Engine seize

[talahtnut]

My dear old dad collected car from it 500 mile service,

they hadn't even bothered to put the drain plug in.

Since then I learnt to do my own servicing, hardly quantum mechnics, is it.

Edited January 18, 2022 by talahtnut
addition

[Yellowtail]

2 minutes ago, Kwasaki said:

I trust my local Cockpit who has been servicing all my different vehicles for 15 years but I still check the oil when I get home ????.

 

Having been an engineer it has become a habit I  can understand some people not doing it. 

 

Remember the time of petrol service station in UK asking would you like me to check your oil sir. ????

After a service I always check before I leave. Most/all of the time they walk me out and check it in front of me. 

[Ralf001]

1 hour ago, Kwasaki said:

Well he said it didn't can't make head or tail of it.

The explanation would be the garage emptied the oil and forgot to replace it that's why sump pan was dirty. 

After leaving the garage the owner never check out anything when he got home. 

The oil light couldn't of been working the temperature gauge couldn't of been working the whole thing doesn't make sense. 

The whole story is full of holes and inconsistencies.

 

Stripped belts visible as well apparently... what belts ?

 

I suspect the full story will never be revealed.

[Kwasaki]

38 minutes ago, Ralf001 said:

The whole story is full of holes and inconsistencies.

 

Stripped belts visible as well apparently... what belts ?

 

I suspect the full story will never be revealed.

Yeah I'm always intersted to know the out come but not all come back with the final explaination and how it was solved.

[Woof999]

6 hours ago, transam said:

Where is the OP, been on here 6 months and this is his first post...????

I'm right here pal. I asked what I thought was a sensible question, providing a reasonable amount of relevant info, and holding my hand up to say that my oil level checking could have been better.

 

Twice in this thread you've suggested that there is something amiss here. Speak your mind - are you suggesting I'm lying, deliberately or not?

 

I don't post for approx 24 hours (because funnily enough I have no car right now and I do occasionally go out) and you're asking where I am?

 

My main question was... on taking a car into a main dealer with an engine related issue, it is reasonable for them not to bother checking the oil level? 

 

I'll now add to that, based on some of the replies - what labour charge do you think they would likely add for a 30 second check that a customer is likely to query?

 

Final info, the main dealer has since spoken to my wife, acknowledged that the oil SHOULD have been checked and offered an apology. We're yet to have a real discussion on the $$$ that will be involved, but my first though is that a garage that can't get an oil check right probably shouldn't be doing a major engine rebuild either.

[EVENKEEL]

5 hours ago, Woof999 said:

I'm right here pal. I asked what I thought was a sensible question, providing a reasonable amount of relevant info, and holding my hand up to say that my oil level checking could have been better.

 

Twice in this thread you've suggested that there is something amiss here. Speak your mind - are you suggesting I'm lying, deliberately or not?

 

I don't post for approx 24 hours (because funnily enough I have no car right now and I do occasionally go out) and you're asking where I am?

 

My main question was... on taking a car into a main dealer with an engine related issue, it is reasonable for them not to bother checking the oil level? 

 

I'll now add to that, based on some of the replies - what labour charge do you think they would likely add for a 30 second check that a customer is likely to query?

 

Final info, the main dealer has since spoken to my wife, acknowledged that the oil SHOULD have been checked and offered an apology. We're yet to have a real discussion on the $$$ that will be involved, but my first though is that a garage that can't get an oil check right probably shouldn't be doing a major engine rebuild either.

In all honesty do you expect anything in the form of compensation from these guys?

[Woof999]

9 minutes ago, EVENKEEL said:

In all honesty do you expect anything in the form of compensation from these guys?

Good question. If this wasn't SE Asia then absolutely yes. Here in LOS? Probably nothing meaningful.

[Woof999]

11 hours ago, Ralf001 said:

The whole story is full of holes and inconsistencies.

 

Stripped belts visible as well apparently... what belts ?

 

I suspect the full story will never be revealed.

I'll happily post the outcome, but based on many of the replies here I probably wont expect much other than suspicion and doubt.

[lodstewart]

18 hours ago, tweedledee2 said:

 

  The above paragraph reveals the lack of proper maintenance resulted in your engine's failure. Suggesting that the dealers failure (3 days before) to check the oil level, should make them responsible is asinine, when by your own admission you hadn't checked it for a "few months". 

yes and in that few months , surely the OP would have opened the bonnet and filled the washer bottle ,

how long does it take to lift a dipstick? it's a bit rich  to blame the workshop. No sympathy from me, he wrecked his own Engine.

[Woof999]

5 minutes ago, lodstewart said:

yes and in that few months , surely the OP would have opened the bonnet and filled the washer bottle ,

how long does it take to lift a dipstick? it's a bit rich  to blame the workshop. No sympathy from me, he wrecked his own Engine.

Back to the original question. You too wouldn't expect a main dealer to check oil level when working on an engine related issue?

 

I've just opened the "bag of bits" that they gave the wife after the work. An air filter and the coolant pressure cap. I was under the impression they had also changed a / the fuel filter. Not all that surprised they wouldn't have returned the old diesel soaked one(s) even if they had.

 

Wasn't looking for sympathy, just opinions on whether the garage did what you'd expect them to.

[Yellowtail]

9 minutes ago, Woof999 said:

Back to the original question. You too wouldn't expect a main dealer to check oil level when working on an engine related issue?

 

I've just opened the "bag of bits" that they gave the wife after the work. An air filter and the coolant pressure cap. I was under the impression they had also changed a / the fuel filter. Not all that surprised they wouldn't have returned the old diesel soaked one(s) even if they had.

 

Wasn't looking for sympathy, just opinions on whether the garage did what you'd expect them to.

So did they resolve the lack of power issue the first time or not?

 

Knowing the car was overdue for service, why did you not have it done while they were checking the power issue? 

 

 

[Woof999]

6 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

So did they resolve the lack of power issue the first time or not?

 

Knowing the car was overdue for service, why did you not have it done while they were checking the power issue? 

 

 

It was already late on the Friday afternoon and my wife needed the car to collect the kids.

 

I did specifically ask them if there was ANY other work that was important and needed doing at the same time and was told no.

 

In my hands I have their sheet that lists all the work they suggest having done. 45 items at a total cost of 35k baht. All that without checking the oil. Upthread someone mentioned that it would be unreasonable for me to expect them to check anything I hadn't specifically asked them to. This sheet seems to disagree.

 

EDIT: They said they had resolved the lack of power issue, had test driven the car at the speeds that it was happening and then delivered it back to our house.

Edited January 18, 2022 by Woof999

[EVENKEEL]

2 minutes ago, Woof999 said:

It was already late on the Friday afternoon and my wife needed the car to collect the kids.

 

I did specifically ask them if there was ANY other work that was important and needed doing at the same time and was told no.

 

In my hands I have their sheet that lists all the work they suggest having done. 45 items at a total cost of 35k baht. All that without checking the oil. Upthread someone mentioned that it would be unreasonable for me to expect them to check anything I hadn't specifically asked them to. This sheet seems to disagree.

 

EDIT: They said they had resolved the lack of power issue, had test driven the car at the speeds that it was happening and then delivered it back to our house.

Just curious about yr, model of car and how long since last oil change. Was it years?

[Woof999]

Just now, EVENKEEL said:

Just curious about yr, model of car and how long since last oil change. Was it years?

Honestly can't remember, but likely. This particular company is the only place the car has been in the 6 years I've had it. All the paperwork is in the car which I don't have at the mo for obvious reasons. I know I've paid for at last one service and on a separate (more recent) occasion paid for the timing belt and other related stuff to be changed. It has also, within the last 2 years, had the gearbox out for oil seal changes (I believe, I know for sure the box had to come out and it was an all day job and they had the car for 3 days).

 

Again, I'm not for one moment trying to shirk my responsibility for having the car properly maintained. I am still in disbelief that a main dealer wouldn't check oil level as a matter of course, let alone when doing anything engine related.

 

I'll hold off giving too many specifics about the car / dealer until we've come to some kind of resolution. They might yet surprise me, I'm just not holding my breath.

[Ralf001]

34 minutes ago, Woof999 said:

They said they had resolved the lack of power issue, had test driven the car at the speeds that it was happening and then delivered it back to our house.

What was the issue ?

[Woof999]

10 minutes ago, Ralf001 said:

What was the issue ?

I'll likely be visiting them today so will ask the specifics. I believe it was diagnosed as fuel starvation, but that is more assumption than fact right now.

[Yellowtail]

Yeah, it the oil was like tar, likely the fuel filter was plugged as well. 

[Kwasaki]

1 hour ago, Woof999 said:

I'll likely be visiting them today so will ask the specifics. I believe it was diagnosed as fuel starvation, but that is more assumption than fact right now.

Thanks for news on your SUV situation sounds like you ended up with what we call in the trade a      "pig" telling of the work you have had done in only 6 years.

All the bits you got back recently wouldn't have a fuel filter they are a part that is cleaned and suppose to be checked at servicing.

As for going over in schedule oil servicing that wouldn't cause seizer depending how long just maybe some wear. 

Personally I would complain to the manufacturers head office in Bkk I'm sure they would like to know the kind of care their vehicles are getting in their Name garages.

[Woof999]

The proposed bill has just been sent to me.

 

They are suggesting a completely new bottom end, with a "half engine" and "engine overhaul gasket kit" being the two most expensive parts. I'm guessing that is a complete bottom end with new block, crank, liners, pistons, bearings, rings, conrods etc.

 

18 hours of work @ 30% discount. 10% off most parts (15,000 baht of parts at full price) for a total of 99,000 baht. On an 8/9 year old car I'm wondering if this is worth it. It'll still have the same head, same turbo, same flywheel and I'm guessing it will still need the same paperwork to change the engine number as just shoving a 40,000 baht replacement engine in. Or can / will the manufacturer stamp the new block with the original engine number?

 

EDIT: They will apparently send me the parts list in electronic format so I can translate everything from Thai. How loud I will laugh if this full quote doesn't include oil !

Edited January 19, 2022 by Woof999

[Yellowtail]

Yeah, just buy a new one

[Enoon]

22 hours ago, Enoon said:

"I can check the oil level in the Honda strimmer , as it has little

twist off cap  with dipstick attached. is there one on a motorbike ?"

 

The dipstick of a Honda Wave........motorcycle:

 

 

It's on the rear top left hand side of the crankcase.

 

 

 

 

Thanks to anybody who corrected left to right.

[richard_smith237]

7 hours ago, Woof999 said:

EDIT: They said they had resolved the lack of power issue, had test driven the car at the speeds that it was happening and then delivered it back to our house.

In my experience, when they ’test drive the car’ they do so around the block just to check it still functions - its never a full on test drive as they are scared of an accident or some damage occurring which they’ll be held accountable for, its a kind of a catch 22 situation....

 

 

Similar happened to me. The garage informed me that they had ‘fixed a clunking noise while going over bumps’ by swapping out an expensive suspension part. They’d test driven the car and it was OK. I test drove the car with the mechanic before signing off on the work, the ‘clunk’ while going over bumps had not disappeared...  I refused to sign off on the work, the mechanic claimed I was driving too fast over the bumps !!!....

 

I got dealership HQ involved - further work was carried out (cracked engine mount replaced).

 

Car was out of warranty by 6 months, all costs were waved. It was explained that the mechanics had not done their job and checked the car properly.

 

 

9 hours ago, EVENKEEL said:

In all honesty do you expect anything in the form of compensation from these guys?

As above... it can happen if the Garage are prepared to be decent about it. 

 

In our case, their positive response has likely guaranteed that our next car will be from the same dealership / manufacturer. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[richard_smith237]

8 hours ago, lodstewart said:

yes and in that few months , surely the OP would have opened the bonnet and filled the washer bottle ,

how long does it take to lift a dipstick? it's a bit rich  to blame the workshop. No sympathy from me, he wrecked his own Engine.

I’ve not checked the oil levels in any of my vehicles over the past 25 years....  This is something I expect the Garage to do when I take the car in for a service - I can’t remember the last time I opened a bonnet (hood) of a car !!!! 

 

The only things I expect to have to do on my own vehicle are:

- Clean it (usually a local valet)

- Check tyre pressure (I watch the attendant at a petrol station do it to the pressure I ask for)

- Fill it with fuel (petrol attendants do it)

- Ensure water for washers (I ask a petrol attendant to do it) 

 

For everything else I expect a warning to signal and the garage to check it. 

 

Thats modern motoring, we’re not in the 1960’s any more where we are expected to get our hands dirty - I can’t be bothered with any of that on modern cars. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[richard_smith237]

6 hours ago, Kwasaki said:

Personally I would complain to the manufacturers head office in Bkk I'm sure they would like to know the kind of care their vehicles are getting in their Name garages.

Is the Garage and authorised garage (i.e. branded Mitsu) or is it an independent garage ???

 

 

[Liverpool Lou]

On 1/18/2022 at 1:46 PM, Yellowtail said:

You seem to "know" a lot of things that aren't true....

As do you.

[Liverpool Lou]

On 1/18/2022 at 1:27 PM, richard_smith237 said:

The garage / service centre didn’t check the oil - thats part of the job, part of the investigation into what was not working with the car. 

 

Is it?  Since when?  What do you know about the intricacies of the investigation into "a problem with engine power under load and at speeds > 70kph"?   I doubt that the first reaction of of most people to that symptom would be to straight to the dipstick, except for those wanting to have yet another blame game go at Thais in general.

 

I would imagine that for a car that had just been driven in, with no indications of obvious problems such as severe overheating, and the owner complaining only of a lock of power over 70kph, the first thong that would happen is that a tech would start the car to move it to the service bay.    As the OP stated, the tech would immediately see no oil warning light or any sign of overheating, in fact nothing to suggest that the owner had delivered a car with nothing but tar in the sump so no reason to expect that there was no oil in it.

 

 

Edited January 19, 2022 by Liverpool Lou

[Woof999]

1 hour ago, richard_smith237 said:

Is the Garage and authorised garage (i.e. branded Mitsu) or is it an independent garage ???

 

 

Main dealer with the glitzy showroom and 10 bay service area.

 

I've just come back from there. The price they quoted didn't include a number of things I'd want to be changed. The worst was the oil pump.... I said "this quote doesn't include an oil pump"... they said "we'll use the old one". To me that sounds like the biggest of red flags.

[Kwasaki]

2 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

Is the Garage and authorised garage (i.e. branded Mitsu) or is it an independent garage ???

Dunno just suggesting if it a Mitsubishi garage he should complain. 

Or find a better garage.

[richard_smith237]

31 minutes ago, Woof999 said:

Main dealer with the glitzy showroom and 10 bay service area.

 

I've just come back from there. The price they quoted didn't include a number of things I'd want to be changed. The worst was the oil pump.... I said "this quote doesn't include an oil pump"... they said "we'll use the old one". To me that sounds like the biggest of red flags.

Complain to Mitsubishi HQ… 

 

See if you get a response at least. 
 

 

I wouldn’t expect anything, however, This has worked for me twice in the past. 

Recently with a Japanese’s manufacturer & about 15 years ago with a German manufacturer, back then I was forced to go ‘International’ - both times it worked in my favor. 

 

[Woof999]

In brighter news, the Toyota Cross GR Sport and the Fortuner Legender 2.4 2WD both look awesome, so test drives booked for tomorrow. Whatever happens I wont be a Mitsi customer for much longer.