Brick and mortar retail is dead

[VinnieK]

I have been doing some footwork around shopping centers and such lately..plus my daily drives thru my town (Hat Yai)

What I see probably applies to all sizeable towns in this country 

Shops/malls are dead 

The fall had started before Covid (online shopping) but the pandemic was a massive punch in the face 

Most mom and pop shops are struggling -or closed-, most flagship stores (Robinsons, Central, Diana,Big C etc )are quiet to dead 

The only action is happening at Central Festival (evenings) and Makro 

The old Central dept store ,at the town center, has closed for good btw

 

There's also the perennial problem of over-supply of retail outlets that compounds the problem.

Where do we go from here is anyone's guess 

I expect a lot of demolition and re-purposing of town centres with a good dose of dereliction thrown in.

Thailand being an aging society is not helping either 

Very depressing as I used to enjoy going into town in the mornings.

As an aside, the influx of Malaysians is still a trickle at the moment and a weekend affair only.

Who wants to visit a country full of masked, depressing, sad people?

They might as well stay in Malaysia

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[KIngsofisaan]

One would have to be crazy not to think the entire Thai economy has stalled and is in a serious rut.

 

Political termoil with who will be the next leader, and their anticipated 4 year corrupt money grab to line their own pockets will make matters even worse.

 

Talks of huge automotive manufacturers moving to Vietnam?

 

Tourism is coming no where near predicted expectations and may never return to pre-covid levels.

 

The real kicker, is you have to ask what exactly has the government done to prevent this negative economic slide the past couple years and what exactly are they doing today? Submarines? F35's? How exactly does that help the nation?

 

They are too busy clinging to power, to even devote one ounce of effort to solving any of the countries problems.

 

Debt is going through the roof.

 

Things can only get much worse.

 

 

 

 

[VinnieK]

7 minutes ago, KIngsofisaan said:

One would have to be crazy not to think the entire Thai economy has stalled and is in a serious rut.

 

Political termoil with who will be the next leader, and their anticipated 4 year corrupt money grab to line their own pockets will make matters even worse.

 

Talks of huge automotive manufacturers moving to Vietnam?

 

Tourism is coming no where near predicted expectations and may never return to pre-covid levels.

 

The real kicker, is you have to ask what exactly has the government done to prevent this negative economic slide the past couple years and what exactly are they doing today? Submarines? F35's? How exactly does that help the nation?

 

They are too busy clinging to power, to even devote one ounce of effort to solving any of the countries problems.

 

Debt is going through the roof.

 

Things can only get much worse.

 

 

 

 

No offence but I think politics has nothing to do with it 

Much bigger forces at play 

Online shopping, over-supply of retail outlets and the pandemic are the key factors imo 

Example...two new big home improvement centers opened this year..one in HatYai and one near Songkla..

Hint...they were not needed

As many as 2-3 dozen upmarket restos and coffee shops have opened in Songkla in the last 3 years..even during the pandemic!!!

In a town not known for sophistication

 

 

 

 

[HappyExpat57]

WAY too many times I've tried finding items at a mall only to come up empty handed, whereas I can sit in the comfort of my home and find exactly what I want using Lazada.

[RichardColeman]

Think you need to look at the cost of goods that do not have overheads before making a decision on governments negative effect of towns and city shops.

 

That and also Thais ridiculous propensity to keep building the same shops next to each other and killing all trade. Have a 129 baht BBQ near us, then a 100 bht one pops up next to it, then a 3rd and 4th. Now they barely have customers to make any money. Same with coffee shops.

 

Also as a collector of stuff I spend my money online, simply as the shops do not exist locally - or I cannot find then !

Edited August 24, 2022 by RichardColeman

[Boomer6969]

Things will go downward worldwide, probably for the rest of the century. And the third world will probably suffer most. Thailand is in the third world, come to Isaan if you want proof (household income/debt, education level, health, etc.)

[sezze]

Visit 10 different shops in Thailand and they all sell the same stuff . There are few specialty stores , but by far most are just always the same . 2nd , most stores do not know what they sell , they sell the box and the price quoted , anything else is completely unknown . On the other side , i can go from my chair and order all food from Grab , order with all choice i want from Lazada or Shopee , with just the same knowledge ( in fact more since i can look up on the internet reviews or user manuals ...) and it will come to my door in a few days . No need to go driving around for hours and hours to find the item i want .

[1FinickyOne]

Thanks for keeping us informed...

[Tarteso]

30 minutes ago, sezze said:

and it will come to my door in a few days

And cheaper.. ????

[stoner]

hat yai is bigger now than 20 years ago with so much more shopping and eating options. maybe the market is over saturated.

 

total lack of tourism is probably the biggest factor effecting the city and the things you mention.

 

plus why bother going all the way to hat yai when you can spend your time in sadao. much of the local entertainment has closed and now concentrated in sadao right ? 

 

you may find brick and motor start to make a come back in some forms. 

 

 

 

 

[Henryford]

1 hour ago, HappyExpat57 said:

WAY too many times I've tried finding items at a mall only to come up empty handed, whereas I can sit in the comfort of my home and find exactly what I want using Lazada.

Apart from food and clothes i buy everything from Lazada.

[Kwasaki]

5 hours ago, VinnieK said:

Who wants to visit a country full of masked, depressing, sad people?

What country is that, everything fine where I live. 

[VinnieK]

7 minutes ago, Kwasaki said:

What country is that, everything fine where I live. 

You should go out more often

[spidermike007]

While many economies around the world are doing quite well, Thailand is in the doldrums. And Covid was only a small part of it. Terrible performance by the dinosaur wrecking crew, is a much larger part.

 

Tourism has been decimated, and it might have added up to 20% of the total economy, if you add in all related business. Nothing is being done to address prior problems, or elevate the tourism experience here. Much improvement and reform is needed. And sacrifices need to be made. I do not hear ANY discussion about what sacrifices Thailand is willing to make, to get the tourists, and that multi trillion baht cash cow back. No luxury or wine taxes are being reduced. Combined with a bloated baht, inconsistent and draconian immigration policy, major international egg on the face from recent decisions pertaining to the youth and opposition protestors, no way forward politically, horrendous air quality and environmental policies (or lack thereof), and a truly regressive dinosaur government, Thailand is losing its appeal for many.

 

Tourism here is essentially over, as a livelihood. Too many mistakes have been made. Too many opportunities lost. Trillions of dollars in infrastructure down the drain. Prayuth, Anutin and Phiphat could not have done a better job of sabotaging a vital industry, if they were actually trying to do so. If anyone did not see the reasons to oust these guys before, the vaccination drive alone is all the indictment the nation needs. 
 

No question, with the exception of some infrastructure, Thailand has been moving backwards for the past decade. On nearly every level. It did have a good run. Those days are behind it. So much self sabotage has been inflicted on this rather resilient nation, it would be a near impossibility for it to pull itself out of the abyss, shake off the molasses, and move forward. 

A very dynamic leader like Thanathorn would at least give the nation a chance at having a future. The current creeps do not. Japanese companies are relocating. Despite the.constant lies, foreign investment is way down. Tourism is all but finished. 

I understand why nearly a million youth are on FB, trying to figure out a way out. The future must look very bleak to them. 

For many of us, who are fortunate enough to not have a business here, things are simpler, and less complicated. All we have to do is deal with the continuous daily drivel of these goons in charge. This will likely be a two to five year shake out. The financial devastation to the economy here is far worse than the 1997 crash. And it will be sustained. Massive unemployment. Millions are out of work. 

[HappyExpat57]

7 hours ago, sezze said:

Visit 10 different shops in Thailand and they all sell the same stuff.  [I added the emphasis] There are few specialty stores , but by far most are just always the same . 2nd , most stores do not know what they sell , they sell the box and the price quoted , anything else is completely unknown . On the other side , i can go from my chair and order all food from Grab , order with all choice i want from Lazada or Shopee , with just the same knowledge ( in fact more since i can look up on the internet reviews or user manuals ...) and it will come to my door in a few days . No need to go driving around for hours and hours to find the item i want .

I noticed that the first time I drove from Pattaya to Roi Et. I couldn't tell where ANY town ended and the next began.

[newnative]

     Brick and mortar still seem alive and well in Pattaya.  We just had a huge, new home improvement store called Mega Home open.  Not to be confused with Mega Furniture, which also recently opened.  We already have 2 Home Pro stores, Baan and Beyond, Thai Watsadu, Boonthavorn, Home Mart, and numerous smaller paint, lumber, plumbing, hardware stores, etc.  My partner and I stopped in and checked it out; seemed to be doing ok business.  Partner asked the sales staff and apparently Mega Home is owned by the same entity that owns Home Pro.

[worgeordie]

Two large shopping malls have closed down up here in Chiang Mai 

in last couple of months , no problem as we still have another

three , more than enough for the area , whenever I visit them

the only places doing business are food outlets.

regards worgeordie

[allanos]

3 hours ago, spidermike007 said:

While many economies around the world are doing quite well, Thailand is in the doldrums. And Covid was only a small part of it. Terrible performance by the dinosaur wrecking crew, is a much larger part.

 

Tourism has been decimated, and it might have added up to 20% of the total economy, if you add in all related business. Nothing is being done to address prior problems, or elevate the tourism experience here. Much improvement and reform is needed. And sacrifices need to be made. I do not hear ANY discussion about what sacrifices Thailand is willing to make, to get the tourists, and that multi trillion baht cash cow back. No luxury or wine taxes are being reduced. Combined with a bloated baht, inconsistent and draconian immigration policy, major international egg on the face from recent decisions pertaining to the youth and opposition protestors, no way forward politically, horrendous air quality and environmental policies (or lack thereof), and a truly regressive dinosaur government, Thailand is losing its appeal for many.

 

Tourism here is essentially over, as a livelihood. Too many mistakes have been made. Too many opportunities lost. Trillions of dollars in infrastructure down the drain. Prayuth, Anutin and Phiphat could not have done a better job of sabotaging a vital industry, if they were actually trying to do so. If anyone did not see the reasons to oust these guys before, the vaccination drive alone is all the indictment the nation needs. 
 

No question, with the exception of some infrastructure, Thailand has been moving backwards for the past decade. On nearly every level. It did have a good run. Those days are behind it. So much self sabotage has been inflicted on this rather resilient nation, it would be a near impossibility for it to pull itself out of the abyss, shake off the molasses, and move forward. 

A very dynamic leader like Thanathorn would at least give the nation a chance at having a future. The current creeps do not. Japanese companies are relocating. Despite the.constant lies, foreign investment is way down. Tourism is all but finished. 

I understand why nearly a million youth are on FB, trying to figure out a way out. The future must look very bleak to them. 

For many of us, who are fortunate enough to not have a business here, things are simpler, and less complicated. All we have to do is deal with the continuous daily drivel of these goons in charge. This will likely be a two to five year shake out. The financial devastation to the economy here is far worse than the 1997 crash. And it will be sustained. Massive unemployment. Millions are out of work. 

Why sugar-coat it?

[Inala]

7 hours ago, Boomer6969 said:

Things will go downward worldwide, probably for the rest of the century. And the third world will probably suffer most. Thailand is in the third world, come to Isaan if you want proof (household income/debt, education level, health, etc.)

Pretty negative outlook. There is going to be some downturn while we wait to see if the war in Europe spreads or can be contained and if the Chinese will go ahead with their planned invasion of Taiwan. If the latter happens, things will really change for everyone, especially those in the Western Pacific. If it doesn't happen, then I can't see a downturn lasting for the rest of the century...

[Dionigi]

"Talks of huge automotive manufacturers moving to Vietnam?" international companies are all looking for the highest profit they can get. When tax incentives are offered and labour is cheap they will go anywhere. As soon as their required time, to gain the incentives,  is up they will move on.

[hansnl]

11 hours ago, KIngsofisaan said:

One would have to be crazy not to think the entire Thai economy has stalled and is in a serious rut.

 

Political termoil with who will be the next leader, and their anticipated 4 year corrupt money grab to line their own pockets will make matters even worse.

 

Talks of huge automotive manufacturers moving to Vietnam?

 

Tourism is coming no where near predicted expectations and may never return to pre-covid levels.

 

The real kicker, is you have to ask what exactly has the government done to prevent this negative economic slide the past couple years and what exactly are they doing today? Submarines? F35's? How exactly does that help the nation?

 

They are too busy clinging to power, to even devote one ounce of effort to solving any of the countries problems.

 

Debt is going through the roof.

 

Things can only get much worse.

 

 

 

 

What you mention about the situation in Thailand is also valid in (most) othet countries, all over the world.

There seems to be no government, anywhere, that had or has an answer to the changes.

[Boomer6969]

57 minutes ago, Inala said:

Pretty negative outlook. There is going to be some downturn while we wait to see if the war in Europe spreads or can be contained and if the Chinese will go ahead with their planned invasion of Taiwan. If the latter happens, things will really change for everyone, especially those in the Western Pacific. If it doesn't happen, then I can't see a downturn lasting for the rest of the century...

I guess you have embraced denial, and chosen to ignore the reality of the immense adjustments we have to make this century if we want to save the planet. This will happen only with "blood, toil, tears and sweat", for which the younger generations are totally unprepared.

[Jen65]

2 hours ago, newnative said:

     Brick and mortar still seem alive and well in Pattaya.  We just had a huge, new home improvement store called Mega Home open.  Not to be confused with Mega Furniture, which also recently opened.  We already have 2 Home Pro stores, Baan and Beyond, Thai Watsadu, Boonthavorn, Home Mart, and numerous smaller paint, lumber, plumbing, hardware stores, etc.  My partner and I stopped in and checked it out; seemed to be doing ok business.  Partner asked the sales staff and apparently Mega Home is owned by the same entity that owns Home Pro.

I wouldn't say the new Mega Home is doing "ok" !   I went in today to check it out and I was probably about the only one there !   Definite oversupply of DIY stores .  Do Home is another massive store and also very quiet .  There probably was a big demand for building/plumbing /electrical materials over the last 2 years while these huge Condos (CocoCabana et al ) were under construction however most sit empty ( Jomtien 2nd road ) and I would love to know whose buying into these horribly designed monstrosities (probably sold off-plan to the Chinese who now can't pay for them )  . We've had Nordic , whose next ??  Seven Seas ?  Another looming Evergrand ??  and what about the quality of construction -  aaaah !!       

[jesimps]

11 hours ago, HappyExpat57 said:

WAY too many times I've tried finding items at a mall only to come up empty handed, whereas I can sit in the comfort of my home and find exactly what I want using Lazada.

 

The only problem with Lazada is that they always call when I'm having my afternoon nap ????

 

[ChrisKC]

An interesting topic in which it becomes more evident that supply exceeds demand for just about anything in Thailand - yes including the women!.

 

Those from England and other countries, I guess, will remember the little hardware shop just down the road that seemed to have everything. Sometimes, one wouldn't have much hope they had something unusual but somehow, the two men and often a woman that had owned the shop for 40 years could come up with it! Packed away in a cupboard or on a high shelf that only the people who knew their stuff could offer.

 

Well, while I often go to the superstores  (those mentioned above) where there seems to be more staff than stuff, or Customers. don't have the precise thing I am  looking for or who want to sell me a pack of 100 screws for the job I want to do that needs only 4!

 

The good news is that round the corner from me is a store just like those of the "old days". The Owners have been there for donkeys years; they have a lot  of the bits and pieces I need and when it comes to the 4-screw job, I can buy a dozen. Yes, the place is packed out with "stuff" and they know where it all is - customers have no chance of finding it without their help. It is a pleasant experience!

 

The trend is to sell everything by the large Corporates leaving little room for the small business. This is why I try to buy a few things from Independent Traders in my locality or places like  Lazada where there are small businesses aplenty.

 

 

Edited August 25, 2022 by ChrisKC
typo

[Harveyboy]

23 minutes ago, Jen65 said:

I wouldn't say the new Mega Home is doing "ok" !   I went in today to check it out and I was probably about the only one there !   Definite oversupply of DIY stores .  Do Home is another massive store and also very quiet .  There probably was a big demand for building/plumbing /electrical materials over the last 2 years while these huge Condos (CocoCabana et al ) were under construction however most sit empty ( Jomtien 2nd road ) and I would love to know whose buying into these horribly designed monstrosities (probably sold off-plan to the Chinese who now can't pay for them )  . We've had Nordic , whose next ??  Seven Seas ?  Another looming Evergrand ??  and what about the quality of construction -  aaaah !!       

What Quality..NON

[AgMech Cowboy]

12 hours ago, VinnieK said:

Who wants to visit a country full of masked, depressing, sad people?

Nailed it!!

[KIngsofisaan]

1 hour ago, hansnl said:

What you mention about the situation in Thailand is also valid in (most) othet countries, all over the world.

There seems to be no government, anywhere, that had or has an answer to the changes.

The post is about Thailand.

[KIngsofisaan]

12 hours ago, VinnieK said:

No offence but I think politics has nothing to do with it 

Much bigger forces at play 

Online shopping, over-supply of retail outlets and the pandemic are the key factors imo 

Example...two new big home improvement centers opened this year..one in HatYai and one near Songkla..

Hint...they were not needed

As many as 2-3 dozen upmarket restos and coffee shops have opened in Songkla in the last 3 years..even during the pandemic!!!

In a town not known for sophistication

 

 

 

 

No matter what is selling, people need to have money to buy.

 

No buyers, out of business, pretty simple

 

Also, when businesses are built with free corruption money, or never ending corruption money, a loss is not the same as a person loosing everything they own.

 

Look at who is opening these businesses, and where their money came from

[KIngsofisaan]

3 hours ago, newnative said:

     Brick and mortar still seem alive and well in Pattaya.  We just had a huge, new home improvement store called Mega Home open.  Not to be confused with Mega Furniture, which also recently opened.  We already have 2 Home Pro stores, Baan and Beyond, Thai Watsadu, Boonthavorn, Home Mart, and numerous smaller paint, lumber, plumbing, hardware stores, etc.  My partner and I stopped in and checked it out; seemed to be doing ok business.  Partner asked the sales staff and apparently Mega Home is owned by the same entity that owns Home Pro.

Just because you think the business is doing ok?

 

Come on man, you have zero idea of the start up costs, inventory and how far in debt this store cost to open.