Chelseafan Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 2 minutes ago, KhaoNiaw said: Israel saying that efficiency of Pfizer in preventing symptomatic disease dropped to 64% against Delta but still highly effective against serious disease and hospitalization.https://www.timesofisrael.com/israel-confirms-vaccine-less-effective-against-delta-variant-eyes-third-dose/ That's about spreading of the virus rather than deaths, Sorry if I wasn't clear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chelseafan Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 1 minute ago, placeholder said: Actually there's plenty of evidence that shows that the vaccines are less effective against the Delta variant How well COVID-19 vaccines work against the Delta variant, according to the best available data https://www.businessinsider.com/delta-variant-covid-vaccine-effectiveness-protection-pfizer-moderna-astrazeneca-2021-7 That said, even though the leading vaccines are somewhat less effective against infection, they still are effective. Even more so against hospitalizaton and death. It's death prevention I was on about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
placeholder Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 4 minutes ago, shdmn said: With more countries being added almost daily now that are not mentioned in that article, such as Germany now. But it's kind of a one-off and in countries where the AZ vaccine was not used, such as the USA, approval could be slow. In fact, the Nature article you linked to, said that scientists would precede cautiously and that large scale studies were warranted. Although that opinion was not universal. Personally, I think the need for caution is overblown. But even if my opinion were printed on paper, it might be worth the paper it was printed on but no more than that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
placeholder Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 7 minutes ago, KhaoNiaw said: Israel saying that efficiency of Pfizer in preventing symptomatic disease dropped to 64% against Delta but still highly effective against serious disease and hospitalization.https://www.timesofisrael.com/israel-confirms-vaccine-less-effective-against-delta-variant-eyes-third-dose/ Epidemiologists mostly think that figure was too low. But they do believe that Pfizer is less effective in preventing symptomatic disease. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smedly Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 (edited) 34 minutes ago, placeholder said: Well, I read the Reuters link that shdmn provided and it says many counties are allowing mixed inoculations in the case where the AZ vaccine was administered first. This because of questions about blood clots. you are twisting this for the sake of argument - rather silly either way fully vaccinated means 2 doses of any single vaccine unless it is approved otherwise (J&J) - there are no examples of two single doses of vaccine being recommended from two different manufacturers that are not from the same family of operation and even then that is yet to be fully researched Currently fully Vaccinated means at least two doses of the same vaccine - period Edited July 12, 2021 by smedly 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
placeholder Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 Just now, smedly said: you are twisting this for the sake of argument - rather silly either way fully vaccinated means 2 doses of any single vaccine unless it is approved otherwise - there are no examples of a two single doses of vaccine being recommended (unless J&J) from two different manufacturers that are not from the same family of operation and even then that is yet to be fully researched Currently fully Vaccinated means at least two doses of the same vaccine - period It means whatever the health authorities in said countries decide what it means. If Germany says AZ + Biontech means you are fully vaccinated, then you're fully vaccinated and entitled to all the privileges that being fully vaccinated encompasses. There ain't no pope when it comes to vaccines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smedly Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 (edited) 16 minutes ago, placeholder said: It means whatever the health authorities in said countries decide what it means. If Germany says AZ + Biontech means you are fully vaccinated, then you're fully vaccinated and entitled to all the privileges that being fully vaccinated encompasses. There ain't no pope when it comes to vaccines. is that one dose each ? if so do both the vaccines have same mode of operation There is no evidence that supports what Thailand is doing with one shot AZ and one shot sinovac which is what this topic is about There is evidence that supports one shot AZ and one shot mRNA but that is not what Thailand is doing Edited July 12, 2021 by smedly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
webfact Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 AstraZeneca to be 2nd dose after Sinovac 1st dose, booster for medics REUTERS/Lee Smith On Monday, Thailand’s National Communicable Disease Committee (NCDC) approved the use of the AstraZeneca vaccine as a second dose for people who have already received just their first dose of the Sinovac vaccine, with an interval of 3-4 weeks between doses. The British-Swedish AstraZeneca vaccine will also be used as the third “booster” shot for medical personnel, the majority of whom have been inoculated with China’s Sinovac, according to Public Health Minister Anutin Charnvirakul, in his capacity as the chair of the NCDC meeting. The move comes after several medics and others, fully inoculated with Sinovac’s CoronaVac, were still infected by the virus which causes COVID-19, expert medical findings that the Chinese vaccine is ineffective against the virulent Delta variant and calls for mRNA booster shots for medics who are most at risk of infection. Full story: https://www.thaipbsworld.com/astrazeneca-to-be-2nd-dose-after-sinovac-1st-dose-booster-for-medics/ -- © Copyright Thai PBS 2021-07-13 - Whatever you're going through, the Samaritans are here for you - Follow ASEAN NOW on LINE for breaking COVID-19 updates Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post RichardColeman Posted July 12, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted July 12, 2021 8 minutes ago, webfact said: expert medical findings that the Chinese vaccine is ineffective against the virulent Delta variant I guess this is what happens when you give money to Generals with absolutely no medical knowledge 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerrymahoney Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 Thailand to Follow Sinovac With Astra Vaccine in World First By Randy Thanthong-Knight July 12, 2021, 6:25 AM EDT Thailand will start administering the Sinovac Biotech Ltd. and AstraZeneca Plc shots as part of one Covid-19 vaccine regime, in a world first aimed at increasing protection against the more contagious delta variant. The Southeast Asian nation will start giving the China-made Sinovac vaccine as a first shot to be followed by Astra three to four weeks later, health ministry officials said at a briefing near Bangkok Monday. The decision is based on three separate local studies, which showed that following Sinovac with Astra elicited an immune response that’s as high as using two doses of Astra 12 weeks apart, according to Opas Karnkawinpong, director-general of Thailand’s Department of Disease Control. The new regime will allow the nation to quickly ramp up immunity against the delta variant, Opas said. https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-07-12/thailand-to-follow-sinovac-with-astra-vaccine-in-world-first 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harada Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 10 hours ago, Thailand said: Absolute panic has set in with the gov running around like headless chickens. How is it possible to get something so wrong? The power of money of course! This is what happens when you have a “government” stacked with those aligned to a certain military faction and their cronies instead of intelligent people, the situation in Burma now is a prime example of how things can turn out. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blumpie Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 Boost protection? Sinovac does basically nothing. It's more like get protection. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benmart Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 13 hours ago, jazzdog32095 said: Go ask everyone out sitting on that beach suffering from hunger if they're greedy and then if you survive get back with us. I agree. I am not qualified, nor interested in playing the judge of the needy or greedy. I am thankful that I can share and am in good health. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post wensiensheng Posted July 13, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted July 13, 2021 I think the point that has drifted out of focus on a lot of posts is that Thailand is not talking about using one shot of AZ and one shot of an mRNA vaccine. That combo HAS been used in some countries and as, as someone posted, it’s what Angela merkel did. what Thailand is doing, to combat the delta strain, is using one dose of sinovac and one dose of AZ. The issue here being that 2 doses of sinovac is not perceived as enough protection, so it’s being cut to just the one, and AZ added. but AZ is perceived as only marginally better than sinovac against delta, or at least it’s own effectiveness is drastically cut. in layman’s terms it’s weakest vaccine plus next less weakest vaccine. whereas, AZ plus an mRNA would in layman’s terms be described as second least effective plus one of the “best”. so if sinovac is a 1, and AZ a 2, and an mRNA a 3, what Thailand is doing adds up to 3. The other combo being used in other countries adds up to 5. I deliberately haven’t gone into detail about actual percentage protection provided etc etc, I’m just trying to point out why people may perceive what Thailand is doing as being less than ideal. Basically it’s the inclusion of sinovac as one of the constituents in the combo. 3 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post wensiensheng Posted July 13, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted July 13, 2021 (edited) 3 hours ago, jerrymahoney said: Thailand to Follow Sinovac With Astra Vaccine in World First By Randy Thanthong-Knight July 12, 2021, 6:25 AM EDT Thailand will start administering the Sinovac Biotech Ltd. and AstraZeneca Plc shots as part of one Covid-19 vaccine regime, in a world first aimed at increasing protection against the more contagious delta variant. The Southeast Asian nation will start giving the China-made Sinovac vaccine as a first shot to be followed by Astra three to four weeks later, health ministry officials said at a briefing near Bangkok Monday. The decision is based on three separate local studies, which showed that following Sinovac with Astra elicited an immune response that’s as high as using two doses of Astra 12 weeks apart, according to Opas Karnkawinpong, director-general of Thailand’s Department of Disease Control. The new regime will allow the nation to quickly ramp up immunity against the delta variant, Opas said. https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-07-12/thailand-to-follow-sinovac-with-astra-vaccine-in-world-first That article you linked. it says the boost in protection came from 3 local studies in Thailand. For some people, that’s a question mark right there, rightly or wrongly. it also says that from the 3 local studies it was noted that a sinovac and AZ jab gave protection equal to 2 AZ shots. A couple of points on that. Firstly, for some, 2 AZ doesn’t provide the same level of protection as an mRNA vaccine because AZ itself is less effective against delta. Secondly, the studies are so short in time frame, no one knows if the level,of protection is maintained. finally, the article gives no detail of the 3 local studies, size of sample, time frame, participant ages etc. basically, the article merely says what the Thai doctor says, which isn’t much and is unverified. not saying the sinoAZ mix is no good, just saying that the article you posted doesn’t prove it is Edited July 13, 2021 by wensiensheng 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayD Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 Come on guys, be positive. Thailand now has the opportunity to be the first country to acquire natural herd immunity to Covid. Win! If you get sick, walk it off. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerrymahoney Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 (edited) As to the post a notch above, his name is Michael R. Bloomberg but people call him Mike. I'd guess he'd love to here from you as to his shortfalls of his reporting. Edited July 13, 2021 by jerrymahoney Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harada Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 Cocktail sir, we call this one the Dr Anutin, enjoy. ???? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colinneil Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 Just now, RayD said: Come on guys, be positive. If you get sick, walk it off. I am always positive, so you reckon if i get sick walk it off...... I wish.???????? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vandeventer Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 (edited) 13 hours ago, Surelynot said: Guess they are going to continue to use the current stocks of Sinovac for a first jab regardless......... rather than throw it away. It seem like there is no use by date on Sinovac and it keeps growing and growing. Soon they will tell us it's great in coffee. Edited July 13, 2021 by vandeventer 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dougiemac52 Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 So basically another case of make it up as they go along. You couldn't write a script for thailand at present with all the happenings at the Sandbox. That's why I'm going to ASQ then travel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buriramfelang Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 14 hours ago, bkk6060 said: Wow very interesting. So, those that have only one Sinovac will now get a Astrazeneca? Sounds good but have there been sufficient studies on the safety/efficacy of this mix of vaccines? Why throw away all those Sinovac shots they got for free ???? Sounds like they're crossing their fingers and hoping for the best. ???????? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post smedly Posted July 13, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted July 13, 2021 I've been doing some reading on this and there have been studies that support the use of AZ (one dose) and an mRNA vaccine (one dose) But that is "NOT" what Thailand is doing The so called studies they claim to have done are were exactly - lack of details remains an issue with this no matter what they claim 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heybuz Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 12 hours ago, gearbox said: World's first...however in EU and Australia people got AZ + different shot when AZ was dumped. Not sure about all the combinations but Pfizer was widely used. So there is already a precedent of mixing vaccines. AZ hasn't been dumped, its still being given . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heybuz Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 31 minutes ago, harada said: Cocktail sir, we call this one the Dr Anutin, enjoy. ???? or the dr do nuthin 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hotchilli Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 15 hours ago, snoop1130 said: BANGKOK (Reuters) -Thailand will use AstraZeneca Plc's COVID-19 vaccine as a second dose for those who received Sinovac's shot as their first dose in a bid to increase protection, it said on Monday Just drop the Sino rubbish, it's been proven to be useless against the Delta variant... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hotchilli Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 14 hours ago, greenmonkey said: Now they are really in the s#%t! This is the govt basically admitting that sinovac is useless but thats all we got so tough. Seriously, will the Thai's stand for this!? I hope not. If they start to use AZ as a booster for all those in the medical field and as a second jab after Sino-s**t that's going to push back the vaccine roll-out for everyone else... I think the 120 day open Thailand has just hit a a brick wall. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4MyEgo Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 (edited) 15 hours ago, snoop1130 said: There have been no studies specifically on mixing Sinovac and AstraZeneca released, but a growing number of countries are looking at mix-and-match of different vaccines or giving a third booster dose amid concerns new and more contagious variants may escape approved vaccines. Why not, it's ALL one big experiment at the moment, however I do have a question for Anutin, will he be getting a booster with AZ ? Edited July 13, 2021 by 4MyEgo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isaan sailor Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 14 hours ago, grego49 said: Will all the brown envelopes have to be returned, Yes, however those brown envelopes will be empty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isaan sailor Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 Need to find good use for those millions of doses of SinoVac. Could they vaccinate the soy dogs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now