34 minutes ago, herfiehandbag said:

And again, they voted to remain in the UK. They were, as voters in the UK, able to participate in the vote on leaving the UK. 

 

The city from which I come voted to remain in the EU. The rest of the county, and the majority county wide, voted to leave.  Exactly the same principle.

Your city is not a country. They should have the right to self determination and not be told they cant by another country.

17 hours ago, vogie said:

Everybody is assuming that Scotland does want independence and this is clearly not the case. The only people that want independence are the SNP, the Scots have clearly stated that they wish to remain within the United Kingdom and their wishes should be respected.

The only assumptions are from the brexit brigade.

They got a vote on leaving a union but don't think that applies to anyone else, rampant hypocrisy.

The UK is out of the EU but some want to believe it is still 2014, selective interpretation of "moving on".

Should Scotland seek independence from the UK?

 

Aye Jimmy!

 

The SNP don't speak for all of Scotland

Let's have the Referendum let all the people have their say

And once voted on end this boring Saga one way or the other

The survey is a bit meaningless and highlights the lack of understanding.

The right to vote on independence and independence itself are 2 separate issues. The first is an immoral restriction on the rights of the Scottish people imposed by an English parliament and should be taken away. NI was given the right to a vote on self determination under the Belfast Agreement, why should Scotland be any different. People need to recognise the difference between having a right and exercising that right.

The decision to have a vote should lie with the Scottish government and the result would be the democratic choice of the people. It is not a foregone conclusion either way. It is all about trust in the leadership, a major factor in the 2014 referendum. It is certain that recent events will have damaged trust in the current leadership which will take time to heal.

In the meantime Bojo need to think very carefully, taking away the Section 30 requirement would do more to repair the brexit damage than anything else.

14 minutes ago, sandyf said:

The only assumptions are from the brexit brigade.

They got a vote on leaving a union but don't think that applies to anyone else, rampant hypocrisy.

The UK is out of the EU but some want to believe it is still 2014, selective interpretation of "moving on".

All of the UK voted out, we didn't vote by regions, the UK refers to the "anyone else" too.

 

8 minutes ago, shackleton said:

The SNP don't speak for all of Scotland

Let's have the Referendum let all the people have their say

And once voted on end this boring Saga one way or the other

Would another referendum put an end to this breakdown in democracy, if you lost yet again would you accept the loss just as graciously as you have accepted the last one, a little birdy tells me you wouldn't. 

By my nom de plume you can tell I am Scottish and in my humble opinion the worst thing we could do is split from the Union, we simply do not have the financial clout to survive in the EU.

1 hour ago, pacovl46 said:

Scott was born in Scotland and moved to Australia at the age of 8. He might have taken Australian citizenship down the road, but his ancestry is definitely Scottish! 

So? He was Australian, not Scottish.

37 minutes ago, Sujo said:

Your city is not a country. They should have the right to self determination and not be told they cant by another country.

The country is The United Kingdom. Certain Scottish Politicians who wish for Independence asked for a referendum on the subject. One

 was held, declared both by the UK government and by those asking for it as a "once in a generation" decision.

The decision was that Scotland should remain in the UK. These politicians are asking for another referendum because they think that they might win it this time. The UK government, and remember that Scotland and it's people are full participants in all the UK wide democratic processes which produce that government - including the Brexit decision - have said that you have had a referendum and the decision that reached should stand. That is the UK government, not a foreign one, not another country saying no.

 

 

 

1 hour ago, Jimbo53 said:

You obviously are missing the point...Scotland is part of the UK!!!

Your obviously are missing the point, Scotland is a nation that is in a union called the uk!!!

 

If they decide that union is no longer one they wish to be part of they should be allowed to leave.

 

The majority of Scots did not vote to leave the EU and, as a result, many may feel the union that forced this decision upon them is one they no longer wish to be part of.

 

Why so scared of a referendum?

18 hours ago, Bluespunk said:

Ah huh...not deflection at all but a response to your words

 

The Scots were in the EU and now against their will no longer are, maybe the majority having seen what being shackled to Westminster now means would prefer to go their own way...let them vote. 

Sadly you have not provided a balanced comment and perhaps should have included what it would be like for Scotland to be shakled to the EU, particularly without the Scottish Islands who have already declared they would not wish to follow Scotland and wish to remain as part of the UK.  That is of course, but a small (but important point), but what really worries me is where Scotland will get their income from?  SNP are very shy on publicising this issue and if you remember many years ago they said they wanted devolution but would continue to use the £ as currency, until the UK said that that would not happen, then they said they would use the Euro and the EU said that that would not happen.  I worry at how much thought has been put in to a Scottish Economy once divorced from the EU, I also worry that this is little more than Policians self interest......it has already been suggested that the current First Minister has aspirations of being head of the EU!

20 minutes ago, robertson468 said:

Sadly you have not provided a balanced comment and perhaps should have included what it would be like for Scotland to be shakled to the EU, particularly without the Scottish Islands who have already declared they would not wish to follow Scotland and wish to remain as part of the UK.  That is of course, but a small (but important point), but what really worries me is where Scotland will get their income from?  SNP are very shy on publicising this issue and if you remember many years ago they said they wanted devolution but would continue to use the £ as currency, until the UK said that that would not happen, then they said they would use the Euro and the EU said that that would not happen.  I worry at how much thought has been put in to a Scottish Economy once divorced from the EU, I also worry that this is little more than Policians self interest......it has already been suggested that the current First Minister has aspirations of being head of the EU!

Stop worrying about it and accept the fact the Scots should be allowed to vote on independence.

 

For better or worse, it is their choice.

 

17 minutes ago, robertson468 said:

Sadly you have not provided a balanced comment and perhaps should have included what it would be like for Scotland to be shakled to the EU, particularly without the Scottish Islands who have already declared they would not wish to follow Scotland and wish to remain as part of the UK.  That is of course, but a small (but important point), but what really worries me is where Scotland will get their income from?  SNP are very shy on publicising this issue and if you remember many years ago they said they wanted devolution but would continue to use the £ as currency, until the UK said that that would not happen, then they said they would use the Euro and the EU said that that would not happen.  I worry at how much thought has been put in to a Scottish Economy once divorced from the EU, I also worry that this is little more than Policians self interest......it has already been suggested that the current First Minister has aspirations of being head of the EU!

You're giving arguments why you feel Scotland should not be part of the EU, not why Scotland should not have an independence vote or become independent.

25 minutes ago, robertson468 said:

perhaps should have included what it would be like for Scotland to be shakled to the EU,

Oh dear, Project Fear raises its ugly head again........

1 hour ago, Scottie12 said:

By my nom de plume you can tell I am Scottish and in my humble opinion the worst thing we could do is split from the Union, we simply do not have the financial clout to survive in the EU.

 

Can you elaborate on that please? Why are we uniquely unable to manage what many other small countries do relatively easily? 

49 minutes ago, robertson468 said:

Sadly you have not provided a balanced comment and perhaps should have included what it would be like for Scotland to be shakled to the EU, particularly without the Scottish Islands who have already declared they would not wish to follow Scotland and wish to remain as part of the UK.  That is of course, but a small (but important point), but what really worries me is where Scotland will get their income from?

 

Can you cite evidence please? Scotland has around 900 islands. Are they all threatening to leave? In fact, have any?

 

That particular reality aside, let's assume your ridiculous claim had any merit, is the sum total of Scottish economic endeavour located on these islands? When they all choose the obviously brighter Westminster led future, will rScotland be left an economic wasteland at their departure? 

 

50 minutes ago, robertson468 said:

SNP are very shy on publicising this issue and if you remember many years ago they said they wanted devolution but would continue to use the £ as currency, until the UK said that that would not happen, then they said they would use the Euro and the EU said that that would not happen.  I worry at how much thought has been put in to a Scottish Economy once divorced from the EU, I also worry that this is little more than Policians self interest......

 

Where does any country get its income from? Commerce is a start. With GDP per capita greater than every part of England with the exception of the SE and London, Scotland already has significant economic activity. 

 

52 minutes ago, robertson468 said:

it has already been suggested that the current First Minister has aspirations of being head of the EU!

 

Is this what constitutes political discussion now? 

2 minutes ago, RuamRudy said:

Where does any country get its income from? Commerce is a start. With GDP per capita greater than every part of England with the exception of the SE and London, Scotland already has significant economic activity. 

Good one!

2 hours ago, Scottie12 said:

By my nom de plume you can tell I am Scottish and in my humble opinion the worst thing we could do is split from the Union, we simply do not have the financial clout to survive in the EU.

 

I get suspicious when someone with not many posts has to make sure that everyone (every Scottish Nationalist) knows that you are Scottish... you try too hard. 

 

That said, I think Ireland has about the same population as Scotland -- and there are 8 countries I think that have populations that are less than that. 

18 hours ago, vogie said:

Not wanting to sound repetitive, I know because the Scots have already voted to remain and why are you trying to deny the will of the majority of Scots that have already taken a vote on this matter and decided to remain, you are not being very democratic now are you. Can you not go with the will of the Scots and not the nationalists who are in the minority.

by reading some of your past posts it appeared to me that some of your answers made some sense but lately you are on a repetitive one track mind type of answers that make absolutely no sense. Scots voted long time ago, prior to the UK Brexit vote, thus many things have changed after their vote and, the UK being or suppose to be a democracy, it's Scotland democratic tight to ask for another vote... what are you so afraid off, to be wrong ????

2 minutes ago, Mavideol said:

by reading some of your past posts it appeared to me that some of your answers made some sense but lately you are on a repetitive one track mind type of answers that make absolutely no sense. Scots voted long time ago, prior to the UK Brexit vote, thus many things have changed after their vote and, the UK being or suppose to be a democracy, it's Scotland democratic tight to ask for another vote... what are you so afraid off, to be wrong ????

Glad we are adding another slogan to the already mundane selection "what are you afraid of."

And I will add that when you get asked the same question ad infinitum it is very difficult not to answer repetively, I think without question of a doubt that there are more Euros that want Scotland to have a referendum than actual Scots, why would that be Mavideol? The majority of Scots don't want a referendum but the majority of the Euros want them to. So the key issue here is, who do we listen to, the Scots or the Euros, I don't really need an answer to that, most of us already know the answer.

There is one thing for certain though, all this bitterness totally vindicates the decision that the UK has made. 

I am Scots.
National pride makes me want to say leave.  But that won't feed us, or protect our interests.  The money isn't there.  Stay.

1 minute ago, DefaultName said:

I am Scots.
National pride makes me want to say leave.  But that won't feed us, or protect our interests.  The money isn't there.  Stay.

Well said and very fair.....let's hope you get to vote and put forward your choice.

56 minutes ago, DefaultName said:

I am Scots.
National pride makes me want to say leave.  But that won't feed us, or protect our interests.  The money isn't there.  Stay.

 

Our interests continue to be badly served by Westminster. Where is the money if not in Scotland? Why can it not survive as a small nation while others can do? 

2 minutes ago, RuamRudy said:

Our interests continue to be badly served by Westminster

To be fair that is the same for England.

Let them go if they want but where does it end?  Will Yorkshire start asking for self government, then West Yorkshire?

 

To be fair I'd have no problem if they really want independence as long as they understand that forming any alliance with countries likely to threaten the UK will not be tolerated. Who knows what could happen in the future? Could Faslane become 'Faslane-ski'?

1 hour ago, DefaultName said:

I am Scots.
National pride makes me want to say leave.  But that won't feed us, or protect our interests.  The money isn't there.  Stay.

If you think that is true.. vote that way. That is if you get a chance, seems that a certain group of English don't even want to give you that chance.

 

I have no clue if its financially viable or not. That is for the pro and against side to show and inform you about. Hopefully they are more honest then those who said Brexit was going to be easy and a great thing. 

11 minutes ago, KhaoYai said:

Let them go if they want but where does it end?  Will Yorkshire start asking for self government, then West Yorkshire?

 

To be fair I'd have no problem if they really want independence as long as they understand that forming any alliance with countries likely to threaten the UK will not be tolerated. Who knows what could happen in the future? Could Faslane become 'Faslane-ski'?

Who is threatening the UK ? I mean do you really see a war in Western Europe. I don't. 

 

They should be able to leave and vote on it. Where does it end, maybe with Ireland being one again and England only being England no more (northern)Ireland and Scotland. As long as a country is economically viable has some historic rights to be free then it should be ok.

 

We got a province in the Netherlands called Friesland. They are different from other Dutch own language and so on. If they want to leave let them go. I mean why would you want to force it upon them. But its up to them to be financially viable. I think once it gets to small its no longer viable. Scotland was an independent country in history, is big enough. So no real problem to leave. 

1 hour ago, robblok said:

They should be able to leave and vote on it.

Firstly they did have one not so long ago and voted to remain.

 

1 hour ago, robblok said:

I mean do you really see a war in Western Europe. I don't. 

I am sure we will  at some point. It isn't all happy clappers in Europe and countries are being invaded from within.

2 minutes ago, Laughing Gravy said:

Firstly they did have one not so long ago and voted to remain.

 

How ironic coming from a Dutchman that his country has

a referendum the result is totally ignored.

 

Calling the kettle black for sure.

I am sure we will  at some point. It isn't all happy clappers in Europe and countries are being invaded from within.

And they should have another one at any time they want.