Not sleeping well

[sirineou]

66 years old and for the past year I have not been sleeping well. I don't eat after six, I take multivitamins , B1 complex, melatonin and Magnesium.

I also often take Benadryl which gives me 7-8 hours of sleep.

If I don't take Benadryl 6 -7 hours  Usually interrupted by  1 hour half way through, which is why I always have a book on my nightstand.  . 

I am aware of the health benefits of  a good night's sleep , but also apprehensive about long term Benadryl use, 

I understand that as we age our sleep patterns change, and I am sure I am not the only one with this issue.

So I wonder how do you deal with such issue. I would appreciate and would consider any advice. 

[CharlieH]

What magnesium and what mg are you taking, and when do you take it ?

 

Same applies melatonin ?

[sirineou]

1 minute ago, CharlieH said:

What magnesium and what mg are you taking, and when do you take it ?

 

Same applies melatonin ?

Melatonin 3mg for the mast month before that I was taking 12 mg and was told it was too much, also I had noticed increased levels of aggression   and irritation . as I am sure  the moderators in this forum had noticed also 

And was told that it could be a result of taking too much melatonin . I still think it is because of my latent a-hole tendencies are becoming more pronounced as I get older  

Anyway down to 3 mg an hour before sleep.

Magnesium Glycinate 1000 mg a couple of hours before I go to sleep . 

 

 

[Dolf]

41 minutes ago, sirineou said:

66 years old and for the past year I have not been sleeping well. I don't eat after six, I take multivitamins , B1 complex, melatonin and Magnesium.

I also often take Benadryl which gives me 7-8 hours of sleep.

If I don't take Benadryl 6 -7 hours  Usually interrupted by  1 hour half way through, which is why I always have a book on my nightstand.  . 

I am aware of the health benefits of  a good night's sleep , but also apprehensive about long term Benadryl use, 

I understand that as we age our sleep patterns change, and I am sure I am not the only one with this issue.

So I wonder how do you deal with such issue. I would appreciate and would consider any advice. 

It sounds like you take too much vitamins. I can't sleep when I do that. Carbs help sleep so have a carb heavy dinner and a high protein breakfast. Take a warm shower. Slow your breathing down. Exercise in morning.

[anchadian]

I experienced the same problems some while ago and since then I have been taking B12 vitamins and the other B vitamins I get sufficient from food.  

 

Now I'm sleeping like a kitten.  Whether it was the lack of B12 or something else, that I don't know.

[JackGats]

Try Theanine.

[sirineou]

2 minutes ago, Dolf said:

It sounds like you take too much vitamins. I can't sleep when I do that. Carbs help sleep so have a carb heavy dinner and a high protein breakfast. Take a warm shower. Slow your breathing down. Exercise in morning.

' Carbs help sleep "

That's interesting.  something that Mr.  know it all me did dot know. 

I had gained some weight and was trying to lose it with intermittent fasting, no meals after 6pm and before 12 pm and was leaning more towards protein  diet, though I do like my vegetables.

My problem is not falling asleep . it is staying asleep and for a good length 7-8 hrs

I try to stay up as late as possible but I usually don't make it past 10pm which means I would be waking up 5 am . Which explains many of my early morning posts, since the wife sleeps like a baby (Very jealous) and until 7-8 am. so I can't' make any noise.

Checking google news headlines and the trouble you all got in this forum while I was sleeping is the only quiet activity available to me.

Though lately I have been known to swear loudly after reading some of the replies to things I posted  

[sirineou]

2 minutes ago, JackGats said:

Try Theanine.

Hmm, another thing I did not know, 

Now I am begging to question my know it all attitude 

I just googled it and it seems you are right, I will Research it more to see if it works well with other things I take, and what modifications might  be needed and would give it a try. 

[herfiehandbag]

I'm invariably in bed by 10.00pm, unless on one of my rare nights of minor debauchery. My sleep is usually interrupted during the night by my 4 dogs coming in to check on me. I have tried locking them out of the room but the cacophony of whining, crying and scratching is unending. Awake by 6, at 7 my black and white hairy alarm clock bullies me into getting up. I compensate by now taking a nap in the afternoon.

 

It is a pattern which seems to work for me. I don't take any vitamins or supplements, I have heard that ginseng helps as you age - any suggestions?

Edited February 27 by herfiehandbag

[CharlieH]

Suggestion, and you know Yr body best, cut all of that in half.

 

Try to stop the benadryl or wean yourself off it. It can be addictive and cause dementia and altzeimer issues long term use. (According to some reports).

 

Try eating a banana an hour before bed.That aids sleep also because it has magnesium and other goodies.

 

Breathing, Try the 4-4-8 breath in deeply for 4 secs, hold it for 4, let it out slowly for 8.

 

You might rry swapping the melatonin for L- theanine.

 

All the above are suggestions. Make of them what you will.

 

disclaimer: I am not a Dr. You may wish to consult one before taking anything, especially if you are taking any other medications.

[Gecko123]

No mention of exercise/physical activity regimen. Key component for getting good night's sleep. Going to bed and getting up on a regular schedule is also very important. If you're getting up to pee, try cutting out beverages 3-4 hours before bedtime.

Edited February 27 by Gecko123

[Etaoin Shrdlu]

I awake for an hour or so in the middle of the night, too.

 

There are quite a few articles on the internet about biphasic sleep. It seems that this has been a thing since antiquity. 

 

https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20220107-the-lost-medieval-habit-of-biphasic-sleep

 

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2022/01/medieval-sleeping-habits-insomnia-segmented-biphasic/621372/

 

Monophasic sleep might be the result of artificial lighting in the evening and fixed schedules in the morning made necessary by the Industrial Revolution, with biphasic sleep the metabolic default.

[retarius]

Do you snore? Have you been checked for sleep apnea?

[PJ71]

i normally check wal (sp) if i cant sleep, nod right off after that.

[JensenZ]

1 hour ago, sirineou said:

66 years old and for the past year I have not been sleeping well. I don't eat after six, I take multivitamins , B1 complex, melatonin and Magnesium.

I also often take Benadryl which gives me 7-8 hours of sleep.

If I don't take Benadryl 6 -7 hours  Usually interrupted by  1 hour half way through, which is why I always have a book on my nightstand.  . 

I am aware of the health benefits of  a good night's sleep , but also apprehensive about long term Benadryl use, 

I understand that as we age our sleep patterns change, and I am sure I am not the only one with this issue.

So I wonder how do you deal with such issue. I would appreciate and would consider any advice. 

I think your expectations of the length of time you should sleep are too high. It differs with each individual, but I believe 8 hours of sleep is far too much. Who came up with this idea that 8 hours is necessary? Sure, if you always sleep a certain number of hours, then you're going to want to sleep that many hours as it becomes a (bad) habit.  

 

I'm ok with between 4 and 6 hours, averaging about 5. If I get sleepy during the day (which is rare) I will add a timed nap of one hour to rejuvenate. Over a year, I've been awake for 46 more days than an 8-hour sleeper. Factoring in 8 hours of sleep, that's 61 extra days a year. I exercise every day too, so I'm not getting around half asleep.

[Dolf]

Bananas help with diarreha too.

[Hummin]

Do you exercise ? 

 

Swimming and lifting weights can be a game changer for sleep and overall health.

 

Taking supplements can have some effect for awhile, but taking supplements just to take supplements because other believe it helps? Well, could be placebo, or who knows. Just believing can also help off course.

 

As much physical it is mostly your mental state, your brain activity, so some mental cognetive training can be helpful. There is alit to find if you google, and maybe you find something thats apply to you. Sleep apnea if not any underlying health issues, is mostly under stimulation or over stimulation, stress, worrying, etc

 

Breathing 

Meditation 

Visualizing 

 

A balanced healthy life with physical and positive  mental activity as well nutrition should do wonders, but you have to be willing to do something, and not just chase supplements or medicine to fix the problem. Even it helps for awhile, all it does, just masking up the real problem. 

 

Typical solutions for some benzos or weed.

 Melatonin? Glass of milk instead and a 5htp (tryptophan) helped me a few times, but Im no fan of using anything, still do something for a few days to brake a bad pattern can be a good solution. A glass of milk doesnt hurt as a routine.

 

 

 

[connda]

1 hour ago, sirineou said:

I am aware of the health benefits of  a good night's sleep , but also apprehensive about long term Benadryl use,

Benadryl and other similar anti-histamines are are highly cholinergic and recent studies ⬅️ (link or just search for antihistamines/cholinergic/dementia) have show that they contribute to dementia.  As such, I personally limited my use of them (I used them for a couple of years for sleep, but I was having memory issues.  Since I stop my memory has significantly improved).  I used to use Aterax (Hydroxyzine) for sleep which is also highly cholinergic.

So, what to do, what to do?  I use diazepam on rare occasions (you need a prescription from a clinic).  Note - you don't want to get strung out on diazepam or any other benzodiazapine, but they have their used when used in extreme moderation.  Other than that, I get up at the same time every morning (8:30), make sure to exercise during the day, and take melatonin (which you're doing).  I find sublingual to be the best.  I get mine from iHerb.  I go to bed around midnight, get up 8 1/2 hours later, and Bob's your uncle.  Your mileage may vary. Going to bed at the same time and getting up at the same time really does synch up your circadian rhythm.  Best of luck.

[Hummin]

26 minutes ago, Gecko123 said:

No mention of exercise/physical activity regimen. Key component for getting good night's sleep. Going to bed and getting up on a regular schedule is also very important. If you're getting up to pee, try cutting out beverages 3-4 hours before bedtime.

Dehydrate enough throughout from the early morning to afternoon, and reduce the intake after dinner, is a good solution. I try to drink 2l with water in the morning, before lunch, and 2 liters before dinner. I do exercise 2 hours 4-6 times a week, so 4 liters is necessary, and for someone who is not exercising much or little 2,5 liter + can be enough. Talking about pure water, and not coffe, juice ,,,,

[connda]

30 minutes ago, Etaoin Shrdlu said:

Monophasic sleep might be the result of artificial lighting in the evening and fixed schedules in the morning made necessary by the Industrial Revolution, with biphasic sleep the metabolic default.

Make sure you're sleeping is a room that is as dark as you can get it. 

[bkk6060]

I think Melatonin is dangerous it messed me up.

Have sex or masturbate helps with sleep and good for your body.

[Mutt Daeng]

Three large bottles of Chang between 6pm and 9pm does it for me.

[NoshowJones]

1 hour ago, sirineou said:

66 years old and for the past year I have not been sleeping well. I don't eat after six, I take multivitamins , B1 complex, melatonin and Magnesium.

I also often take Benadryl which gives me 7-8 hours of sleep.

If I don't take Benadryl 6 -7 hours  Usually interrupted by  1 hour half way through, which is why I always have a book on my nightstand.  . 

I am aware of the health benefits of  a good night's sleep , but also apprehensive about long term Benadryl use, 

I understand that as we age our sleep patterns change, and I am sure I am not the only one with this issue.

So I wonder how do you deal with such issue. I would appreciate and would consider any advice. 

What about exercise? I spend almost an hour cycling and in the local exercise park most days and I have great sleeps.

[Sunmaster]

Waking up at 5? That's perfect. Use that time to do a meditation routine and your life will improve on all levels. 
You think you are being handed lemons, so make a nice lemonade out of them. 😉

 

[connda]

6 minutes ago, Sunmaster said:

Waking up at 5? That's perfect. Use that time to do a meditation routine and your life will improve on all levels. 
You think you are being handed lemons, so make a nice lemonade out of them. 😉

 

Meditations - look up Anapanasati (breath) meditation online.  CharlieH suggestion on yogic breathing also works.  Some references.  Pa-Auk is a bit esoteric.  Ajahn Thanissaro's guided meditations are based on the teachings of Ajahn Lee of the Dhammayut Forest Tradition.  It also works in the sense that you can train your mind to become quiet.  Personally, it's often the inner dialogue that keeps me awake - grinding away like a dog chewing on a bone. Practice this technique and you can quiet the mind as you meditate in a laying posture.  If I can't sleep, I will meditate laying down until I fall asleep again.  That usually happens in less than 20 minutes instead to the hours that it use to take. 

https://www.dhammatalks.org/mp3_guidedMed_index.html
https://dhammatalks.net/Books9/Pa_Auk_Sayadaw_Anapanassati.htm
 

[sirineou]

1 hour ago, retarius said:

Do you snore? Have you been checked for sleep apnea?

I have not been checked, but One good thing no snoring , ot at least that's what the wife said when I asked her.  I Will be back in the US this spring where my medical insurance is , and will have it checked. 

[sirineou]

8 minutes ago, connda said:

  It also works in the sense that you can train your mind to become quiet. 

That I would like.

It is a cacophony of  conflicting ideas in there. I wish they would all shut up and listen to me /

I will think about it tonight , ans sleep on it. 

 

Seriously, I will give your suggestions a try. 

Thank you

 

[Lacessit]

IMO the OP is definitely over-medicating for sleep.

 

He needs to change his mindset. Worry less about sleeping to a pattern. I nap in the morning or afternoon if I feel sleepy.

 

I do take a Codiphen ( drowsy antihistamine ) on average once a week if I feel I really need a good night's sleep. I have exercise routines. I avoid alcohol.

 

Being unable to sleep is frequently the product of an overactive mind. My trick in dealing with that is to manufacture pleasant fantasies to pass the time, it's surprising how often that will lead to normal sleep.

 

Hope this helps.

[connda]

13 minutes ago, sirineou said:

That I would like.

It is a cacophony of  conflicting ideas in there. I wish they would all shut up and listen to me /

I will think about it tonight , ans sleep on it. 

 

Seriously, I will give your suggestions a try. 

Thank you

 

Try Ajahn Thanissaro' guided meditation. The 12 minute "short" meditation is a good place to start.  if you go to the 40 minute meditation, one round of breathing as you move around the body, relaxing each part, takes about 25 minutes.  You can stop after that, or stay with the breath as you're laying in bed.  Thoughts happen, you'll experience them, but you purposefully drop them and return to the breathing.  You are training the mind to stay with the breath.  It does work, but it takes persistence and patience.  "Training an untrained mind is like training a wild elephant," as the forest monks would say.  But they both can be trained.  Persistence.  Patience.  Best of luck. 

[Gandtee]

4 hours ago, sirineou said:

66 years old and for the past year I have not been sleeping well. I don't eat after six, I take multivitamins , B1 complex, melatonin and Magnesium.

I also often take Benadryl which gives me 7-8 hours of sleep.

If I don't take Benadryl 6 -7 hours  Usually interrupted by  1 hour half way through, which is why I always have a book on my nightstand.  . 

I am aware of the health benefits of  a good night's sleep , but also apprehensive about long term Benadryl use, 

I understand that as we age our sleep patterns change, and I am sure I am not the only one with this issue.

So I wonder how do you deal with such issue. I would appreciate and would consider any advice. 

Perhaps I'm lucky and pulled the long straw. I'm ninety. No medical problems other than old age that I'm aware of. After getting into bed I always read a book until I nod off. if I can't get to sleep after my trip for a pee in the night, I read again and it sends me off. I would suggest that looking at mobile phones before bedtime may keep you from sleeping. Just my opinion.