Duration of health insurance req'd for Thailand Pass for non 'o' retirement visa holders

[stat]

On 11/5/2021 at 7:12 AM, DrJack54 said:

Correct.

Sort of ridiculous.

I just renewed my extension and would like to visit Oz briefly early next year.

Will mean that I will be stamped in with ~ 10 months on my entry stamp.

Insurance required for that period. Stupid.

Maybe I am mistaken but it was mentioned beforehand in some other exchange, that you only get stamped in until the date you are covered by heath insurance, even if you have a longer running visa. So you have the option of just buying 2 months of coverage AFAIK.

[DrJack54]

7 hours ago, stat said:

Maybe I am mistaken but it was mentioned beforehand in some other exchange, that you only get stamped in until the date you are covered by heath insurance, even if you have a longer running visa. So you have the option of just buying 2 months of coverage AFAIK.

True, you should be stamped in till the date that your insurance expires, however you would need to apply for a new annual extension.

Not a good plan.

[flexomike]

On 11/5/2021 at 2:44 PM, Salerno said:

That's no longer the requirement.

it is for an OA extension 

[spidermike007]

On 11/4/2021 at 10:42 PM, Robin said:

This level of insurance becomes prohibitive for any retiree, like me, over 75.  Looks to me as if i am now trapped in Thailand for life, can go back to UK and stay there.

if there any way of working round this?

I want to retire to Thailand, with the option to travel back to UK, or anywhere else i want to/ can afford to.  Now that seems o be taken away, Thailand becomes less attractive.

How do Thailand Elite Visa holders fit into this?

My impression is that this medical insurance is a way of Thailand screwing us for more money.

Not only is this going to affect Retirees, but how many genuine tourists will want to pay for this insurance?

Is this he end of Thailand as the free and easy travel destination?  

Is there any chance that this rule will be dropped if/when it is seen to reduce tourist numbers?

Thailand. The hub of "less friendly to ex-pats", by the month. They truly don't want us around. 

 

The people are fine. It is the government crocodiles that are the problem. 

[fredscats]

On 11/5/2021 at 6:56 PM, khunPer said:

What seems to be quite confusing is, if the $50,000 so-called "health insurance" is the former $100,000 Covid-19 insurance, just reduced to half coverage, or if it means a real health insurance - i.e. cannot be a travel insurance if are living permanently in Thailand - such an insurance might be almost impossible for numerous elder expats.

Friend.. healthy 84,left Thailand for eye operation in UK  18months ago now along  with Thai wife.....stuck there due to covid...now new insurance demand, he never will get back to Thailand,plus his property/possessions(cars/bikes)  wasted    As you say impossible for the likes of him

[actonion]

So,  am i right in thinking  that if you wish to travel out side of Thailand,  the cheapest way for a Non o Visa holder would be to go out and back as close to  the end of your Retirement visa as possible, minimising  the length  of your insurance coverage?

[Salerno]

28 minutes ago, flexomike said:

it is for an OA extension 

Time will tell, the change to the requirements where allegedly partly justified by the change to foreign or Thai insurance.

[DrJack54]

24 minutes ago, actonion said:

So,  am i right in thinking  that if you wish to travel out side of Thailand,  the cheapest way for a Non o Visa holder would be to go out and back as close to  the end of your Retirement visa as possible, minimising  the length  of your insurance coverage?

That's correct. Also clearly ridiculous.

One would hope that the rules might be "modified" at some point in the future so that the required insurance is not determined by your stamped in period.

Thread in news forum re how unfair this is for retired folk living here in Thailand.

 

[superal]

2 hours ago, DrJack54 said:

That's correct. Also clearly ridiculous.

One would hope that the rules might be "modified" at some point in the future so that the required insurance is not determined by your stamped in period.

Thread in news forum re how unfair this is for retired folk living here in Thailand.

 

There are issues of concern with the new health insurance . In essence it would be a good proposal if it was affordable to the more senior retirees and it has to be said that there has been no consideration given to this sector .  When the insurance was announced there was not an attached statement on the reasoning of its introduction . No mention of the effects that it would have on the more senior expats . So the decision made by the government was either not thought through , or was made with underlying motives to exclude certain expats ?  Indeed if the insurance idea was made with good intentions there was / is an opportunity to enrol expats on to the government health scheme at a higher but affordable rate than that of the Thai national .

  Past retrospective laws and rules should be considered .

 

[notrub]

I leave 1M THB in a Thai bank just to avoid the 3 month before and 3 month after check for visa extension.  Or whatever it is.  Juggling bank accounts to conform with whatever the immigration authorities dream up this, or next month is not my idea of fun.  I am 73 and cannot get health insurance, besides which I have French national insurance and will go there for my next new knee.  If they want to make sure we pay our hospital bills why not require us to leave a reasonable amount on deposit with the health department?  Reasonable is the key word here.

 

As far as attracting wealthy residents here what about the over 300,000 (as of 2018) expats who live throughout the country.  If we are all spending about 1M THB a year (Some more, some less) it comes to 300 billion baht injected, in part, into the local economy.  

[soi3eddie]

My experience. I entered Thailand on Thai Pass on 4th November and will stay to 15th December. My non-o extension of stay based on retirement expires on 4th May 2022. I bought insurance for 3rd November to 15th December. My Thai Pass was issued on this basis. I expected the immigration officer to stamp me only to 15th December BUT I was surprised to see permission to stay for the full duration on my extension of stay (4th May 2022). I was not questioned about my intentions. Was this a one-off or have others had this happen?

[jwest10]

On 11/5/2021 at 12:42 PM, Robin said:

This level of insurance becomes prohibitive for any retiree, like me, over 75.  Looks to me as if i am now trapped in Thailand for life, can go back to UK and stay there.

if there any way of working round this?

I want to retire to Thailand, with the option to travel back to UK, or anywhere else i want to/ can afford to.  Now that seems o be taken away, Thailand becomes less attractive.

How do Thailand Elite Visa holders fit into this?

My impression is that this medical insurance is a way of Thailand screwing us for more money.

Not only is this going to affect Retirees, but how many genuine tourists will want to pay for this insurance?

Is this he end of Thailand as the free and easy travel destination?  

Is there any chance that this rule will be dropped if/when it is seen to reduce tourist numbers?

Indeed great post and it is very very confusing this TP indeed

[superal]

28 minutes ago, notrub said:

I leave 1M THB in a Thai bank just to avoid the 3 month before and 3 month after check for visa extension.  Or whatever it is.  Juggling bank accounts to conform with whatever the immigration authorities dream up this, or next month is not my idea of fun.  I am 73 and cannot get health insurance, besides which I have French national insurance and will go there for my next new knee.  If they want to make sure we pay our hospital bills why not require us to leave a reasonable amount on deposit with the health department?  Reasonable is the key word here.

 

As far as attracting wealthy residents here what about the over 300,000 (as of 2018) expats who live throughout the country.  If we are all spending about 1M THB a year (Some more, some less) it comes to 300 billion baht injected, in part, into the local economy.  

Taxing expats at the Thai rate on gross income ( no allowances ) could be a way to enrol expats on to the government health scheme , thus simplifying health insurance problems .

Regarding your new knee operation . In the UK there is a waiting list of between 3 and 5 years , is that not the case in France ?

[DrJack54]

18 minutes ago, soi3eddie said:

was not questioned about my intentions. Was this a one-off or have others had this happen?

There is at least one report of similar that I have read on AseanNow.

I don't get it.

If that "loophole" works then anyone can enter eg indicate 30 day stay for their TP then at passport control (immigration) at Thai airport can point out their reentry permit and receive permission of stay according to that date. 

I don't get the "period of stay" on the TP application.

How many are coming here visa exempt (just one example) with zero intention of having "period of stay" of 30 days.

[notrub]

33 minutes ago, soi3eddie said:

My experience. I entered Thailand on Thai Pass on 4th November and will stay to 15th December. My non-o extension of stay based on retirement expires on 4th May 2022. I bought insurance for 3rd November to 15th December. My Thai Pass was issued on this basis. I expected the immigration officer to stamp me only to 15th December BUT I was surprised to see permission to stay for the full duration on my extension of stay (4th May 2022). I was not questioned about my intentions. Was this a one-off or have others had this happen?

I will be coming back early Dec. and my 'O' visa extension is up for renewal end of Jan.  I bought 2 months 'Thailand Pass' health insurance from TUNE.  

 

The excuse for health insurance that foreigners are running up big bills at hospitals and then doing a 'runner' is a load of malarkey.  You would not get out of the hospital, let alone the country, until every baht was paid.  Nice little earner for Thai insurance companies.

[soi3eddie]

2 minutes ago, notrub said:

I will be coming back early Dec. and my 'O' visa extension is up for renewal end of Jan.  I bought 2 months 'Thailand Pass' health insurance from TUNE.  

 

The excuse for health insurance that foreigners are running up big bills at hospitals and then doing a 'runner' is a load of malarkey.  You would not get out of the hospital, let alone the country, until every baht was paid.  Nice little earner for Thai insurance companies.

The Thai Insurance companies got nothing out of me. I used Atlas Worldtrips from USA as it not only gave the required coverage for Covid but also medical to 1 million USD which includes any injury sustained whilst riding a motorcycle. Most other policies exclude medical claims as a result of a motorcycle accident.

 

[jwest10]

On 11/7/2021 at 9:58 AM, superal said:

Tourists on say a 2 or 3 week holiday will qualify to enter Thailand with travel insurance that is in most cases not too expensive but for Thailand based retirees who are returning to Thailand after a trip abroad  long term health insurance is a different matter . The private health insurance in Thailand is beyond the means of many expats , some of whom have lived here for many years , married and have families in Thailand . There has been no empathy or consideration given to these cases . 

Why would the Thai government design the C.O.E. and incorporate a $100k covid insurance( without health insurance ) and in the same year announce the renaissance of Thailand along with a reconfigured C.O.E. in the guise of the Thailand Pass which now includes $50k health insurance , knowing full well that it is not achievable for many expats . Don't have to be a Sherlock to work it out . Now if the government were sincere they could enroll long stay expats onto their universal health care system , which is aligned with government hospitals , and charge an annual fee of income of 14 % which is approximately the tax rate that covers employed Thais and entitles them to medical services . New retirees could be an alternative arrangement .  

superrai
 

Wonderful post and my family have tried several times for me to be included on the family health policy and no joy at all.
Yes they do not take that you supply and keep your wonderful Thai family and provide them with a home and yes some members of family,(though not wife) but sisters and brothers work at the local hospital and that definately not included.
Yes, very strange and yes provided for them and yes we wanted to as well but surely something could be done and this has been mentioned by many people before and takes nothing in account of property provided but believe the Thais have to prove that it is their own money.
Yeah how exactly

[redwood1]

9 minutes ago, notrub said:

I will be coming back early Dec. and my 'O' visa extension is up for renewal end of Jan.  I bought 2 months 'Thailand Pass' health insurance from TUNE.  

 

The excuse for health insurance that foreigners are running up big bills at hospitals and then doing a 'runner' is a load of malarkey.  You would not get out of the hospital, let alone the country, until every baht was paid.  Nice little earner for Thai insurance companies.

I agree 100%......Farangs almost always pay, the hospitals make sure of that...Illegal immigrants might be a different story... 

 

They have been desperate to impose expensive and worthless insurance on farangs and tourist for many years.........Its all a total in your face SCAM....

Edited November 9, 2021 by redwood1

[jwest10]

On 11/7/2021 at 10:11 AM, Boomer6969 said:

There's another one, for those who have to travel early in their extension, just do it without reentry permit. Come back without visa, apply for Non-O, and restart extension. That's a couple of days work but well worth the 30000 savings to be made.

 

Also, it is probably easier if married in Thailand.

Won't you have to start all over again and a non o from start or have I missed something? and surely one needs an reentry permit?

 

Edited November 9, 2021 by jwest10

[Salerno]

9 minutes ago, jwest10 said:

Won't you have to start all over again and a non o from start or have I missed something?

Yes.

 

9 minutes ago, jwest10 said:

and surely one needs an reentry permit?

No, that would defeat the point.

[DrJack54]

18 minutes ago, jwest10 said:

Won't you have to start all over again and a non o from start or have I missed something? and surely one needs an reentry permit?

 

My own situation can serve as an example. So renewed my annual extension last week and wish to take short trip home in near...ish future. Haven't seen family there for almost couple of years.

Yes purchase a reentry permit and then what. I will be stamped back in till Nov 2022.

Requiring virtually a years insurance.

Don't know the cost however depending of the cost re-enter visa exempt and obtaining new non O inside Thailand becomes an option.

Of course it all depends on cost of insurance which in turn dependent on age etc.

It's a mad hatters tea party.

 

Edited November 9, 2021 by DrJack54

[jwest10]

6 hours ago, DrJack54 said:

True, you should be stamped in till the date that your insurance expires, however you would need to apply for a new annual extension.

Not a good plan.

Dr Jack
That was my understanding indeed and been reading posts on here stating do not get a re-enty permit but surely along with insurance.
One word of caution and slightly off topic but several years a go I knew a person who was renewing his extension based on being married to a Thai and the local bank stated the money in account was in his name only and they sent it to Bangkok but got a message stating that it was not indeed just in his own name and stated he would have to start all over from outside Thailand ie a non o extension!

[notrub]

36 minutes ago, soi3eddie said:

The Thai Insurance companies got nothing out of me. I used Atlas Worldtrips from USA as it not only gave the required coverage for Covid but also medical to 1 million USD which includes any injury sustained whilst riding a motorcycle. Most other policies exclude medical claims as a result of a motorcycle accident.

 

You are the one fish that got away.  Many of us did not and we are buying insurance from Thai companies or Thai subsidiaries of world insurance conglomerates.  It makes no difference, it all goes into the billionaire's 'Need for Greed'. 

[jwest10]

1 hour ago, DrJack54 said:

My own situation can serve as an example. So renewed my annual extension last week and wish to take short trip home in near...ish future. Haven't seen family there for almost couple of years.

Yes purchase a reentry permit and then what. I will be stamped back in till Nov 2022.

Requiring virtually a years insurance.

Don't know the cost however depending of the cost re-enter visa exempt and obtaining new non O inside Thailand becomes an option.

Of course it all depends on cost of insurance which in turn dependent on age etc.

It's a mad hatters tea party.

 

Am I missing something if you go out of the country you definately need an re-entry permit and surely you can not then apply for an exempt visa on return to Thailand together with insurance!!

[DrJack54]

7 minutes ago, jwest10 said:

Am I missing something if you go out of the country you definately need an re-entry permit and surely you can not then apply for an exempt visa on return to Thailand together with insurance!!

To return visa exempt you would have to NOT obtain a reentry permit.

I didn't explain it clearly.

 

The choice would be to buy a reentry permit keeping extension alive and then on return be stamped in for it's duration and buy insurance to cover that period.

 

OR .....Exit without reentry permit. That kills off  permission of stay and enables you to enter visa exempt. 

In the visa exempt entry scenario only 30 day insurance required.

 

Edited November 9, 2021 by DrJack54

[Salerno]

7 minutes ago, jwest10 said:

Am I missing something

Yes, as I replied before, getting a re-entry permit defeats the purpose.

[jwest10]

Just now, DrJack54 said:

To return visa exempt you would have to NOT obtain a reentry permit.

I didn't explain it clearly.

The choice would be to buy a reentry permit keeping my extension alive and then be stamped in for it's duration and buy insurance to cover that period.

OR .....Exit without reentry permit. That kills off my permission of stay and enables you to enter visa exempt. 

In the visa exempt entry scenario only 30 day insurance required.

 

drjack54
LOL it is me and everything seems so complicated these days and yes the rules seem to change on all topics too.
You really have to laugh these days.

[stat]

9 hours ago, DrJack54 said:

True, you should be stamped in till the date that your insurance expires, however you would need to apply for a new annual extension.

Not a good plan.

Thank you for your post! So lets clarify for my understanding. I enter with visa (OA for example) on 1 Jan and have only 3 month insurance. So I get stamped in until 31 March. Then I leave on 31 March and come back 3 June with new insurance valid for 1 year and get a stamp until June 3 2023. After that and only after I would need an extension AFAIK. The important point beeing to the OP was if he is allowed entry at all and to understanding he gets the stamp until he is cover by health insurance.

[notrub]

21 hours ago, DrJack54 said:

To return visa exempt you would have to NOT obtain a reentry permit.

I didn't explain it clearly.

 

The choice would be to buy a reentry permit keeping extension alive and then on return be stamped in for it's duration and buy insurance to cover that period.

 

OR .....Exit without reentry permit. That kills off  permission of stay and enables you to enter visa exempt. 

In the visa exempt entry scenario only 30 day insurance required.

 

With no re entry stamp the existing 'O' or other visa is cancelled on exit.  You have to start again.

[DrJack54]

3 minutes ago, notrub said:

With no re entry stamp the existing 'O' or other visa is cancelled on exit.  You have to start again.

For some people that is the whole idea. 

In case of killing off a non O-A it may be for the nonsense Thai insurance requirement ongoing for extensions and for non O folk it's being discussed as a balancing act against cost of 50k compulsory insurance for TP.

In my case if I took quick trip home (Oz) now upon return I would require insurance for almost 12 months.