Vaccinations for Expats at Embassies

[asiacurious]

2 hours ago, connda said:

The roles of embassies are to project power and influence in the countries in which they resided.  Expats are but an afterthought and are basically made to pay for any services rendered.

I don't expect my country to provide vaccines for their overseas expats as they'd consider it to be none of their business. 

 

I generally agree with your first paragraph, except that I would have no problem paying for any administrative costs for the vaccine (e.g. the cost of a doctor brought in to give the shot).  However the vaccine itself I've already paid for through my tax dollars.

 

As to the 2nd paragraph, governments (like the US) are actively pushing people to get vaccinated.   It is in the national interest for every citizen to be vaccinated, regardless of where those citizens reside.  Happy, healthy citizens living abroad represent their nation with every interaction they have with someone from their host country.  (Whether they want to or not!)

 

[khunPer]

21 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

No.

The most recent item I saw said we're at the BACK of the queue regardless of risk factors.

Interesting, do you have a link?

[digbeth]

I doubt most embassies medical staff is equipped to handle 'outside customers' 

and then there's the issue of the vaccine certificate, should it become necessary down the road, would the authorithy accept that you've had your vaccine from an embassy in Bangkok

[thailand49]

It would be great if they would but they can't even stand up to Big Joke and write us a income letter vaccine jab?????

[DavisH]

On 4/25/2021 at 5:16 AM, pixelaoffy said:

When to the UK embassy at AIA tower last week . Can't get past reception to even speak to anyone ! Yes me a UK citizen . Just a couple of Thai staff employed programmed to give usual automated replies and handful of securitas staff concerned about scanning and checking possessions . Useless place Mr Davison 

Security is always like this. Did you have an appointment, or something visa/passport related? The Australia embassy is the same. 

[DavisH]

2 hours ago, Jingthing said:

No.

The most recent item I saw said we're at the BACK of the queue regardless of risk factors.

Even Thais are having problms at the moment. The queue is for Thais anyway, who want a free vaccination - and for that you ger what you re given - sinovac (mainly, then AZ). Foreigners will need to pay (not too sure if any kind of insurance would cover it), but that's not a problem once vaccine production ramps up and the likes of pzifer are available. Thais waiting for a free shot could be waiting longer than us who can purchase one. 

[Jingthing]

12 minutes ago, DavisH said:

Even Thais are having problms at the moment. The queue is for Thais anyway, who want a free vaccination - and for that you ger what you re given - sinovac (mainly, then AZ). Foreigners will need to pay (not too sure if any kind of insurance would cover it), but that's not a problem once vaccine production ramps up and the likes of pzifer are available. Thais waiting for a free shot could be waiting longer than us who can purchase one. 

I don't think you get it.

Things have changed radically in the last few days.

There is no way foreigners are going to be able to jump the queue by paying. 

There is no assurance that there is going to be a private hospital option  at all. Much less knowing when that will happen if it does and when foreigners might be included.

I think its fine that paying doesn't jump the queue but it's not fine for foreigners to be pushed to the back if they are high risk.

Edited April 26, 2021 by Jingthing

[Phillip9]

2 hours ago, asiacurious said:

Alas.... Getting out of dodge requires flying on planes where there will likely be infected individuals.  Not necessarily on the flight out of Thailand but on connecting flights

 

On my recent connecting flight from singapore to the US, there were a total of about 10 people on the entire plane.  I've heard connecting flights through qatar are similarly empty, so extremely low risk.  

 

Vaccines are free for anyone, and easily available at almost any pharmacy in the US now.  Even foreigners shouldn't have a problem getting one.

[Bangkok Barry]

On 4/25/2021 at 5:16 AM, pixelaoffy said:

When to the UK embassy at AIA tower last week . Can't get past reception to even speak to anyone ! Yes me a UK citizen . Just a couple of Thai staff employed programmed to give usual automated replies and handful of securitas staff concerned about scanning and checking possessions . Useless place Mr Davison 

 

It won't be long until the UK 'embassy' is just a corner table in a British pub. At least you'll be able to have a beer while waiting.

[Scott]

Years ago, I worked for a program with the US Embassy.  Although an Embassy could possibly give out vaccines, it would require a major logistics problem and the political ramifications are potentially enormous.  

 

First, the setting up of a medical facility at an Embassy/Consulate would require a lot of effort.  The issue of security at an embassy is paramount, so getting large numbers in to get a shot would be tricky.  

 

Second, regardless of which vaccine is offered, they do require care in storage and the amount of time they can be out before being administered.   That means people being able to be there at a scheduled time.  It also means medical personnel being able to handle events like anaphylactic reactions.   Then there is the issue of giving the second shot, if required.  

Diplomatically and politically there are some major hurdles.  How do you think the Thai gov't is going to react to US citizens being given vaccines ahead of Thais?   How do you think the general Thai population is going to react?  

 

[geisha]

Embassies do not supply health care. This is not in their domain. They are not allowed to. I’m quite sure  Thailand ’ will catch up soon, and private hospitals there too. 

[asiacurious]

11 minutes ago, Scott said:

Diplomatically and politically there are some major hurdles.  How do you think the Thai gov't is going to react to US citizens being given vaccines ahead of Thais?   How do you think the general Thai population is going to react?  

 

THESE (quoted above) are the big issues that make me think IF it happens at all, it'll happen well into the Thai government's own vaccination effort.  Well put! 

 

The logistics are all... well, just logistics. We aren't talking about logistics done the Thai way, where there may be a traditional way or customary way of doing things.  No need to over complicate things. 

 

Security: Set up a large air-conditioned tent just inside the embassy complex.  No need for people to enter buildings. Or use the grounds of the Ambassador's Residence (for the US at least).  I hear there's no current Ambassador, so why not?

 

Scheduling: Use an online appointment system to minimize wait times.  Don't need to reinvent the wheel.

 

Appointment time: The line for those with appointments can run outside of the embassy complex.  Admit people in batches.

 

Medical staff/Emergency care: Medical staff can be arranged from a local hospital.  The number of people who have experienced side effects requiring medical care is infinitesimally small, and in the event of a serious emergency, there are plenty of hospitals in the area. 

 

Vaccine Storage:  The vaccine with the most difficult storage requirements is the PhyPfizer-BioNTech vaccine. But even that isn't complicated anymore.  In February, the US FDA announced that it is "allowing undiluted frozen vials of the Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 Vaccine to be transported and stored at conventional temperatures commonly found in pharmaceutical freezers for a period of up to two weeks." 

 

Source: https://www.fda.gov/news-events/press-announcements/coronavirus-covid-19-update-fda-allows-more-flexible-storage-transportation-conditions-pfizer

 

[asiacurious]

26 minutes ago, geisha said:

They are not allowed to.

 

Who doesn't allow them to? 

[geisha]

10 minutes ago, asiacurious said:

 

Who doesn't allow them to? 

Embassy rules/ governments. They do not dispense health care. 

[Nonthaburi Boy]

1 hour ago, Bangkok Barry said:

 

It won't be long until the UK 'embassy' is just a corner table in a British pub. At least you'll be able to have a beer while waiting.

That would be nicer actually. I look forward to it. 

[expatjustice]

The Chinese embassy in Bangkok are and have been vaccinating their nationals for a while. 

 

Sadly despite being married to one, and having lived in China for a long enough time I don't qualify.... ????

[Jingthing]

1 hour ago, expatjustice said:

The Chinese embassy in Bangkok are and have been vaccinating their nationals for a while. 

 

Sadly despite being married to one, and having lived in China for a long enough time I don't qualify.... ????

Sorry about your eligibility status but credit where credit is due --.to China. 

[expatjustice]

1 hour ago, Jingthing said:

Sorry about your eligibility status but credit where credit is due --.to China. 

 

???

[Jingthing]

1 minute ago, expatjustice said:

 

???

For their embassy vaccinating their nationals. I wish the USA embassy would do the same but I know they won't.

[Mayhem11]

Oh for heavens sake what is all this bother about embassies being vac hubs. You just have to find an issue to get all hit and bothered about.

[Jingthing]

1 hour ago, Mayhem11 said:

Oh for heavens sake what is all this bother about embassies being vac hubs. You just have to find an issue to get all hit and bothered about.

My answer to that is the reason this is an issue is because there are clear indications that expats are going to be in the back of the bus for vaccines in the Thai system, including foreigners in HIGH RISK groups who are logically prioritized in the Thai system.

If we had ASSURANCES that the private hospitals would be selling vaccines in a timely manner so that HIGH RISK expats could access them, then that would be a different story. We have had no such assurances. 

It's not only about access but timeliness. 

So if the Thai system will be failing expats particularly HIGH RISK ones, our embassies are the only logical place that might (but probably won't) actually do something to provide these critically important vaccines to their own nationals.

[keemapoot]

6 hours ago, Scott said:

Years ago, I worked for a program with the US Embassy.  Although an Embassy could possibly give out vaccines, it would require a major logistics problem and the political ramifications are potentially enormous.  

 

First, the setting up of a medical facility at an Embassy/Consulate would require a lot of effort.  The issue of security at an embassy is paramount, so getting large numbers in to get a shot would be tricky.  

 

Second, regardless of which vaccine is offered, they do require care in storage and the amount of time they can be out before being administered.   That means people being able to be there at a scheduled time.  It also means medical personnel being able to handle events like anaphylactic reactions.   Then there is the issue of giving the second shot, if required.  

Diplomatically and politically there are some major hurdles.  How do you think the Thai gov't is going to react to US citizens being given vaccines ahead of Thais?   How do you think the general Thai population is going to react?  

 

 

Yes, this is true for Embassies. There is a huge vaccination program underway abroad for US citizens which most people don't know about, and don't have access to. I am fully vaccinated (Moderna) now under this program. This program is administered by the US military abroad, and is given to all people attached to the DoD (military, civilian, contractor & spouses/families). In Asia, this program is at all the US bases in Japan, Korea, etc.., and is overseen by the Naval hospital system.  the US military does have a quasi-presence and joint activities in Thailand with JUSMAGTHAI etc., and I suppose in theory vaccines could be administered to US citizens in Thailand via the military hospital connection, but I suppose that is a big ask.

** And, Biden just announced this morning that the 10s of millions of surplus Astra Zeneca vaccine will be made available globally to countries who want this. Not sure if Thailand is in touch with the US on this program, but if so, it could be soon available through private hospitals in Thailand.

 

Edited April 26, 2021 by keemapoot

[Scott]

13 minutes ago, keemapoot said:

 

Yes, this is true for Embassies. There is a huge vaccination program underway abroad for US citizens which most people don't know about, and don't have access to. I am fully vaccinated (Moderna) now under this program. This program is administered by the US military abroad, and is given to all people attached to the DoD (military, civilian, contractor & spouses/families). In Asia, this program is at all the US bases in Japan, Korea, etc.., and is overseen by the Naval hospital system.  the US military does have a quasi-presence and joint activities in Thailand with JUSMAGTHAI etc., and I suppose in theory vaccines could be administered to US citizens in Thailand via the military hospital connection, but I suppose that is a big ask.

** And, Biden just announced this morning that the 10s of millions of surplus Astra Zeneca vaccine will be made available globally to countries who want this. Not sure if Thailand is in touch with the US on this program, but if so, it could be soon available through private hospitals in Thailand.

 

Thanks.  I am familiar with JUSTMAG.  As great and as helpful as it would be, I think there would be huge problems unless it is widely distributed to the local population.  In a few places (Kenya being one), there was major blowback when vaccine shots were given to diplomats and their families, while local citizens couldn't get it.  

 

I believe the US was planning on giving a large quantity of the Astra Zenica to India, even this rather generous gift has been criticized because the AZ is not approved in the US, so why would the US give an unapproved vaccine to others.

I suspect that unless the US were giving a large quantity and in return allowed US citizens a place in the queue, there would be problems.  
 

[keemapoot]

1 minute ago, Scott said:

Thanks.  I am familiar with JUSTMAG.  As great and as helpful as it would be, I think there would be huge problems unless it is widely distributed to the local population.  In a few places (Kenya being one), there was major blowback when vaccine shots were given to diplomats and their families, while local citizens couldn't get it.  

 

I believe the US was planning on giving a large quantity of the Astra Zenica to India, even this rather generous gift has been criticized because the AZ is not approved in the US, so why would the US give an unapproved vaccine to others.

I suspect that unless the US were giving a large quantity and in return allowed US citizens a place in the queue, there would be problems.  
 

 

I understand those concerns, but I have not seen any blowback here in Japan with local Japanese, as they know the DoD attached people are getting the vaccines (many of these are also Japanese citizens who work at the US bases etc..) . Less than 1% of Japanese have been vaccinated, but many tens of thousands of Americans here have been under the SOFA status DoD program.

 

Yes, you are right about the optics of the Astra Zeneca non-FDA approval yet. Biden may rush through this approval so as to avoid the political criticism you cited.

[DerbyDan]

I would look at getting one from a military base if your from the usa, not an embassy or consulate.

 

If you have a Thai friend you could also go in with them and get a 1/2 shot each.

Edited April 27, 2021 by DerbyDan

[Farang99]

On 4/25/2021 at 11:08 AM, Kinnock said:

I wouldn't expect the UK embassy to do anything of value.  In the heat of the Red Shirt demonstrates they all packed up and shut the embassy down.

 

We are on our own - always have been.

 

Same for the UK embassy, never any use.

[jayboy]

4 hours ago, Jingthing said:

If we had ASSURANCES that the private hospitals would be selling vaccines in a timely manner so that HIGH RISK expats could access them, then that would be a different story. We have had no such assurances. 

This is different to what you said in an earlier post.My understanding is that in due course private hospitals will be able to offer vaccinations.This might take a few months and should be open to all comers: there is unlikely to be any prioritization in terms of high risk.

 

The Embassy issue is something else and much of the chatter on this thread is unrealistic. The Western embassies will never offer facilities to Western expatriates.Nor in a country like Thailand with a solid health infrastructure, should they.What I object to is the patronizing advice from embassies to fellow citizens on using local facilities, while they obtain protection from overseas on the quiet. I'm not saying they're wrong to do it but there's a whiff of hypocrisy involved.

[pixelaoffy]

8 hours ago, Scott said:

Years ago, I worked for a program with the US Embassy.  Although an Embassy could possibly give out vaccines, it would require a major logistics problem and the political ramifications are potentially enormous.  

 

First, the setting up of a medical facility at an Embassy/Consulate would require a lot of effort.  The issue of security at an embassy is paramount, so getting large numbers in to get a shot would be tricky.  

 

Second, regardless of which vaccine is offered, they do require care in storage and the amount of time they can be out before being administered.   That means people being able to be there at a scheduled time.  It also means medical personnel being able to handle events like anaphylactic reactions.   Then there is the issue of giving the second shot, if required.  

Diplomatically and politically there are some major hurdles.  How do you think the Thai gov't is going to react to US citizens being given vaccines ahead of Thais?   How do you think the general Thai population is going to react?  

 

Well . Logistically..yes can be difficult  but surmountable.. as regard what Thai gov and Thais think .. really isn't an issue.  Let's remember what 'the Thai gov and Thais " think of foreigners! We read about their negativity all the time in news items and surveys on this site 

Edited April 27, 2021 by pixelaoffy

[newnative]

    This morning I got an email from Democrats Abroad Thailand with a survey to fill out on this issue.  They have formed a covid 19 task force and are trying to get the US government to make vaccines available for Americans living in Thailand.  I filled out the survey and I hope anyone else getting it will do so, as well.  The more numbers, perhaps the more they will listen to us.  

[NoshowJones]

If the British Embassy started giving out the Chinese virus vaccinations, I would bet they would even charge more than the vastly  overcharging private hospitals, maybe starting around 10.000 Bt per shot.