Maybe he is Irish mafia and he made them offer they couldn't understand

56 minutes ago, SmokeandIce said:

What information do you have to create your hypothesis.  Isn't it more appopriate to hold judgement until sufficient facts are revealed.  Too quick to blame the farang and the security guards.

I didn't mention the security guard and my 'hypothesis' as you call it was in the form of a question.

For sure someone was to blame, otherwise the incident wouldn't have occurred.

Who are we going to believe? Some shady security guards, at an entertainment complex? Or the tourist? It is unlikely he ran away from paying the bill, and even if he did, it is unlikely he resisted several guys to the point where the skull injury was not malicious, and totally intentional. 

 

Padding bills is not uncommon. I was eating alone in a Japanese restaurant in Bangkok many years ago and I ordered three dishes. When the bill came it was eight thousand baht. This was not an expensive restaurant, but they had 19 items on the bill. I argued, and I wasn't getting anywhere. I finally asked to see the manager. A very irate very difficult pitbull of a woman came over and started screaming at me. I calmly explained to her that I had three dishes, I showed her the menu, I showed her the dishes that I ordered she said she would look at it. About 10 minutes later she came back with a bill that had only 14 items on it and it was down to 6,000. We went through several revisions of the bill over a period of about an hour and I finally just took the money out of my pocket, had the exact change and put the 800 baht on the table that I owed. I said that's all you're going to get, call the cops, call your thugs, do whatever you want to do but that's all you're getting. 

 

She looked at me, started screamed at me at the top of her lungs, calling me many ugly names and I just walked out. I hear this kind of thing is quite common in higher end or even middle of the road Japanese restaurants in Bangkok, where they expect the guy to be drunk and not to look at the bill, and these kind of things are very common in certain entertainment establishments, especially Patpong, where they say pay the bill or deal with our thugs in the back alley. You decide.

2 minutes ago, 2long said:

I didn't mention the security guard and my 'hypothesis' as you call it was in the form of a question.

For sure someone was to blame, otherwise the incident wouldn't have occurred.

 

It seems the likely sequence is that the tourist felt as if he was being ripped off, refused to pay for extortion and attempted to leave.

In leaving, the guards attempted to block his path, leading to their claim that he pushed them and accidentally fell over.

The likelihood of a fifty eight year old slightly out of shape foreigner willingly taking on two larger and younger security guards seems slim to none.

But why not just attack the foreigner for wanting to have a good craic on St Patrick's Day and not wanting to be ripped off?

Anyone who has been here long enough will know (from experience) a few of things...

- there are plenty of obnoxious farangs (tourists & expats) who feel a sense of privilege or entitlement to justice & service that they are accustomed to from back home

- alcohol makes people do things they wouldn't normally do

- St Patrick's Day is enjoyed with alcohol, by some people from lunchtime to late

- Irish people like a drink

- Thai (and ASEAN) security guards are rarely fluent in English (or drunken Gaelic)

- These security guards rarely 'start' a physical fight without provocation

- These security guards often appear to enjoy an altercation, as without any 'action' their job is useless and could be boring

- certain males of the ASEAN region will gladly, quickly and without evidence of who's right or wrong, pile into an altercation, often with weapons and nearly always on the side who they choose (such as their friends, compatriots or whichever side appears to have the upper hand).

 

Please note that I have made no assumptions at all, because I wasn't there. I'm just pointing things out as they often are.

I’ll wager he paid the bill with 1,000bt note and he got the old “you only gave me 500bt” routine. 

36 minutes ago, Taboo2 said:

Check your bin and confirm your price after each purchase.  This will save a lot of issues.  Now, if you accidentally walked off without paying, apologize and give them an extra 50 baht! 

 

No issues.

I guess the place kept a tab in front of him. I make a point of looking at it when it is brought back after each order. I like to think it deters them from any monkey business. Like to hear the Irish guys story.

3 minutes ago, jacko45k said:

I guess the place kept a tab in front of him. I make a point of looking at it when it is brought back after each order. I like to think it deters them from any monkey business. Like to hear the Irish guys story.

Though what you are suggesting is wise, there is an awful lot of padding of the bills that goes on here, especially as one get more and more drunk. My woman has caught them in the act many times. 

1 hour ago, SmokeandIce said:

What information do you have to create your hypothesis.  Isn't it more appopriate to hold judgement until sufficient facts are revealed.  Too quick to blame the farang and the security guards.

 

Is that ever done on TVF?

4 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

Though what you are suggesting is wise, there is an awful lot of padding of the bills that goes on here, especially as one get more and more drunk. My woman has caught them in the act many times. 

What they don't know is I can hardly see it in the low light levels.....

In my years of overseeing entertainment venues with thousands of people drinking and having a good time, take a guess at how many physical injuries to our customers were caused by our security.

 

Guessed it? Zero.

 

All highly trained in holds. No beat downs or strikes. Ever. 

 

 

Irish man <deleted> faced st Patrick's day thinking he can take on a bunch of tiny thais. 

If he took off from my bar I would have beat him up myself. 

1 minute ago, whereyougo said:

Irish man <deleted> faced st Patrick's day thinking he can take on a bunch of tiny thais. 

If he took off from my bar I would have beat him up myself. 

...and the keyboard warriors come out to play.

 

The bouncers were bigger than he.

In 1967, this happened and everyone cried, "Never again!!!!!!!"

 

In the year 3045, this happens 73 times every second.  

5 hours ago, harada said:

Nothings changed, welcome back to Thailand.☹️

Not all of Thailand , just pattaya.

7 minutes ago, whereyougo said:

Irish man <deleted> faced st Patrick's day thinking he can take on a bunch of tiny thais. 

If he took off from my bar I would have beat him up myself. 

We aren't really sure what happened at this time so perhaps let us not jump to conclusions. Where is your bar as I like to avoid places with loony owners?

7 hours ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

Where is that claim  made ?

Need to wait until the Irish guy sobers up and wait until we hear what he has to say .

   It may be that he did refuse to pay his bill, for some reason . 

Could be that he liked the sound of the bell ringing and kept ringing the bell ?

Maybe same like the karaoke in Chiangmai do to tourists, give them a ridiculously high bill then if they can’t or won’t pay about 10 guys beat them up, happened a lot before Covid.

1 hour ago, spidermike007 said:

We went through several revisions of the bill over a period of about an hour and I finally just took the money out of my pocket, had the exact change and put the 800 baht on the table that I owed. I said that's all you're going to get, call the cops, call your thugs, do whatever you want to do but that's all you're getting. 

 

Sure but it would have been a better story if she then got on the phone and called in 4 or 5 of her Yakuza co-owners.

1 hour ago, Lemsta69 said:

c'mon bro just give us the link already! oh and by the way it's "champing at the bit" ????

No it is not, it is CHOMPING at the bit.

59 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

Who are we going to believe? Some shady security guards, at an entertainment complex? Or the tourist?

Security guard or tourist ?  ????

 

I hope that was joke.  Neither have credibility with me.  CCTV to the rescue.

 

I'll trust a Thai over a foreigner, expat or tourist.  Noticed more scrupulous foreigners than Thais, in 20+ yrs here.

7 hours ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

Where is that claim  made ?

Need to wait until the Irish guy sobers up and wait until we hear what he has to say .

   It may be that he did refuse to pay his bill, for some reason . 

Could be that he liked the sound of the bell ringing and kept ringing the bell ?

Is that what you did upon arrival in LOS M.M???????????????? "U STARTED, SO I FINISH" 555

10 minutes ago, KhunLA said:

I'll trust a Thai over a foreigner, expat or tourist.  Noticed more scrupulous foreigners than Thais, in 20+ yrs here.

That is a contradiction or you wrote it incorrectly

12 minutes ago, KhunLA said:

Security guard or tourist ?  ????

 

I hope that was joke.  Neither have credibility with me.  CCTV to the rescue.

 

I'll trust a Thai over a foreigner, expat or tourist.  Noticed more scrupulous foreigners than Thais, in 20+ yrs here.

I distrust everyone equally. 

1 hour ago, 2long said:

Anyone who has been here long enough will know (from experience) a few of things...

- there are plenty of obnoxious farangs (tourists & expats) who feel a sense of privilege or entitlement to justice & service that they are accustomed to from back home

- alcohol makes people do things they wouldn't normally do

- St Patrick's Day is enjoyed with alcohol, by some people from lunchtime to late

- Irish people like a drink

- Thai (and ASEAN) security guards are rarely fluent in English (or drunken Gaelic)

- These security guards rarely 'start' a physical fight without provocation

- These security guards often appear to enjoy an altercation, as without any 'action' their job is useless and could be boring

- certain males of the ASEAN region will gladly, quickly and without evidence of who's right or wrong, pile into an altercation, often with weapons and nearly always on the side who they choose (such as their friends, compatriots or whichever side appears to have the upper hand).

 

Please note that I have made no assumptions at all, because I wasn't there. I'm just pointing things out as they often are.

 

You forgot the thing that started the whole incident.

 

- criminal bar girl  and cashier add extra drinks to farang's bar bill and then get security guards to collect on the scam.  

 

Was he trying a runner?

 

1 hour ago, Bruno123 said:

 

It seems the likely sequence is that the tourist felt as if he was being ripped off, refused to pay for extortion and attempted to leave.

In leaving, the guards attempted to block his path, leading to their claim that he pushed them and accidentally fell over.

The likelihood of a fifty eight year old slightly out of shape foreigner willingly taking on two larger and younger security guards seems slim to none.

But why not just attack the foreigner for wanting to have a good craic on St Patrick's Day and not wanting to be ripped off?

or even more likely the tourist was a drunken gobby idiot and picked an argument with the wrong person and got his just desserts. Lesson hopefully learnt.

20 minutes ago, Leaver said:

 

You forgot the thing that started the whole incident.

 

- criminal bar girl  and cashier add drinks to farang's bar bill and then get security guards to collect on the scam.  

You forgot what everybody that has been here long enough has seen countless times

- Obnoxious drunk farang refuses to pay bill, walks away without paying, starts fighting with people trying to stop him, carries on when security arrives, gets a slap. Plays the victim

 

 

 

 

A baiting flame leading to off topic bickering has been removed also replies

9 minutes ago, Leaver said:

 

You forgot the thing that started the whole incident.

 

- criminal bar girl  and cashier add drinks to farang's bar bill and then get security guards to collect on the scam.  

 

Don't continue making sense. If you continue to do so you'll leave no space for the foreigners who hate themselves along with their kinfolk.

Wholly unacceptable to attack and to cheat your customers.

 

It's a place for drinking and revelling. If the security cannot handle someone who is drinking; get better security.

In my venues, anyone being overly rowdy and refusing to calm down would be firmly gripped on either side by security and walked out. Any further noise and they would be permanently banned.

Fighting is for animals. The bar owner who piped up about attacking his own customers is a sad case in point. A hooligan running a bar.

6 minutes ago, smutcakes said:

or even more likely the tourist was a drunken gobby idiot and picked an argument with the wrong person and got his just desserts. Lesson hopefully learnt.

 

The article suggests a padded bill. Do you know something that they don't or are you just projecting gobby idiot?