Increasing the 800K baht requirement for retirement extension?

[NorthernRyland]

How many would leave if they doubled it again to 1.6 million baht? They should start a poll here and see what people say.

 

How may people have $46,000 USD cash in the bank anyways and if you have the money in other assets are you willing/able to sell and leave it rotting in a Thai bank?

[MJCM]

18 minutes ago, NorthernRyland said:

How many would leave if they doubled it again to 1.6 million baht? They should start a poll here and see what people say.

One of the issues IMHO with leaving 1,6 million in a Thai Bank is that the balance is only covered up to 1 million and thus in case the bank goes bankrupt you lose 600.000 THB 

Edited August 3, 2023 by MJCM

[1FinickyOne]

I doubt this requirement is geared towards criminals - more likely at people not having enough to live here and afford medical bills if something were to happen. 

 

There are people who come here due to economic reasons and who seem to be able circumvent this and as we all get a bit older, it is likely that we might have medical expenses. It is unfair to private and public hospitals if people cannot afford to pay their bills... 

Edited August 3, 2023 by BritTim
Removed a quote from a removed post

[NorthernRyland]

Just now, MJCM said:

One of the issues IMHO with leaving 1,6 million in a Thai Bank is that the balance is only covered up to 1 million and thus in case the bank goes bankrupt you lose 600.000 THB 

It doesn't need to be there all year but right now you can get about 5% on US T bills and then your money is locked in. Not only is there a risk of loss from bank failures but an opportunity cost to make a profit. Total crap deal.

[Henryford]

4 hours ago, ross163103 said:

My thinking is; how many people on retirement extensions are involved.in criminal activity? Yes, supposedly the bikers were but pretty sure this is an isolated incident. In my 30 years here I've seen more issues with people on tourist visas than retirement extensions. Maybe Joke is just using the bikers as an excuse to increase the fees.

Yes fairly obvious it's an excuse. Why bring in a new requirement which affects tens of thousands of legal expats to crack down on a handful of bikers.

[Mike Teavee]

14 hours ago, MJCM said:

Even a law firm posted a video about it

 

 

They've just posted a new video on it... But basically saying the same thing... 

1. Nothing has change yet & it will take time before anything does.

2. Big Joke is no joke when it comes to Immigration changes so keep an eye out for updates in the news. 

3. Good possibility of Grandfathering but don't solely base your plans on them doing so...

 

 

 

Edited August 3, 2023 by Mike Teavee

[BritManToo]

15 hours ago, JimTripper said:

Agree, that’s strange. I think the Thais have a stereotype that good people are wealthier. Maybe something to do with merit (you did good things in past lives so are wealthy now) or social class standing (We know where that one comes from).

I'd say good people don't have tattoos.

Easy way to keep foreign scumbags out of the country, no tattoos.

Easy to check and enforce as well.

Edited August 3, 2023 by BritManToo

[BritManToo]

50 minutes ago, NorthernRyland said:

How many would leave if they doubled it again to 1.6 million baht? They should start a poll here and see what people say.

 

How may people have $46,000 USD cash in the bank anyways and if you have the money in other assets are you willing/able to sell and leave it rotting in a Thai bank?

If they doubled the financial requirements or insisted on health insurance ..........

I'd just walk away from my woman and children and mortgage, and move to the Philippines or Cambodia.

Can't see how that would help Thailand.

[MJCM]

37 minutes ago, NorthernRyland said:

It doesn't need to be there all year but right now you can get about 5% on US T bills and then your money is locked in. Not only is there a risk of loss from bank failures but an opportunity cost to make a profit. Total crap deal.

AFAIK the balance can’t drop below (at the moment) below 400K the whole year.

 

correct @DrJack54 and @BritTim ?

[DrJack54]

7 minutes ago, MJCM said:

AFAIK the balance can’t drop below (at the moment) below 400K the whole year.

Correct.

800k+ for two months prior to application for annual extension and 800k for the three months after application and not below 400k in other months.

 

Myself like many others prefer to just wack 800k+ in a dedicated bank account and leave it.

Avoids slipups 

 

Use another account for day to day. 

Edited August 3, 2023 by DrJack54

[zzzzz]

Just talk to appease the locals

Expat outlaw gang members account for what >>>maybe .001% of those on retirement extensions??

 

[JBChiangRai]

3 minutes ago, zzzzz said:

Just talk to appease the locals

Expat outlaw gang members account for what >>>maybe .001% of those on retirement extensions??

 

I know a few guys in Chiang Rai in a MC gang, really a club.

 

All nice guys who do a lot for charity. OPPY (old people, playing young.).

[John Drake]

Question: Would the people currently grandfathered in to the present system also be grandfathered into any new one. If so, how do they justify grandfathering one group and not another? 

 

Proposed alternative: why not raise the age of the retirement extensions to match the age of retirement in Thailand? 

[ThomasThBKK]

What's the point of an age limit anyway?? 

Either someone has enough money and assets to retire of he doesn't, either one is a criminal or one isn't. Nothing to do with AGE.

 

Plenty of old people in these "biker gangs"... just kick them out

[mokwit]

6 minutes ago, John Drake said:

Question: Would the people currently grandfathered in to the present system also be grandfathered into any new one. If so, how do they justify grandfathering one group and not another? 

 

Proposed alternative: why not raise the age of the retirement extensions to match the age of retirement in Thailand? 

I think it was lowered to fifty to lure* US federal and Military retirees who can retire at 50 on gold plated pensions.

 

I think it was 60, then 55, then 50?

 

*the correct word.

Edited August 3, 2023 by mokwit

[scubascuba3]

3 hours ago, 1FinickyOne said:

I doubt this requirement is geared towards criminals - more likely at people not having enough to live here and afford medical bills if something were to happen. 

 

There are people who come here due to economic reasons and who seem to be able circumvent this and as we all get a bit older, it is likely that we might have medical expenses. It is unfair to private and public hospitals if people cannot afford to pay their bills... 

on that subject i hope you have enough money to cover all those medical excluded pre-existing conditions

[John Drake]

3 hours ago, 1FinickyOne said:

It is unfair to private and public hospitals if people cannot afford to pay their bills... 

The cost for medical procedures is paid upfront. No money, no procedure. Otherwise, when I've been checked out of the hospital here I am always put in a wheelchair and accompanied by one or two big beefy orderlies to they payment desk. Retirees in Thailand pay one way or another. They don't skip out on what they can't get unless they pay first. It is the young tourists who come here and dive off balconies, run their scooters into utility poles, and get hit up on motorcycles wearing no protective gear and then don't pay. Or sit in a hospital bill waiting for GoFundMe accounts to get them back home.

[John Drake]

30 minutes ago, mokwit said:

I think it was lowered to fifty to lure* US federal and Military retirees who can retire at 50 on gold plated pensions.

 

I think it was 60, then 55, then 50?

 

*the correct word.

I didn't realize that. Still, at this stage, if you want to bring things under control, perhaps it's time to harmonize "retirement" with "Thai retirement."

[Mike Teavee]

27 minutes ago, John Drake said:

Question: Would the people currently grandfathered in to the present system also be grandfathered into any new one. If so, how do they justify grandfathering one group and not another? 

 

Proposed alternative: why not raise the age of the retirement extensions to match the age of retirement in Thailand? 

And would existing Non-IMM O/OA holders who are under 60 be Grandfathered in or kicked out?
 

Probably the best approach would be to leave existing Non-IMM O/OA as they are and create a new visa type that matches what they want to see in Retirees, then let the old Non-IMM O/OA fade away naturally.
 
You never know, If they made the new Visa attractive enough (e.g. 1.5Million on deposit gets you a 5 year multi-entry visa) then some existing O/OA holders may switch. 
 

 

[John Drake]

1 minute ago, Mike Teavee said:

And would existing Non-IMM O/OA holders who are under 60 be Grandfathered in or kicked out?
 

Probably the best approach would be to leave existing Non-IMM O/OA as they are and create a new visa type that matches what they want to see in Retirees, then let the old Non-IMM O/OA fade away naturally.
 
You never know, If they made the new Visa attractive enough (e.g. 1.5Million on deposit gets you a 5 year multi-entry visa) then some existing O/OA holders may switch. 
 

 

Sure. From the beginning, I've been commenting in the political topics that all I want the new government to do is leave things alone for immigration. And so yes allow for grandfathering everybody currently on retirement visas to keep the existing system. Change it for new applications. But I did note that in the interview Big Joke made a point of saying that it was "extensions" that were too low. That would indicate raising deposits for everyone.

[1FinickyOne]

10 minutes ago, John Drake said:

Sure. From the beginning, I've been commenting in the political topics that all I want the new government to do is leave things alone for immigration. And so yes allow for grandfathering everybody currently on retirement visas to keep the existing system. Change it for new applications. But I did note that in the interview Big Joke made a point of saying that it was "extensions" that were too low. That would indicate raising deposits for everyone.

What about inflation? medical costs are rising quite rapidly here.. they deserve to raise the rates for everyone based on annual inflation rates

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

17 hours ago, bkk6060 said:

Seems a change could be they may ask for a criminal history from everyone.

WIth what appears to be an increase in criminal activity, I bet they would like to try and identify gang members and those with criminal records.

That would make more sense toward achieving their stated goal (keeping out criminals) vs. their stupid notion that increasing the financial requirement on retirement extensions will somehow weed out criminals (which it won't).

 

[DoneTravelling]

What I don't get is why discuss something if someone is just supposedly thinking of it. I think of many things but no need to discuss about it until I want to implement it.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

4 hours ago, lordgrinz said:

As an unsecured, uninsured, and withering to inflation asset, it doesn't sound too tempting. Its already a sore point to have even 800,000 baht in an account here rotting away.

As previously noted by another poster, the current Thai government bank accounts deposit protection law only covers amounts up to 1 million baht per accountholder per bank. Anything beyond that is uninsured by the government.

 

So if they actually raise the current 800K amount too much, they're in effect going to be requiring farangs who want to get those retirement extensions to deposit at least a portion of their funds into unprotected/uninsured Thai bank accounts.

 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

4 hours ago, 1FinickyOne said:

I doubt this requirement is geared towards criminals - more likely at people not having enough to live here and afford medical bills if something were to happen. 

Except for the fact, that police big shot Big Joke specifically proposed increasing the requirements for retirement extensions directly as part of their efforts to weed out foreign criminals and motorcycle gang members. Maybe you missed that part?

 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

4 hours ago, Henryford said:

Yes fairly obvious it's an excuse. Why bring in a new requirement which affects tens of thousands of legal expats to crack down on a handful of bikers.

Because that's the level of intellectual consideration that the Thai police bring to most of their endeavors and decision making?

 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

1 hour ago, ThomasThBKK said:

Plenty of old people in these "biker gangs"... just kick them out

Here's a novel thought:

 

How about having the Thai police actually do their jobs and arrest and prosecute the criminals for their criminal endeavors... Problem solved...

 

And stop trying to raise the financial requirements for retirement extensions as a wrong-headed, non-effective measure that wouldn't really prevent major farang criminals from continuing to live and operate in Thailand.

 

[NE1]

5 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

Except for the fact, that police big shot Big Joke specifically proposed increasing the requirements for retirement extensions directly as part of their efforts to weed out foreign criminals and motorcycle gang members. Maybe you missed that part?

I bet the people he is " trying to weed out " has more money than I and a lot of retired expats here ,  who are not criminals or a member of a motorcycle gang.

[1FinickyOne]

7 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

Except for the fact, that police big shot Big Joke specifically proposed increasing the requirements for retirement extensions directly as part of their efforts to weed out foreign criminals and motorcycle gang members. Maybe you missed that part?

 

yes, I missed that part - I was just responding to another poster.. but I believe it goes beyond those reasons - and I have been witnessing older retirees here not having enough money to survive here, add in medical bills and they are desperate - - though they may still be better off individually as they might be homeless on repatriating, it is still unfair to the hospital that they have not been able to pay... 

[OJAS]

35 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

As previously noted by another poster, the current Thai government bank accounts deposit protection law only covers amounts up to 1 million baht per accountholder per bank. Anything beyond that is uninsured by the government.

 

So if they actually raise the current 800K amount too much, they're in effect going to be requiring farangs who want to get those retirement extensions to deposit at least a portion of their funds into unprotected/uninsured Thai bank accounts.

 

Original non-OA visa holders who are unable to obtain mandatory health insurance cover are already required to deposit 3m THB into Thai bank accounts for retirement extension purposes - at least 2m of which is unprotected/uninsured - as a result of sub-para 6.3 of Police Order 654/2564:

 

 

 

 

Edited August 3, 2023 by OJAS