukraine-is-only-about-one-thing/ar-AAUbFJ3?ocid=wispr

 

 

[Kwasaki]

The way the hypocrictical west keeps up hostility against Russia and China why not do what you want while you can, things will only get worse and don't forget Iran.

Compromise and a open minded dialogue and understanding of different cultures is what's needed not content western media rhetoric and threats.

[Jingthing]

11 minutes ago, Kwasaki said:

The way the hypocrictical west keeps up hostility against Russia and China why not do what you want while you can, things will only get worse and don't forget Iran.

Compromise and a open minded dialogue and understanding of different cultures is what's needed not content western media rhetoric and threats.

Compromise with a big bully autocrat8c power invading and occupying a sovereign nation that has decided on democracy and independence? No!

[Kwasaki]

Just now, Jingthing said:

Compromise with a big bully autocrat8c power invading and occupying a sovereign nation that has decided on democracy and independence? No!

There's more to it than that, that's the trouble with the world today people like you thinking and believing one side of the story.

[Kwasaki]

7 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I don't watch the news routinely, and I haven't been listening to the radio recently so first I knew about it was this thread. I'll switch on Al Jazeera for an update.

I doubt this thread will survive long though, given it can only become political.

I have just been watching Al jazeera news and RT news it's interesting to see how both report.

[Jingthing]

2 minutes ago, Kwasaki said:

There's more to it than that, that's the trouble with the world today people like you thinking and believing one side of the story.

I've read the Kremlin propaganda  Complete garbage!

[Rimmer]

Ukrainian Forces Recapture The World's Biggest Cargo Jet After Repelling Russian Assault

 

The fate of the world’s largest fully operational aircraft is uncertain in light of Russia’s invasion of Ukraine. The one-off Antonov An-225 Mriya, from the Ukrainian "Мрія," or “Dream,” has been at Hostomel (or Gostomel) airport northwest of Kyiv since it landed there on February 5. While there has been heavy fighting at the airport, there are unconfirmed reports that the Mriya is still intact, at least for now, although it is now in Russian hands.

 

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/44446/russian-forces-have-captured-the-worlds-biggest-cargo-jet-in-ukraine

 

 

[tgw]

15 minutes ago, Rimmer said:

Ukrainian Forces Recapture The World's Biggest Cargo Jet After Repelling Russian Assault

 

The fate of the world’s largest fully operational aircraft is uncertain in light of Russia’s invasion of Ukraine. The one-off Antonov An-225 Mriya, from the Ukrainian "Мрія," or “Dream,” has been at Hostomel (or Gostomel) airport northwest of Kyiv since it landed there on February 5. While there has been heavy fighting at the airport, there are unconfirmed reports that the Mriya is still intact, at least for now, although it is now in Russian hands.

 

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/44446/russian-forces-have-captured-the-worlds-biggest-cargo-jet-in-ukraine

 

really good news there, well done Ukraine

 

I hope Ukraine gets supplied with tens of thousands of man-portable antitank and antiaircraft missiles immediately.

 

USA should let go of its stockpile of FIM-92 Stinger missiles, they are due for replacement soon anyway. Deliver them to Ukraine ASAP.

 

and the same for antitank missiles:

http://www.military-today.com/missiles/top_10_portable_atgms.htm

 

all countries on the list, ship to Ukraine please

 

Edited February 25, 2022 by tgw

[tgw]

1 hour ago, Kwasaki said:

There's more to it than that, that's the trouble with the world today people like you thinking and believing one side of the story.

the main story is Russia has been meddling in Ukraine for decades.

Ukraine has been the recipient of billions of Euros as investment, loans, development aid and whatnot and is/was evolving into a EU member.

That's what Putin tries to prevent by lying, making ridiculous claims, rigging elections, poisoning Ukraine's president, ordering hits on leaders, conducting false flag operations, etc.

I know because I have family in Ukraine.

Putin needs to get a bloody nose and a good kick in the balls in Ukraine.

Edited February 25, 2022 by tgw

[RJRS1301]

2 minutes ago, Victornoir said:

Totally agree.

The money pouring in from the West to bribe the Ukrainian leadership and push them to break with their age-old ally will have had the opposite effect to that intended.

This aggressive policy of NATO expansion eastward could not be stopped by diplomatic means. It is all the more reprehensible in that it violates all the treaties that accompanied the dismantling of the Warsaw Pact more than 20 years ago.

The USA saw fit to continue day after day their refusal of any compromise and their threats, thus provoking the brutal response of the adversary. 

Global Policeman or wars maker ?

arms manufacturer and supplier extrodinaire  

[Jingthing]

8 minutes ago, Kwasaki said:

The Ukraine president rhetoric for quite a while is trying to get NATO involved into War with Russia which anyone knows is a bit stupid to say the least the sooner his gone peace again will be restored.

 

 

It was quite peaceful already BEFORE Putin invaded!

[NotReallyHere]

9 minutes ago, KhunLA said:

My understanding, from a wee bit of reading, (not watching MSM) that Putin & company are finally freeing the Donetsk People's Republic and the Luhansk People's Republic from any further bullying from Ukraine.

Your map reading skills must really suck...

[NotReallyHere]

13 minutes ago, Kwasaki said:

The Ukraine president rhetoric for quite a while is trying to get NATO involved into War with Russia which anyone knows is a bit stupid to say the least the sooner his gone peace again will be restored.

 

 

Apparently you think peace is merely the absence of war.  Very simplistic thinking...

[4MyEgo]

16 hours ago, Chris.B said:

Russia has invaded Ukraine in a massive attack coming from south, east and north, both by land and air 

He had been saying it for years as the US kept expanding NATO closer to it's borders, all the USA and the Ukraine had to say is, Ukraine will  not be part of NATO and therefore he wouldn't have to feel threatened of them coming right up to his borders.

 

But as usual the USA will always push it's agenda IMO, I do not condone his actions in invading the Ukraine, however he has been barking mad for years and the USA wasn't listening, who suffers now, the Ukraine people of course, sanctions will be lifted eventually because Russia control at least 40% of the gas and Germany and others need it.

 

So much for the Biden admin being all ears with this 5 times president of Russia, a lot of history there and now what, China waiting to see if they will take over Taiwan as the USA and NATO have shown how stupid their negotiation skills have been, or lack there of IMO.

[tgw]

11 minutes ago, 4MyEgo said:

He had been saying it for years as the US kept expanding NATO closer to it's borders, all the USA and the Ukraine had to say is, Ukraine will  not be part of NATO and therefore he wouldn't have to feel threatened of them coming right up to his borders.

I don't believe that.

After scoring that concession, Putin would have pushed his luck further.

Ukraine wants to be a NATO member because it felt threatened for decades. WITH GOOD REASON.

Russia's goal has always been to turn Ukraine into a puppet state, as stated above they tried by poisoning the president, ordering hits on key people, rigging elections, conducting false flag operations and provocations, etc.
This has been going on for decades.

Edited February 25, 2022 by tgw

[4MyEgo]

9 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I see it more along the lines of the Gulf war #2. Intention of going in and changing the leadership then getting out, but it didn't work in Iraq and may not work this time either.

The one thing you forgot here, is that Iraq was a push over, Russia is a nuclear power, so the USA and others will not get involved militarily because the last thing anyone wants is a nuclear war and Putin is not the late Saddam Hussain. 

Edited February 25, 2022 by 4MyEgo

[tgw]

at least the pro-Russian trolls in this thread can feel comforted by the fact that they share the same opinion as Myanmar's glorious rulers:

https://www.voanews.com/a/myanmar-s-military-council-supports-russia-s-invasion-0f-ukraine/6458527.html

[tgw]

1 minute ago, 4MyEgo said:

he one thing you forgot here, is that Iraq was a push over, Russia is a nuclear power, so the USA and others will not get involved militarily because the last thing anyone wants is a nuclear war and Putin is not the late Saddam Hussain. 

you got the sides reversed. Putin is the one who - as he alleged himself - wants to get in and out quickly of Ukraine.