Elderly expats given lifeline regarding mandatory insurance requirement for Non-Immigrant “O-A” visas

[MadMac]

1 minute ago, Pib said:

The translation talks both initial issue of OA visa and extension of stay.

 

Well, not if you read it properly, but again, maybe something lost in translation.

[tonray]

1 minute ago, MadMac said:

 

Well, not if you read it properly, but again, maybe something lost in translation.

And therein lies the  issue...same thing with the 40/400 insurance we are saddled with now....it is so ambiguous that many offices will jump right on it.

[Pib]

We can only hope when the final wording dust settles the new guidelines will only require 100K USD COVID 19 insurance for the initial issue of an OA visa and not for extension of stay. 

 

AND for the initial visa and subsequent extension of stay the 40K baht inpatient/400K outpatient remains but foreign insurance being accepted "without needing embassy validation" because foreign embassies are not going to get into the validation that a person has the required medical insurance....that just ain't going to happen.   However, right now the new (proposed) guidelines state the foreign embassy would be the source for validation.

Edited June 17, 2021 by Pib

[Pib]

1 hour ago, Scott Tracy said:

I read today, in an online article from the Thai newspaper whose name must never be spoken here, that this applies to ALL foreigners living in Thailand.

 

It says, and I paraphrase, that the cabinet approved the proposal yesterday and the Government said it would apply to all holders of the Non Immigrant Visa, (NIV).

It also says, again paraphrased, about the NIV O-A visa applicants and extensions having to show the 400,000/40,000 baht combination insurance, but goes on to say those seeking to buy the 3,000,000 baht insurance from overseas may do so, with all the hoops discussed above.

 

So, no longer 400,000/40,000 combination insurance, just for NIV O-A, but 3,000,000 insurance for all non-Thais living in Thailand. All....

 

 

 

That was incorrect info....a bad article....poor reporting.   Bangkok Post has posted a "corrected/updated" 16 June article....corrected/updated as of 5:32pm 16 June. 

 

The corrected/updated article says the 100K USD insurance only applies  to the OA visa and the paper apologizes for the error which earlier incorrectly stated it applied to all long term visas.   It does "not" apply to marriage, business, educational, media, and other visas; it applies only the OA visa according to the updated article.

 

[JimGant]

Maybe this was discussed earlier and I missed it....

-- In Pib's post, I assume the subject is O-A visas?

-- "Visa for requesting to stay" means "extension of stay?"

 

Still sounds promising, i.e., I can use my US insurance in lieu of the mandated Thai insurance.

What I don't see is, folks getting an O-A extension based on marriage are still exempt from any insurance requirement. Possibly this exclusion is going away....

 

[Pib]

3 minutes ago, JimGant said:

Maybe this was discussed earlier and I missed it....

-- In Pib's post, I assume the subject is O-A visas?

-- "Visa for requesting to stay" means "extension of stay?"

 

Still sounds promising, i.e., I can use my US insurance in lieu of the mandated Thai insurance.

What I don't see is, folks getting an O-A extension based on marriage are still exempt from any insurance requirement. Possibly this exclusion is going away....

 

The marriage visa/extension is not covered by OA visa/extension rules....two different animals.  The new guidelines were for OA visa/retirement extensions only.

Edited June 17, 2021 by Pib

[tonray]

4 minutes ago, Pib said:

The marriage visa/extension is not covered by OA visa/extension rules....two different animals.  The new guidelines were for OA visa/retirement extensions only.

Having an OA retirement extension these days is like being kicked while you're down on the ground by a cadre of Moto Taxi guys at 3 AM in Pattaya

[ubonjoe]

1 hour ago, Pib said:

But when something gets briefed to the prime minister and cabinet (i.e., the highest level of govt) which is subsequently approved in concept you can bet there will be little to no change in the final product which will be a new police order and/or Foreign Ministry regulation update regarding OA visa/extension requirements.

I can assure you that many times when something is approved in concept it gets changed and might be changed again before it is approved.

I assume the health ministry will be leading the committee set up to do it.

[MRToMRT]

2 minutes ago, tonray said:

Having an OA retirement extension these days is like being kicked while you're down on the ground by a cadre of Moto Taxi guys at 3 AM in Pattaya

I agree, its like "what's the point of the O-A" if the O is so easy by comparison. 

[tonray]

3 minutes ago, MRToMRT said:

I agree, its like "what's the point of the O-A" if the O is so easy by comparison. 

The only point was that many of us got trapped by Covid with OAs and cannot change until things open up. But if there is a 3rd insurance policy mandated by the time I go for my October extension...back to USA for a bit and then re-enter on Visa exempt and then convert that to O locally. Sucks but that's reality...can only be a sucker for so long.

Edited June 17, 2021 by tonray

[nong38]

I will have to rely on Immigration to inform me of any changes next time we have a date. When I first came here there was talk of .5% land tax and we still await it so I think that although things are often spoken of they do not always happen. Do the police and Immigration really want to have more work thrust upon them?

Also I think these folks in cabinet dont have any idea how much retirees contribute to the economy because it a thought to far, right now its all about getting the Insurance situation on the move and some possible thank you. I expect local Immigration offices to apply or not apply any new rules and nothing is set in stone until its in the Royal Gazette then locally its a maybe. I really would have thought that the people in charge would have had better things to do and the priority right now is to get through the covid peak and get tourism back to normal and then covid will be confined to just another illness we have to learn to live with like the flu, Yellow fever, Dengi fever etc and the required insurance disappears into the ether. 

[Pib]

6 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

I can assure you that many times when something is approved in concept it gets changed and might be changed again before it is approved.

I assume the health ministry will be leading the committee set up to do it.

Saying the Health Ministry is leading the effort....a ministry lead by Khun Anutin....who has been doing an absolute outstanding job with only a few glitches in implementing/managing the Thailand COVID 19 vaccination problem (according to Anutin and his public relations dept) does zero to give me warm fuzzies.

[ubonjoe]

1 minute ago, Pib said:

Saying the Health Ministry is leading the effort....a ministry lead by Khun Anutin....who has been doing an absolute outstanding job with only a few glitches in implementing/managing the Thailand COVID 19 vaccination problem (according to Anutin and his public relations dept) does zero to give me warm fuzzies.

They lead the last one for the OA visa so am sure they will be doing it again.

[JimGant]

19 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

I can assure you that many times when something is approved in concept it gets changed

Yep, especially in this situation, where I'm sure you've got the Thai insurance companies now mandated for O-A extensions making loud noises about lost revenue.

[JimGant]

32 minutes ago, Pib said:

The marriage visa/extension is not covered by OA visa/extension rules....two different animals.

As I recall, doesn't your marriage extension emanate from your last Non Immigrant visa into Thailand, which was an O-A visa? Maybe the Thais do only think "retirement" in the context of O-A visas...

[ubonjoe]

13 minutes ago, JimGant said:

As I recall, doesn't your marriage extension emanate from your last Non Immigrant visa into Thailand, which was an O-A visa? Maybe the Thais do only think "retirement" in the context of O-A visas...

The extension based upon retirement is in clause 2.22 of the immigration order for extensions and marriage is in 2.18.

The requirements for one does not affect applying for a different one and it does not matter what type of visa is used for entry.

[JimGant]

1 hour ago, ubonjoe said:

and it does not matter what type of visa is used for entry.

....except a retirement extension off of a Non Imm O visa is not the same as a retirement extension off of a Non Imm O-A visa -- in terms of health insurance requirement. With that logic, hard to predict where this latest iteration is headed...

[ubonjoe]

13 minutes ago, JimGant said:

With that logic, hard to predict where this latest iteration is headed...

Many people have already changed to marriage from retirement with a OA visa without a problem and no insurance was required. I see no reason for that to change.

[Exploring Thailand]

2 hours ago, MRToMRT said:

I agree, its like "what's the point of the O-A" if the O is so easy by comparison. 

The advantage of the OA is that you only need to have 800k in a bank in your own country for a couple of months before you apply for the visa. Once you get the visa,  you can go for two years without needing to get an extension or get a new visa. You don't need to lock up any money a Thai bank. The disadvantage is the insurance. 

[MadMac]

4 minutes ago, Exploring Thailand said:

The advantage of the OA is that you only need to have 800k in a bank in your own country for a couple of months before you apply for the visa. Once you get the visa,  you can go for two years without needing to get an extension or get a new visa. You don't need to lock up any money a Thai bank. The disadvantage is the insurance. 

 

In which Thailand do you live? Borders are virtually closed and even if you manage to slip through it becomes quite costly to get back in. Would rather keep the money in a Thai bank and do yearly extensions rather than seeing it disappearing in your home country by inflation out of control and negative interest rates. Maybe you could try it with Phuket next month and an O-A.....oh wait.... ????

Edited June 17, 2021 by MadMac

[Exploring Thailand]

4 minutes ago, MadMac said:

 

In which Thailand do you live? Borders are virtually closed and even if you manage to slip through it becomes quite costly to get back in. Would rather keep the money in a Thai bank and do yearly extensions rather than seeing it disappearing in your home country by inflation out of control and negative interest rates. Maybe you could try it with Phuket next month and an O-A.....oh wait.... ????

 

That's cool. Everyone has their own preferred way of doing things. 

[DrJack54]

5 minutes ago, Exploring Thailand said:

 

That's cool. Everyone has their own preferred way of doing things. 

Non O-A doesn't tick many boxes at the moment. 

The fact that it's multi entry for first year is a mute point as currently borders closed.

To obtain 2nd year you would need to leave Thailand and re-enter. 

Finally you have the useless Thai health insurance and that would be ongoing if you then opted for extension. Also for extension the 800k would need to be in Thai bank 

[ThailandRyan]

3 minutes ago, DrJack54 said:

Non O-A doesn't tick many boxes at the moment. 

The fact that it's multi entry for first year is a mute point as currently borders closed.

To obtain 2nd year you would need to leave Thailand and re-enter. 

Finally you have the useless Thai health insurance and that would be ongoing if you then opted for extension. Also for extension the 800k would need to be in Thai bank 

Originally, the way we used the O-A was perfect, prior to covid.  Having to have the Insurance did become an issue at extension time but in the end it is one hoop that actually works out in my favor as it and my US based insurance work together and I end up paying nothing for my medical treatment.  Yes the policy costs a little bit of coin, but then the policy I ended up buying covers dental and vision as well.  It is almost a wash by the time the annual premium comes along.  The 800K is a pain with it collecting very little interest as it sits in the THai bank fixed account and not truly working for me, but then the lack of having to have 12 months of statements at extension times seems to be better.

[Exploring Thailand]

1 minute ago, DrJack54 said:

Non O-A doesn't tick many boxes at the moment. 

The fact that it's multi entry for first year is a mute point as currently borders closed.

To obtain 2nd year you would need to leave Thailand and re-enter. 

Finally you have the useless Thai health insurance and that would be ongoing if you then opted for extension. Also for extension the 800k would need to be in Thai bank 

 

I'll need a new visa within a few months. If a way opens up to make a relatively painless return trip to the UK, I'll get an OA. It would be a year after that before I'd need to leave the country. Two years after getting the visa, I'd go back to the UK and get another one.  During that two years the 800k is mine to do with as I please. It will be  completely up to me how much I keep in my Thai accounts and how much I keep elsewhere.

 

It's just a choice. Other people prefer to do things differently. 

[DrJack54]

2 minutes ago, Exploring Thailand said:

I'll need a new visa within a few months.

How did you last enter Thailand. Meaning what type of visa? 

[Exploring Thailand]

Just now, DrJack54 said:

How did you last enter Thailand. Meaning what type of visa? 

On an OA, but I couldn't leave to get stamped back in for another year so I had to get an extension.

[DrJack54]

7 minutes ago, Exploring Thailand said:

On an OA, but I couldn't leave to get stamped back in for another year so I had to get an extension.

Depending on how quickly you wish to return to UK, you could obtain covid extensions which will most likely be available untill borders open. 

[Exploring Thailand]

4 minutes ago, DrJack54 said:

Depending on how quickly you wish to return to UK, you could obtain covid extensions which will most likely be available untill borders open. 

 

Right. I have a retirement extension, so I have plenty of options. I'd just prefer the OA if I can get it without too much hassle.

[Polaky]

It is a toss up between OA and O based on retirement, Initially in Au you need the visa $300.00, you need the useless health Insurance around $300.00, then you need covid Insurance $650.00, then quarantine or Alcatraz a minimum of $1000.00, before your free to hunt down a cheap condo to stay in.

 

where with an o.........

Enter on a tourist visa $0.00, covid Insurance $120.00 for a month, quarantine or alcatraz $1000.00, then apply for an O $100.00, shove $30,000 in a Thai Bank acc, extension $100.00,

get a decent health insurance in country $?,

this one does appear to be the most obvious winner, however not everyone has $30,000 to let sit idle, and that is the sticking point.

 

Gone are the days when you could enter without any type of insurance, and if injured rely on a GoFundMe to get you out of strife, Insurance is the bulk of the cost besides living expenses.

 

At this particular time in AU you cannot buy any type of covid Insurance due to the borders being shut tight, and you would be struggling to get travel insurance of any description unless it is domestic, that's why us/uk, etc, have the upper hand.

[david555]

1 hour ago, Polaky said:

It is a toss up between OA and O based on retirement, Initially in Au you need the visa $300.00, you need the useless health Insurance around $300.00, then you need covid Insurance $650.00, then quarantine or Alcatraz a minimum of $1000.00, before your free to hunt down a cheap condo to stay in.

 

where with an o.........

Enter on a tourist visa $0.00, covid Insurance $120.00 for a month, quarantine or alcatraz $1000.00, then apply for an O $100.00, shove $30,000 in a Thai Bank acc, extension $100.00,

get a decent health insurance in country $?,

this one does appear to be the most obvious winner, however not everyone has $30,000 to let sit idle, and that is the sticking point.

 

Gone are the days when you could enter without any type of insurance, and if injured rely on a GoFundMe to get you out of strife, Insurance is the bulk of the cost besides living expenses.

 

At this particular time in AU you cannot buy any type of covid Insurance due to the borders being shut tight, and you would be struggling to get travel insurance of any description unless it is domestic, that's why us/uk, etc, have the upper hand.

This was my thinking ....why they started with the O-A  ..? must have had an advantage ???? ..., could it be that " no money on Thai bank needed ..",( could open possibility to use a short term loan from family/friends or even a financial institute )????..., while the "o" from beginning needed 800K on Thai bank and frozen use for 2 month's before and 5 month's after application ..... an then free to use 7month's..... but only half ????

and can/could squeeze almost 2 years out of it if ,planning border hopping at the   last month becoming  another year stay earning ....????

 

But true...! Thailand changed the goal posts for that while the Non O-A's where playing the game 

Edited June 17, 2021 by david555