Trump under investigation for potential violations of Espionage Act

[Thingamabob]

Speaking as a Brit we all know Biden hates us, his closest allies, and betrayed us over the manner of the USA's withdrawal from Afganisthan. At least Trump told us of his plan to withdraw. Nothing at all from Biden. On that basis alone give me Trump anytime.

[Walker88]

As a former TS/SCI holder, if I had a single TS/SCI doc in my home, even if the reason I had it was 'to prepare for work the next day', I would have been arrested. If I turned the docs back over and said 'everything has been returned', but was subsequently found to have kept things I had no right to have, it would have been assumed I was going to try to monetize the material. I would be charged with the capital offense of 'conspiracy to commit espionage'.

 

When 45 lied about returning everything he had no right to retain, it is likely this thought came up, which is why the Chief of Counterintelligence was part of the group searching MaL. Part of the length of this investigation, and why 45 has not yet been charged, is NOT because there is no case, but more likely the DoJ is building a much wider case to include 'conspiracy to commit espionage'.

 

Lying to the authorities, as 45 did, plus his subsequent lies about 'standing order to declassify everything I took' suggests bad intent. There is no possible reason for having the material, and no excuse for lying about 'returning everything'.

 

45 fully intended to monetize the secrets. Of that I have no doubt.

 

Former DirNSA and DCI Gen Hayden said Sunday that 'execution is a good idea'.

 

After a trial, make it so.

[Walker88]

4 minutes ago, Thingamabob said:

Speaking as a Brit we all know Biden hates us, his closest allies, and betrayed us over the manner of the USA's withdrawal from Afganisthan. At least Trump told us of his plan to withdraw. Nothing at all from Biden. On that basis alone give me Trump anytime.

You speak for all Brits, eh?  And why was ending a 20 year war a betrayal of the UK? You are welcome to go back and keep the war going if you are so miffed.

 

Perhaps you are unaware that 45 released hundreds of Taliban fighters being held by the Afghan govt. Many of those folks now run the Taliban Govt.  Perhaps you can tell me if all Brits agree that was a betrayal.

[baboon]

6 minutes ago, Thingamabob said:

Speaking as a Brit we all know Biden hates us, his closest allies, and betrayed us over the manner of the USA's withdrawal from Afganisthan. At least Trump told us of his plan to withdraw. Nothing at all from Biden. On that basis alone give me Trump anytime.

We don't "all" know any such thing. Speak for yourself and not others.

[placeholder]

14 minutes ago, Thingamabob said:

Speaking as a Brit we all know Biden hates us, his closest allies, and betrayed us over the manner of the USA's withdrawal from Afganisthan. At least Trump told us of his plan to withdraw. Nothing at all from Biden. On that basis alone give me Trump anytime.

Exactly now did Biden betray the UK? Biden was following Trump's plan to withdraw. As you clearly don't know, it was the Trump administration that negotiated with the Taliban for a May 31, 2021 withdrawal. The Biden administration did manage to extend that deadline to Aug 31, 2021. But everything else was the same.

 

[placeholder]

Here's an interesting note from an article in The Wall St. Journal

"The U.S. Court of Appeals for the Second Circuit endorsed that view in a 2020 decision, saying that “declassification, even by the President, must follow established procedures.”

In that case, the appeals court denied an effort by the New York Times to obtain documents about a covert Central Intelligence Agency operation in Syria. The newspaper had argued then-President Trump declassified the program by tweeting about it and making other public comments."

https://www.wsj.com/articles/fbi-search-of-mar-a-lago-achieved-doj-top-priority-get-the-documents-11660512503#:~:text=The U.S. Court,making other public comments.

[FritsSikkink]

17 hours ago, talahtnut said:

A US congresswoman has submitted a motion to remove

the attorney general from office over the Trump house search.

The stink of Democrat corruption is too much for one woman.

Head of FBI is a Republican put there by Trump himself, anymore intelligent comments?

[Chomper Higgot]

Here’s a thing.

 

There are two real and serious threats arising from Trump illegally removing TS/SCI documents to his Mar-a-Largo home.

 

The first real and serious threat is to Trump himself, we know he’s under criminal investigation for violating the espionage Act, this is a real and serious threat to Trump’s liberty.

 

Trump supporters know this, hence they are focussed on trying to claim Trump has a right to have these documents at his home/declassified these documents and/or these documents were planted - Well good luck with that, it won’t work.

 

Senator Paul Rand had taken a different tack, he suddenly wants to repeal the Espionage Act. This begs a question, what threat is Rand facing from this case that he feels the US does not need an Act of law outlawing Espionage?

 

All of the above is a threat to Trump and those in his immediate sphere.

 

But then there’s this, the real nasty, real dangerous threat:

 

Who has had access to these TS/SCI documents while they were in Trump’s possession at Mar-a-Largo?

 

We have learned from news reports that the FBI have obtained video footage of the document boxes being moved around Mar-a-Largo at times after Trump’s attorney(s) had already submitted statements that all documents were returned (unequivocal evidence of false statements/obstruction of Justice and hence more threats to Trump).

 

But this ‘movement’ of the documents raises a question. Why were the documents being moved? 
 

Who was being given access to the documents?

 

This is the real threat, not to Trump but to US National Security.

 

If, as reported, the TS/SCI documents included documents relating to US Nuclear Weapons Systems then the possibility of US adversaries getting access to these documents has to be considered a reality.

 

This is a threat to US National Security and is something all Americans should be concerned about.

 

It’s not about Trump, it’s about the whole of the US.

Nobody gets to ignore this threat, play this threat down, claim this is not a real threat and still maintain any claim whatsoever to being a patriot.

 

 

 

Edited August 15, 2022 by Chomper Higgot

[FritsSikkink]

17 hours ago, Tippaporn said:

Now I know what Trump feels like. 

He feels like this: https://www.facebook.com/memories/?source=promotion_feed_story&story_id=703207316362156&qp_h=AZIu63j1s6zFNSZyWI8

 

He is delusional like most of his followers. 

[Chomper Higgot]

17 hours ago, talahtnut said:

A US congresswoman has submitted a motion to remove

the attorney general from office over the Trump house search.

The stink of Democrat corruption is too much for one woman.

Name her please, ‘Marjorie Taylor Greene’ extreme rightwing fruitcake.

 

 

[Walker88]

Dear Potential Clandestine Assets of US Intelligence:

 

DON'T DO IT !

 

Your identity is only as safe as a self-serving, reckless POTUS makes it. On a whim, for reasons that make no sense, he will play fast and loose with your life and the lives of your loved ones. He does this because he couldn't care less. What's in it for him? is his only consideration.

 

Terror target?

 

If you know of plans to explode a nuclear device in a major US city, keep it to yourself. Bioterror weapon about to be unleashed? Quiet ! Take down a few airlines? Flying is already a pain in the butt; a few lost aircraft isn't that much worse.

 

SAVE YOURSELF. You want to have your brothers find out you betrayed them? You'll get your head cut off on the internet, like that Israeli penetration of ISIS that 45 outed in his meeting in the Oval Office with Lavrov and Kislyak. But hey, 45 had to show off in front of the russkis.

 

US Adversaries?

 

Yea, some of you know some really big secrets, and some of you either don't like your leader putin or xi, or else have some sort of personal grudge against them. Sure you could share things that might save billions of lives. You could share things that, like Adolf Tolkachev, could save the US hundreds of billions of dollars. Still, don't take the plunge. Just say "NO !" to the CIA pitch, because a reckless POTUS can expose you and get you and your family killed. I'm sure you know about the guy 45 exposed with his irresponsible behavior. You know the one. In russia. Putin had the guy fed into a furnace, alive, while forcing the man's family to stand there and watch dad baked. The poor guy's kids will never forget the sound of those screams. You want that? I'm guessing no.

 

Gina Haspel and Dan Coats did everything possible to keep key intel away from 45, knowing he was careless and self-serving. They did a great job, but when 45 can pack boxes and boxes of classified docs when going out the door, it's almost futile trying to stop his selfish recklessness.

 

The entire game has changed. 45 made classification meaningless. The US is much less safe today because of his self-serving behavior. And frankly, let's be honest. That some 40% of Americans still support the clown kind of says the US is no longer worth saving. Let a bioterror weapon get unleashed. Let it make Covid look like a headache. Maybe tens of millions of Americans will die. So be it. Most of them aren't worth the air they waste anyway.

 

Look, the US did okay even after Pearl Harbor, so who really needs an intelligence organization. We also survived 9-11, so the 9-11s prevented since that one...well, would it have been so bad if they all happened instead of being stopped? Darwinian Socialism---let the chips fall where they may----has its draws. And since one Party actually wants to overthrow democracy and make the US an autocracy---despite the 45-fomented failure on 6 January 2021---the US just ain't worth saving anymore.

 

It's everyone for himself. Just like 45. I come first and last. It's all about ME!

[harada]

Don’t drop the soap Don. ????

[Chomper Higgot]

US National Security put at risk, it’s the stuff that warrants doubling down on support for the man who created the risk while dishing out laughing emojis.

 

 

 

 

[heybruce]

5 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

US National Security put at risk, it’s the stuff that warrants doubling down on support for the man who created the risk while dishing out laughing emojis.

Trump's 2024 campaign slogan--MAUA, Make America Unsafe Again.

[heybruce]

1 hour ago, Wrwest said:

50+- years of the American working class in a documented economic squeeze which, I hasten to point out is the result of the actions?policies of both major political parties. The USA is not alone in this as it can be seen in Europe and certainly is reflected by many seeking to retire in lower cost countries.

Please provide links to the documents confirming this "documented squeeze" and identify what Trump did to correct the situation.

[heybruce]

1 hour ago, ThailandRyan said:

Just saw an article in which folks believe that the inside Mole at MaraLago was none other than Jared Kushner, Trumps Son in Law as he appears to be making a deal to save his own hide....

 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.newsweek.com/jared-kushner-theories-saudi-money-donald-trump-mole-fbi-raid-1733474%3famp=1

 

I wouldn't be surprised is this is true, but currently it appears to be mostly speculation.

[heybruce]

1 hour ago, Bkk Brian said:

From none other than Fox News......lol

 

Sources told Fox News that some records could be covered by executive privilege, which gives the president of the United States and other officials within the executive branch the authority to withhold certain sensitive forms of advice and consultation between the president and senior advisers. 

 

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/fbi-seizes-privileged-trump-records-during-raid-doj-opposes-request-independent-review-sources

Even if true, the documents have always been the property of the US government, not Donald Trump, and the classified was stored in an insecure and illegal manner.

[heybruce]

40 minutes ago, Thingamabob said:

Speaking as a Brit we all know Biden hates us, his closest allies, and betrayed us over the manner of the USA's withdrawal from Afganisthan. At least Trump told us of his plan to withdraw. Nothing at all from Biden. On that basis alone give me Trump anytime.

I've cracked the code:  "Speaking as a Brit" means the poster has views far outside the mainstream for the UK but wants people to think he speaks for his country.

[Chomper Higgot]

1 hour ago, Bkk Brian said:

From none other than Fox News......lol

 

Sources told Fox News that some records could be covered by executive privilege, which gives the president of the United States and other officials within the executive branch the authority to withhold certain sensitive forms of advice and consultation between the president and senior advisers. 

 

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/fbi-seizes-privileged-trump-records-during-raid-doj-opposes-request-independent-review-sources

There is no executive privilege covering criminal actions, it doesn’t exist.

 

Which is probably why whoever came up with this nonsense chose to disseminate it through FOXnews 

[Berkshire]

14 minutes ago, heybruce said:

I've cracked the code:  "Speaking as a Brit" means the poster has views far outside the mainstream for the UK but wants people to think he speaks for his country.

I've noticed these non-Americans supporting Trump are even more white nationalists than Americans who support Trump.  They think Trump is another Viktor Orban and they badly want the USA to become like Hungary.  Luckily we're still a democracy....but barely. 

[LosLobo]

38 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Here’s a thing.

 

There are two real and serious threats arising from Trump illegally removing TS/SCI documents to his Mar-a-Largo home.

 

The first real and serious threat is to Trump himself, we know he’s under criminal investigation for violating the espionage Act, this is a real and serious threat to Trump’s liberty.

 

Trump supporters know this, hence they are focussed on trying to claim Trump has a right to have these documents at his home/declassified these documents and/or these documents were planted - Well good luck with that, it won’t work.

 

Senator Paul Rand had taken a different tack, he suddenly wants to repeal the Espionage Act. This begs a question, what threat is Rand facing from this case that he feels the US does not need an Act of law outlawing Espionage?

 

All of the above is a threat to Trump and those in his immediate sphere.

 

But then there’s this, the real nasty, real dangerous threat:

 

Who has had access to these TS/SCI documents while they were in Trump’s possession at Mar-a-Largo?

 

We have learned from news reports that the FBI have obtained video footage of the document boxes being moved around Mar-a-Largo at times after Trump’s attorney(s) had already submitted statements that all documents were returned (unequivocal evidence of false statements/obstruction of Justice and hence more threats to Trump).

 

But this ‘movement’ of the documents raises a question. Why were the documents being moved? 
 

Who was being given access to the documents?

 

This is the real threat, not to Trump but to US National Security.

 

If, as reported, the TS/SCI documents included documents relating to US Nuclear Weapons Systems then the possibility of US adversaries getting access to these documents has to be considered a reality.

 

This is a threat to US National Security and is something all Americans should be concerned about.

 

It’s not about Trump, it’s about the whole of the US.

Nobody gets to ignore this threat, play this threat down, claim this is not a real threat and still maintain any claim whatsoever to being a patriot.

 

 

 

Rand Paul's behaviour seems suspicious in wanting to repeal the Espionage Act.

He also was the lone wolf in wanting to block the US 40 billion aid bill support Ukraine against Russia.

Rand Paul blocks bipartisan effort to swiftly pass Ukraine aid - CNNPolitics
 

[Berkshire]

1 minute ago, LosLobo said:

Rand Paul's behaviour seems suspicious in wanting to repeal the Espionage Act.

He also was the lone wolf in wanting to block the US 40 billion aid bill support Ukraine against Russia.

Rand Paul blocks bipartisan effort to swiftly pass Ukraine aid - CNNPolitics
 

Are you talking about Rand Paul (R-Moscow)?

[proton]

36 minutes ago, heybruce said:

Trump's 2024 campaign slogan--MAUA, Make America Unsafe Again.

Biden, or is it the 46? has already achieved that by gifting millions of dollars worth of arms to the Taliban, having no southern border control and making the USA a world wide joke. ????

[Thingamabob]

38 minutes ago, heybruce said:

I've cracked the code:  "Speaking as a Brit" means the poster has views far outside the mainstream for the UK but wants people to think he speaks for his country.

So how do you think Biden regards the UK?

[ozimoron]

2 hours ago, Bkk Brian said:

From none other than Fox News......lol

 

Sources told Fox News that some records could be covered by executive privilege, which gives the president of the United States and other officials within the executive branch the authority to withhold certain sensitive forms of advice and consultation between the president and senior advisers. 

 

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/fbi-seizes-privileged-trump-records-during-raid-doj-opposes-request-independent-review-sources

For a document to be covered by attorney client privilege it must be generated by the attorney or by the client in communication with the attorney. Presidential records do not fall into this category.

[Jingthing]

1 hour ago, Thingamabob said:

Speaking as a Brit we all know Biden hates us, his closest allies, and betrayed us over the manner of the USA's withdrawal from Afganisthan. At least Trump told us of his plan to withdraw. Nothing at all from Biden. On that basis alone give me Trump anytime.

I hereby give you Trump.

Please don't ever send him back.

[Walker88]

16 minutes ago, proton said:

Biden, or is it the 46? has already achieved that by gifting millions of dollars worth of arms to the Taliban, having no southern border control and making the USA a world wide joke. ????

Such a joke that Finland and Sweden want to join the rebuilt and better-than-ever NATO.

 

Lowest UE among Western nations also delivered, even after inheriting 6.8% UE from 45.

 

And what 'millions of dollars worth of arms' did Biden give to the Taliban (those Taliban 45 released from jail and who now run the country)?

 

Perhaps you also forgot 45 actually invited the Taliban to Camp David in a meeting that would have happened on 9-11-20, but it was cancelled when the lout was informed it would be a 'bad optic'.

 

I do know Biden delivered one particularly special arm to Ayman al -Zawahiri, so maybe that's what you are talking about.

 

The 'world wide joke' you claim is a fantasy Fever Swamp dwellers have. Instead, though while the world fears the idiocy of the voters in the US who still support 45, the US post-45 is RESPECTED again around the world and feared where fear is wise. Democracy might win, despite the best efforts of the fascists like 45 and his ilk.

[candide]

38 minutes ago, proton said:

Biden, or is it the 46? has already achieved that by gifting millions of dollars worth of arms to the Taliban, having no southern border control and making the USA a world wide joke. ????

And who was the world's laughing stock? ????

Trump cuts NATO summit trip short after world leaders appear to mock him in video????

https://www.businessinsider.com/trump-leaving-nato-summit-early-world-leaders-mock-him-video-2019-12

[heybruce]

17 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

I hereby give you Trump.

Please don't ever send him back.

Take our former President.....Please!

[heybruce]

38 minutes ago, proton said:

Biden, or is it the 46? has already achieved that by gifting millions of dollars worth of arms to the Taliban, having no southern border control and making the USA a world wide joke. ????

It was Trump's peace deal that was an incredible gift to the Taliban, Biden was the one stuck with delivering it.

 

The border is no more or less secure than under Trump.

 

The USA became a laughingstock to the world when it elected Trump.