Frozen pension policy turns British expat's dream into a nightmare

[snoop1130]

 

Foreigners resident in Thailand are beginning to feel a financial strain due to the UK government's pension freeze policy. Three British individuals have experienced this challenge, providing insights about a difficult reality that contrasts sharply with the country's sunny appeal.

 

John Jones, 77, had enjoyed a lively international lifestyle but now, due to the frozen pension policy, his retirement plans are suffering. Residing in rural Thailand, Jones struggles with a heart condition adding to his financial woes.

 

Rising living costs are hitting him particularly hard. According to Jones, market items that were affordable thirteen years ago now seem overly expensive. The budget constraints hinder any saving capacities and he lives quite a simple life.

 

His fellow Briton, Jeffrey Barnes, 77, from Offham, Kent, shares a similar fate. Although receiving a comfortable private pension, the unfairness of the frozen state pension policy aggravates him.

 

Meanwhile, 55-year-old Linz Gelthorpe and his 61-year-old wife, Julie, find their dream relocation to Thailand tarnished by unforeseen financial challenges.

 

The problem lies in the UK Government’s position to freeze state pensions for its nationals living in non-European countries like Thailand. The policy precludes them from receiving the annual increment accessible to those residing in the UK. Reportedly, it affects over 480,000 globally.

 

The Department for Work and Pensions (DWP), despite mounting criticism, stands by this policy, asserting that it has been in place for over 70 years. However, this isn't much consolation for the British foreigners who are still managing these financial realities.

 

 

 

Photo: Creative Common License via Google

 

-- 2024-04-26

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[Ralf001]

What year did the frozen pension policy come into effect ?

 

[orchis]

4 minutes ago, Ralf001 said:

What year did the frozen pension policy come into effect ?

 

I think 2000.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frozen_state_pension

[mrwebb8825]

7 minutes ago, Ralf001 said:

What year did the frozen pension policy come into effect ?

 

interesting:

 

Most British Commonwealth countries are included in the frozen list;[8] these include countries, such as Australia, Canada, South Africa, New Zealand, Thailand and India, as well as British overseas territories such as the Falkland Islands.[9]

 

Wonder if Thailand knows the Brits claim it.

 

from here:

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frozen_state_pension

[mrwebb8825]

3 minutes ago, orchis said:

I think 2000.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frozen_state_pension

Damn! Ninja'd

[worgeordie]

29 minutes ago, snoop1130 said:

Rising living costs are hitting him particularly hard. According to Jones, market items that were affordable thirteen years ago now seem overly expensive. The budget constraints hinder any saving capacities and he lives quite a simple life.

 

it's called  inflation , Brexit did not help , Then Covid  , ,I don't think anyone thought  things

would turn out like this , I am still on 90 quid a week ,good job I don't need it as provided

for myself before retiring at 42 , But I can feel for those relying here on pension only, no

way will we get any relief from the British Government ,too busy looking after immigrants.

 

regards Worgeordie

[Ralf001]

7 minutes ago, orchis said:

I think 2000.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frozen_state_pension

 

Wow ok 24yrs ago.

 

Sounds like piss poor planning from those whinging about it now !

[Keeps]

15 minutes ago, Ralf001 said:

What year did the frozen pension policy come into effect ?

 

The basic state pension first came about in 1948. As the DWP have stated that this rule has been in effect for over 70 years, it may have been incorporated at the outset. It probably would not have been an issue for the first couple of decades as not many people would have retired overseas. Now however, wholly unfair.

[Ralf001]

1 minute ago, Keeps said:

The basic state pension first came about in 1948. As the DWP have stated that this rule has been in effect for over 70 years, it may have been incorporated at the outset. It probably would not have been an issue for the first couple of decades as not many people would have retired overseas. Now however, wholly unfair.

 

But was in effect prior to deciding to retire overseas.

 

[BritManToo]

Tell them you live in the Philippines then you get full pension!

[MicroB]

46 minutes ago, Ralf001 said:

What year did the frozen pension policy come into effect ?

 

 

In 1946, there was the first uplift, which wasn't paid out to pensioners outside of Great Britain. The National Insurance Act 1946  contained a general  disqualification for payment of benefits absent from Great Britain, together with power for regulations to remove the disqualification. Upratings, of which there were three between July 1948 and July 1955, were not payable to persons not resident in Great Britain. The formal policy was made in 1955. Subsequent regulations providing for pension increases have continued to have the same effect. Between 1948 and 1955, the UK entered into reciprocal agreements with France, Italy, Switzerland, the Netherlands and Luxembourg, which provided for payment of retirement pension in the countries concerned. Upratings were paid. Pensions were also payable, by a special arrangement, in  Ireland but were not uprated until 1966. Until 1973, recipricol arrangements were made with 30 countries to allow pension increases. This stopped in 1981. In July 1995, there was a parliamentary debate on the Pension Bill amendments for upratings to be paid, defeated by large majorities.

 

https://hansard.parliament.uk/Commons/1995-05-04/debates/0f8a64d2-9e26-4fc8-813d-2504e909e8ae/Pensions(Expatriates)

 

In theory, all UK pensioners could go home, and their pensions increased to the current rate.

 

https://hansard.parliament.uk/Commons/1994-07-06/debates/6df169bc-8bd2-4d30-909b-312ad520b9d4/OverseasPensioners

 

William Hague pointed out that todays NI contributions pays for today's pensioner, not your future pension. So arguments about paying into a system for future entitlement falls fat on its face. There isn't the money to pay for overseas pensioners, who mostly don't vote, who mostly don't pay taxes, to have their pension increased.

Edited April 26 by MicroB

[Rampant Rabbit]

14 minutes ago, MicroB said:

who mostly don't pay taxes, to have their pension increased.

and who mostly never use the NHS saving the UK millions, its an absolute farce,

[dinsdale]

It's an insane policy. Getting an Australian pension overseas is also insane. Apart from this once again this AI article lacks any editing demonstated in the subheading.

3 hours ago, snoop1130 said:

Foreigners resident in Thailand are beginning to feel a financial strain due to the UK government's pension freeze policy.

It would seem all foreigners no matter what nationality are "beginning to feel a financial strain due to the UK government's pension freeze policy." 

[riclag]

58 minutes ago, mrwebb8825 said:

Damn! Ninja'd

Is that you Jimmy

[herfiehandbag]

If I was in the UK, I would receive an uprated Pension , Pension Credit, Housing Benefit, Winter Fuel Allowance, free NHS treatment ( which in my case would be quite expensive), a Bus Pass and probably other benefits and allowances. It should easily double, and more, what I cost the state!

[Burma Bill]

For reference - not only Thailand where UK State Pension is frozen but also Burma, Cambodia, Laos, Malaysia, Singapore and Vietnam in this part of the World.

My UK State Pension is frozen at 102 GBP per week, the same as 15 years ago! Fortunately I get two indexed linked police pensions in addition.

 

Full list:

https://www.britishpensions.org.au/archive/frozenindexed.htm

[Keeps]

It is my mother's 80th birthday today. She has received a letter from the DWP advising that she will be receiving a 25 PENCE per week increase in her state pension for reaching this milestone.

 

It probably cost a months worth of the increase just to notify her by post.  

[Keeps]

7 minutes ago, Burma Bill said:

For reference - not only Thailand where UK State Pension is frozen but also Burma, Cambodia, Laos, Malaysia, Singapore and Vietnam in this part of the World.

My UK State Pension is frozen at 102 GBP per week, the same as 15 years ago! Fortunately I get two indexed linked police pensions in addition.

 

Full list:

https://www.britishpensions.org.au/archive/frozenindexed.htm

Surely your posting name should be Burma Old Bill based on your past occupation..... (not based on your age I hasten to add!) 555

[Wobblybob]

56 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Tell them you live in the Philippines then you get full pension!

I think that is a possible answer to those willing to think outside the box. I did an internet search and it's possible to open a Philippine bank account on line without even going to the Philippines. Surely finding a Philippine address can't be that difficult. 

[MicroB]

50 minutes ago, Rampant Rabbit said:

and who mostly never use the NHS saving the UK millions, its an absolute farce,

 

And its possible, without having made no contributions in tax and national insurance, to return to the UK after a working career outside of it, and receive full benefit of that NHS.

 

Todays taxes are to pay for today's healthcare, not tomorrow's.

[nauseus]

1 hour ago, MicroB said:

 

In 1946, there was the first uplift, which wasn't paid out to pensioners outside of Great Britain. The National Insurance Act 1946  contained a general  disqualification for payment of benefits absent from Great Britain, together with power for regulations to remove the disqualification. Upratings, of which there were three between July 1948 and July 1955, were not payable to persons not resident in Great Britain. The formal policy was made in 1955. Subsequent regulations providing for pension increases have continued to have the same effect. Between 1948 and 1955, the UK entered into reciprocal agreements with France, Italy, Switzerland, the Netherlands and Luxembourg, which provided for payment of retirement pension in the countries concerned. Upratings were paid. Pensions were also payable, by a special arrangement, in  Ireland but were not uprated until 1966. Until 1973, recipricol arrangements were made with 30 countries to allow pension increases. This stopped in 1981. In July 1995, there was a parliamentary debate on the Pension Bill amendments for upratings to be paid, defeated by large majorities.

es/0f8a64d2-9e26-4fc8-813d-2504e909e8ae/Pensions(Expatriates)

 

In theory, all UK pensioners could go home, and their pensions increased to the current rate.

 

https://hansard.parliament.uk/Commons/1994-07-06/debates/6df169bc-8bd2-4d30-909b-312ad520b9d4/OverseasPensioners

 

William Hague pointed out that todays NI contributions pays for today's pensioner, not your future pension. So arguments about paying into a system for future entitlement falls fat on its face. There isn't the money to pay for overseas pensioners, who mostly don't vote, who mostly don't pay taxes, to have their pension increased.

 

Hague is full of it. Most penioners in the UK don't pay tax either. There is always the money - we still have our own bank.

 

[mommysboy]

1 hour ago, worgeordie said:

it's called  inflation , Brexit did not help , Then Covid  , ,I don't think anyone thought  things

would turn out like this , I am still on 90 quid a week ,good job I don't need it as provided

for myself before retiring at 42 , But I can feel for those relying here on pension only, no

way will we get any relief from the British Government ,too busy looking after immigrants.

 

regards Worgeordie

 

A retiree today would be claiming 220 quid under the new state pension scheme.  It seems wrong.  People leave it a bit late to do anything about it- a solution for example would be a reset by moving back to UK for a year, or Philippines perhaps.

 

In the end I think the only reasons were - A. It would cost too much.  B. Nobody cares that much in the UK.  In fact some blood thirsty wolves were all for cancelling the pension completely.  Campaigners shot everyone in the foot by vigorously demanding that a rise be backdated.

[Liverpool Lou]

2 hours ago, Ralf001 said:

What year did the frozen pension policy come into effect ?

 

Well before any of them voluntarily made their personal decision to live, in retirement, in a country that precluded them from the increases (pre-1954).

[Liverpool Lou]

2 hours ago, mrwebb8825 said:

Most British Commonwealth countries are included in the frozen list;[8] these include countries, such as Australia, Canada, South Africa, New Zealand, Thailand and India, as well as British overseas territories such as the Falkland Islands.[9]

 

Wonder if Thailand knows the Brits claim it.

 

from here:

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frozen_state_pension

You wonder if Thailand knows that Britons claim what?   There is a semi-colon after the phrase "in the frozen list".

[Liverpool Lou]

2 hours ago, orchis said:

I think 2000.

You think wrong, it has been a policy for over 70 years.

[kickstart]

1 hour ago, MicroB said:

There isn't the money to pay for overseas pensioners, who mostly don't vote, who mostly don't pay taxes, to have their pension increased.

We know they is no money in the pot, but as for paying taxes, like most Brits living out of they own country and have been paying the NI tax for 35 years, so surly they should be able to get the increase.

Note, with the triple lock coming into force in the UK pensions have gone up, but more than one person has said it is now going beyond they 12000 GBP personnel allowance, and they are saying they could well be having to pay tax, after paying tax they could be down more money than before the increase. 

[Pouatchee]

2 hours ago, mrwebb8825 said:

Most British Commonwealth countries are included in the frozen list;[8] these include countries, such as Australia, Canada

 

cant find anything to back what you said about canada. link please.

[Liverpool Lou]

2 hours ago, BritManToo said:

Tell them you live in the Philippines then you get full pension!

Not if you cannot provide proof of living there, you don't.

[foreverlomsak]

2 hours ago, orchis said:

2 hours ago, Ralf001 said:

What year did the frozen pension policy come into effect ?

 

I think 2000.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frozen_state_pension

 

Yet the main article states,

 

2 hours ago, snoop1130 said:

The Department for Work and Pensions (DWP), despite mounting criticism, stands by this policy, asserting that it has been in place for over 70 years.

 

Are we in the year 2070, by god I'm aging better than I thought.

[dinsdale]

1 hour ago, herfiehandbag said:

If I was in the UK, I would receive an uprated Pension , Pension Credit, Housing Benefit, Winter Fuel Allowance, free NHS treatment ( which in my case would be quite expensive), a Bus Pass and probably other benefits and allowances. It should easily double, and more, what I cost the state!

Can't give you anymore money because illigal immigrants are very expensive for the budget. You may be a British national but you are overseas and as such a lesser person to those who aren't Brits who have got a leaky boat to the Isles. It's a very, very sad world.

Edited April 26 by dinsdale