Story Of My Thai Citizenship Application

[onthemoon]

14 hours ago, khongaeng said:

Big congratulations to all of you on this most recent batch.  Just this last week I travelled on my new Thai passport.  Since I applied for an ABTC card, I even went through the diplomatic/VIP security.  What a great experience to go through immigration as a Thai!

 

I agree, the paperwork is not much more difficult than the annual visa renewal.  The difficult part is making sure you have all the boxes checked.  If you are married and employed then you should start the process right now, because it is just a waiting game.  I have a few friends that were paying millions of baht in Taxes each year for decades, but they didn't apply for citizenship when they had all the boxes ticked.  Now that they are retired, they are no longer eligible and have to restart Non O visa and set up their own company to have a WP just to jump through the hoops to apply now.  See if you qualify, and if you do, don't hesitate, life is so much easier (assuming you are from a country that doesn't require you to renounce your original nationality). 

Thanks for the info. Can you apply for the ABTC card right away, or do you have to prove with your new Thai passport first that you actually travel a lot on business to the member countries?

I do (or did, before Covid), and that card would help me a lot.

[qualtrough]

On 8/6/2021 at 3:58 AM, heiri007 said:

Holy cow, ma name's on it, I made it! Was in the April oath batch indeed - kudos to the relevant authorities for speedy work during this crisis!

 

Thanks for sharing @sinthavee guess I have reason to celebrate a bit.

 Wow, this gives me hope that my wait will be more like half a year than a full year. Keeping my fingers crossed.

[sinthavee]

1 hour ago, qualtrough said:

 Wow, this gives me hope that my wait will be more like half a year than a full year. Keeping my fingers crossed.

Hi Qualtrough brother,

I expect RG by Nov 2021, based on Apr oath batch RG came by Aug 2nd week. If it turns out right, we can have our ID & PP within Dec this year.

[david143]

10 minutes ago, sinthavee said:

Hi Qualtrough brother,

I expect RG by Nov 2021, based on Apr oath batch RG came by Aug 2nd week. If it turns out right, we can have our ID & PP within Dec this year.

Sinthavee brother
did your name not released in 5th August RG.

[sinthavee]

2 minutes ago, david143 said:

Sinthavee brother
did your name not released in 5th August RG.

No David143 brother,

I am from Sep 2020 Bora interview batch & had my oath on 27th July this year.

[david143]

Just now, sinthavee said:

No David143 brother,

I am from Sep 2020 Bora interview batch & had my oath on 27th July this year.

then November is your Date , hopefully it will go smoothly.

[sinthavee]

33 minutes ago, david143 said:

then November is your Date , hopefully it will go smoothly.

Thank you; I hope so.

[heiri007]

Question for citizens who got their ID: What's the process after we receive the naturalization document? Someone told me each district handles the issuance of ID differently. Some don't trust the naturalization doc and request other written confirmation from somewhere, which might take a long time. Shouldn't there be data in a central system for them to verify and check on the spot?

[GabbaGabbaHey]

1 hour ago, heiri007 said:

Question for citizens who got their ID: What's the process after we receive the naturalization document? Someone told me each district handles the issuance of ID differently. Some don't trust the naturalization doc and request other written confirmation from somewhere, which might take a long time. Shouldn't there be data in a central system for them to verify and check on the spot?

This was my experience in September last year:

 

The day I got the certificate at SB I signed two papers, paid the 500 THB fee, got the certificate with certified documents, 3 are certified copies of the RG, I made few photos with the boss and the officer in charge who congratulated me, total took 30 minutes. Then I went to my district with my wife and the registration guy asked to see key documents to prepare for the "ID day": he kept one certified copy of the RG and asked for photocopies so we went outside to prepare these: marriage cert, kids birth certificate, tabian baan, my pink ID (I had PR), passport, PR books, WP copy (screenshot of the e-WP actually), and of course the Thai citizenship certificate. He explained that two witnesses would be needed on "ID issuance day", my wife being one and her sister the other person (he said they had to be relatives, he said Thai children older than 25 would be accepted as witnesses), and he agreed to book the day one week later and requested that we come in very early morning. The pictures they asked for were 1.5 x 2 inch, so different size from those done for SB.

 

ID issuance day. I arrived to the district at 8:30. Since we had appointment no need for a queue ticket. Then there was a bunch of successive informal interviews and chats with the registrar, the senior officer and few people who enter data into the system, so you need to basically go through reviewing the forms before you sign and having details like your parents and siblings name transliterated and entered too (I thought SB or MOI would have passed the whole stuff but no, it's a different office, and sadly I forgot my special document with all information at home, so we had to Google for some translation of my brother firstname into Thai language), then my family witnesses also had little interview and some signatures to provide, all this moving slowly from one desk to another because the registration was split into several parts.. until I got to the finger print and the photo shooting steps and the last one was ID issuance. I already had my name in blue tabian baan before from PR (which only got strikedthrough on my original nationality with "ไทย" being added manually and registrar signature beside) but it seems this did not speed up anything. Or perhaps people without blue book could expect an extra hour for that? I hane no idea. I finally got my ID at 11:30am. Total time 3 hours.

 

Edited August 7, 2021 by GabbaGabbaHey

[heiri007]

21 minutes ago, GabbaGabbaHey said:

This was my experience in September last year:

 

The day I got the certificate at SB I signed two papers, paid the 500 THB fee, got the certificate with certified documents, 3 are certified copies of the RG, I made few photos with the boss and the officer in charge who congratulated me, total took 30 minutes. Then I went to my district with my wife and the registration guy asked to see key documents to prepare for the "ID day": he kept one certified copy of the RG and asked for photocopies so we went outside to prepare these: marriage cert, kids birth certificate, tabian baan, my pink ID (I had PR), passport, PR books, WP copy (screenshot of the e-WP actually), and of course the Thai citizenship certificate. He explained that two witnesses would be needed on "ID issuance day", my wife being one and her sister the other person (he said they had to be relatives, he said Thai kids older than 25 would be accepted as witnesses), and he agreed to book the day one week later and requested that we come in very early morning. The pictures they asked for were 1.5 x 2 inch, so different size from those done for SB.

 

ID issuance day. I arrived to the district at 8:30. Since we had appointment no need for a queue ticket. Then there was a bunch of successive informal interviews and chats with the registrar, the senior officer and few people who enter data into the system, so you need to basically go through reviewing the forms before you sign and having details like your parents and siblings name transliterated and entered too (I thought SB or MOI would have passed the whole stuff but no, it's a different office, and sadly I forgot my special document with all information at home, so we had to Google for some translation of my brother firstname into Thai language), then my family witnesses also had little interview and some signatures to provide, all this moving slowly from one desk to another because the registration was split into several parts.. until I got to the finger print and the photo shooting steps and the last one was ID issuance. I already had my name in blue tabian baan before from PR (which only got strikedthrough on my original nationality with "ไทย" being added manually and registrar signature beside) but it seems this did not speed up anything. Or perhaps people without blue book could expect an extra hour for that? I hane no idea. I finally got my ID at 11:30am. Total time 3 hours.

 

One would expect the push of the button and the ID comes out, because as I remember I've given all personal and family details already countless times, but of course the final mountain of paperwork will be a pleasurable one. Thanks for sharing @GabbaGabbaHey it will all be about the auspicious time and the wife will know exactly. 

[GarryP]

35 minutes ago, GabbaGabbaHey said:

This was my experience in September last year:

 

The day I got the certificate at SB I signed two papers, paid the 500 THB fee, got the certificate with certified documents, 3 are certified copies of the RG, I made few photos with the boss and the officer in charge who congratulated me, total took 30 minutes. Then I went to my district with my wife and the registration guy asked to see key documents to prepare for the "ID day": he kept one certified copy of the RG and asked for photocopies so we went outside to prepare these: marriage cert, kids birth certificate, tabian baan, my pink ID (I had PR), passport, PR books, WP copy (screenshot of the e-WP actually), and of course the Thai citizenship certificate. He explained that two witnesses would be needed on "ID issuance day", my wife being one and her sister the other person (he said they had to be relatives, he said Thai children older than 25 would be accepted as witnesses), and he agreed to book the day one week later and requested that we come in very early morning. The pictures they asked for were 1.5 x 2 inch, so different size from those done for SB.

 

ID issuance day. I arrived to the district at 8:30. Since we had appointment no need for a queue ticket. Then there was a bunch of successive informal interviews and chats with the registrar, the senior officer and few people who enter data into the system, so you need to basically go through reviewing the forms before you sign and having details like your parents and siblings name transliterated and entered too (I thought SB or MOI would have passed the whole stuff but no, it's a different office, and sadly I forgot my special document with all information at home, so we had to Google for some translation of my brother firstname into Thai language), then my family witnesses also had little interview and some signatures to provide, all this moving slowly from one desk to another because the registration was split into several parts.. until I got to the finger print and the photo shooting steps and the last one was ID issuance. I already had my name in blue tabian baan before from PR (which only got strikedthrough on my original nationality with "ไทย" being added manually and registrar signature beside) but it seems this did not speed up anything. Or perhaps people without blue book could expect an extra hour for that? I hane no idea. I finally got my ID at 11:30am. Total time 3 hours.

 

For me I had not anticipated the two witness requirement (both of whom needed to be registered in the same district - Prakanong), so while my son helped fill out a very long document at the district office, I gave my local "win motorcycle" guy a call. He arrived in about 15 minutes, so he and my son were my witnesses. The officials tried to fob me of with doing the ID card on the following day, but I managed to persuade their boss that they could do everything that day. BTW I had known the motorcycle tax man for about 15 years at that time.      

[yankee99]

1 hour ago, heiri007 said:

One would expect the push of the button and the ID comes out, because as I remember I've given all personal and family details already countless times, but of course the final mountain of paperwork will be a pleasurable one. Thanks for sharing @GabbaGabbaHey it will all be about the auspicious time and the wife will know exactly. 

This sounds like more work than anything except the original application. Hope my office is more lenient. 

[qualtrough]

8 hours ago, sinthavee said:

Hi Qualtrough brother,

I expect RG by Nov 2021, based on Apr oath batch RG came by Aug 2nd week. If it turns out right, we can have our ID & PP within Dec this year.

Howdy! Well that would be fantastic. Anything less than a year would be great so I don't have to my visa/wp again.

[Neeranam]

16 hours ago, heiri007 said:

Question for citizens who got their ID: What's the process after we receive the naturalization document? Someone told me each district handles the issuance of ID differently. Some don't trust the naturalization doc and request other written confirmation from somewhere, which might take a long time. Shouldn't there be data in a central system for them to verify and check on the spot?

On the same day as getting naturalization doc, I went with my wife and documents to the khet. The woman said to come back the next month which would have meant my visa would need renewed. I pleaded and said I'd be 'extremely grateful' if she could fit me in somehow before the end of the month; she managed to give me the next week, and got a nice bonus for doing so.  

Arrived at the khet at 1.30 and was out with a blue ID card at 2.45. Only thing was that she told me I'd only need one witness but the second day said I need 2.

Easy solution the other witness(house owner) called his son who jumped on a bike and came in 10 min. I was worried as he's only 19 but no problem.

 

[RAZZELL]

So can anyone give me a rough timescale?

 

6-7 years to fulfil all the requirements and finish application?

 

RAZZ

[Neeranam]

12 minutes ago, RAZZELL said:

So can anyone give me a rough timescale?

 

6-7 years to fulfil all the requirements and finish application?

 

RAZZ

These days, I'd say 5-8 years.

3 year WP and tax receipts+ 2-4 years application process. 

[GabbaGabbaHey]

1 hour ago, Neeranam said:

These days, I'd say 5-8 years.

3 year WP and tax receipts+ 2-4 years application process. 

This is true for a man who has a Thai wife, at least one child and married for more than one year, otherwise married for more than 3 years.

 

For a man who has no Thai wife, going through PR is mandatory route and will take 13+ years (5 to get PR + 5 of PR + 3 of citizenship process) which is roughly 8 years min from the year you get PR. 

[Arkady]

On 8/7/2021 at 4:04 PM, heiri007 said:

Question for citizens who got their ID: What's the process after we receive the naturalization document? Someone told me each district handles the issuance of ID differently. Some don't trust the naturalization doc and request other written confirmation from somewhere, which might take a long time. Shouldn't there be data in a central system for them to verify and check on the spot?

My naturalisation certificate took nearly all day at SB because the officers noticed that there was an error in all the certificates before they handed them out. They managed to redo them but the poo yai with the signing power was not in the office, as seems quite normal, and it took them a couple of hours to track him down and persuade him to come in and re-sign a bunch of certificates. We all hung out at the SB coffee shop and and eventually were called in for our ceremonies.  My original case officer had returned from an enforced two year stint as a supervisor on shift work at Suvaranabhumi Immigration which she had loathed. I was all smiles and didn't mention to her anything about the problems I had had with the MoI while she was away due to her error in putting me in for exemption from the singing which I wasn't eligible for and which nearly got my application rejected and resulted in an additional six months and re-submission of most documents. All's well that ends well. 

 

For the next step, experiences seem to vary depending on the DO and who's in charge there at the time. I went there and was told I had to make an appointment a week ahead and was given a checklist of things to bring including 2 witnesses.  When I came back for the appointment with the 2 witnesses I was told I only needed 1 and that my wife could do it, which I thought was strange.  WP was on the list but I didn't have it because the company had collected all the expats' WPs some weeks earlier to change the name of the company and hadn't returned them.  This didn't matter, as long as you could provide a credible explanation for missing documents. 

The process was a bit torturous, starting with tabien baan section, as it involved spelling names of parents and siblings etc in Thai which I hadn't prepared for, although I had of course done it all before at SB. They already had my parents birth places in the computer but refused to look them up. I already had a blue book as a PR and they just altered my nationality in red ink which I thought was a pretty <deleted> result after such a long process. In fact the book looked like a dog's dinner because my nationality had already been changed from English to British and my parents' nationalities had been changed from "nationality not specified" to British. I was surprised that Thais who are normally so form over substance and like everything to look riap roy would be satisfied with such shoddy looking work.   Anyway I asked for a new book and she said come back here when you have got your ID card.  I did as she suggested and and a new book was printed out in a few minutes for a fee of 100 baht which I felt was well worth it.

 

The tabien baan section was painfully slow, although very friendly, and took 3 hours, so that everyone was going for lunch when I finished.  After lunch a rather bolshy woman in the ID card section gave me to the bad news that the only person who new how to issue ID cards to newly minted Thais was on holiday and would I like to make a new appointment to see her next week.  No I bloody well wouldn't was the answer.  They asked the various desks if someone was willing to take on the huge challenge of issuing an ID card to a new Thai.  Luckily a kindly lady was willing to step up to the plate and started looking up the procedures in the computer.  Everything had to be done from first principles including the Thai spellings of foreign place names and of course it was all rather slow because she was figuring it out as she went along and asking others for advice.  I asked why not just get exactly the same information from the tabien baan section on the other side of the room but she said the ID section had to take responsibility for the accuracy and couldn't just assume that the tabien baan section had done it all correctly.  Finally all was done just as they were preparing to close the office and the missus took the obligatory pic of me holding up the brand new ID card in front of the office. 

 

My experience of spending the whole day in the DO from 9.00 am to closing time seems unusual but it is worth going early in the morning in case there are hiccups.

[sinthavee]

22 minutes ago, Arkady said:

My naturalisation certificate took nearly all day at SB because the officers noticed that there was an error in all the certificates before they handed them out. They managed to redo them but the poo yai with the signing power was not in the office, as seems quite normal, and it took them a couple of hours to track him down and persuade him to come in and re-sign a bunch of certificates. We all hung out at the SB coffee shop and and eventually were called in for our ceremonies.  My original case officer had returned from an enforced two year stint as a supervisor on shift work at Suvaranabhumi Immigration which she had loathed. I was all smiles and didn't mention to her anything about the problems I had had with the MoI while she was away due to her error in putting me in for exemption from the singing which I wasn't eligible for and which nearly got my application rejected and resulted in an additional six months and re-submission of most documents. All's well that ends well. 

 

For the next step, experiences seem to vary depending on the DO and who's in charge there at the time. I went there and was told I had to make an appointment a week ahead and was given a checklist of things to bring including 2 witnesses.  When I came back for the appointment with the 2 witnesses I was told I only needed 1 and that my wife could do it, which I thought was strange.  WP was on the list but I didn't have it because the company had collected all the expats' WPs some weeks earlier to change the name of the company and hadn't returned them.  This didn't matter, as long as you could provide a credible explanation for missing documents. 

The process was a bit torturous, starting with tabien baan section, as it involved spelling names of parents and siblings etc in Thai which I hadn't prepared for, although I had of course done it all before at SB. They already had my parents birth places in the computer but refused to look them up. I already had a blue book as a PR and they just altered my nationality in red ink which I thought was a pretty <deleted> result after such a long process. In fact the book looked like a dog's dinner because my nationality had already been changed from English to British and my parents' nationalities had been changed from "nationality not specified" to British. I was surprised that Thais who are normally so form over substance and like everything to look riap roy would be satisfied with such shoddy looking work.   Anyway I asked for a new book and she said come back here when you have got your ID card.  I did as she suggested and and a new book was printed out in a few minutes for a fee of 100 baht which I felt was well worth it.

 

The tabien baan section was painfully slow, although very friendly, and took 3 hours, so that everyone was going for lunch when I finished.  After lunch a rather bolshy woman in the ID card section gave me to the bad news that the only person who new how to issue ID cards to newly minted Thais was on holiday and would I like to make a new appointment to see her next week.  No I bloody well wouldn't was the answer.  They asked the various desks if someone was willing to take on the huge challenge of issuing an ID card to a new Thai.  Luckily a kindly lady was willing to step up to the plate and started looking up the procedures in the computer.  Everything had to be done from first principles including the Thai spellings of foreign place names and of course it was all rather slow because she was figuring it out as she went along and asking others for advice.  I asked why not just get exactly the same information from the tabien baan section on the other side of the room but she said the ID section had to take responsibility for the accuracy and couldn't just assume that the tabien baan section had done it all correctly.  Finally all was done just as they were preparing to close the office and the missus took the obligatory pic of me holding up the brand new ID card in front of the office. 

 

My experience of spending the whole day in the DO from 9.00 am to closing time seems unusual but it is worth going early in the morning in case there are hiccups.

Wow! What an experience. I think most people who have gone through the whole process, would have had some unexpected stumbling blocks on the way. But, the journey is fully worth all the efforts. Thanks Arkady brother, for sharing your experience.

[khongaeng]

On 8/6/2021 at 11:13 PM, onthemoon said:

Thanks for the info. Can you apply for the ABTC card right away, or do you have to prove with your new Thai passport first that you actually travel a lot on business to the member countries?

I do (or did, before Covid), and that card would help me a lot.

I got my Thai ID card one day, applied for my passport the next, and applied for ABTC a few days later when I received my passport in the mail.  With COVID-19 some countries are not approving the visas at all (it seems) and others take much longer than the advertised 1-2 months, but within 4 months, I already had 17 out of 19 countries in the scheme approving my application, so I paid an extra 1000 baht to get a "temporary" card that is valid for the 17 countries I am already approved for.  I suspect sometime later next year, I will finally get the "real" ABTC card, but since it is only valid for as long as your passport is and only up to 5 years, and since Thai passports are still only valid for 5 years, I decided that I should apply for ABTC as soon as I got my passport to maximize the time I can use the card before having to renew.  Everything worked without at hitch.  I set up my own company to check the boxes for applying for citizenship, and now that I have citizenship, it now qualifies me to apply for ABTC.  The timing just happened to work out perfectly since the company has to be "on the books" for at least 3 years before anyone at that company can qualify to apply for an ABTC card.  

 

Application for the card is incredibly easy, if your company meets the requirements.  It requires about the same level of effort as renewing a Non-O visa every year, except for the fact that you go through the process entirely online! The card is worth it for me since now I can travel visa free to countries like China and Russia where my previous passport required me to go through the hassle of applying and paying for visas, this, in addition to the benefit of going through the diplomatic lanes in the airports in Asia (even including the US, Mexico, and Canada!) is worth its weight in gold.  Flying into South America and going through the diplomatic lane as a Thai was a cool experience last week.  Not looking forward to quarantine in Thailand when I return... 

[heiri007]

39 minutes ago, khongaeng said:

I got my Thai ID card one day, applied for my passport the next, and applied for ABTC a few days later when I received my passport in the mail.  With COVID-19 some countries are not approving the visas at all (it seems) and others take much longer than the advertised 1-2 months, but within 4 months, I already had 17 out of 19 countries in the scheme approving my application, so I paid an extra 1000 baht to get a "temporary" card that is valid for the 17 countries I am already approved for.  I suspect sometime later next year, I will finally get the "real" ABTC card, but since it is only valid for as long as your passport is and only up to 5 years, and since Thai passports are still only valid for 5 years, I decided that I should apply for ABTC as soon as I got my passport to maximize the time I can use the card before having to renew.  Everything worked without at hitch.  I set up my own company to check the boxes for applying for citizenship, and now that I have citizenship, it now qualifies me to apply for ABTC.  The timing just happened to work out perfectly since the company has to be "on the books" for at least 3 years before anyone at that company can qualify to apply for an ABTC card.  

 

Application for the card is incredibly easy, if your company meets the requirements.  It requires about the same level of effort as renewing a Non-O visa every year, except for the fact that you go through the process entirely online! The card is worth it for me since now I can travel visa free to countries like China and Russia where my previous passport required me to go through the hassle of applying and paying for visas, this, in addition to the benefit of going through the diplomatic lanes in the airports in Asia (even including the US, Mexico, and Canada!) is worth its weight in gold.  Flying into South America and going through the diplomatic lane as a Thai was a cool experience last week.  Not looking forward to quarantine in Thailand when I return... 

So ABTC only issued for company reps, not privat "biz traveler"?

[Neeranam]

18 hours ago, Arkady said:

WP was on the list but I didn't have it because the company had collected all the expats' WPs some weeks earlier to change the name of the company and hadn't returned them.  This didn't matter, as long as you could provide a credible explanation for missing documents. 

Luckily, I wasn't asked for my WP after the NIA interview.  

[Capella]

1 hour ago, khongaeng said:

since Thai passports are still only valid for 5 years

Thai passports are now valid for 10 years (a recent change). You can apply for a new one anytime you like - no need to let the old one run out. 

[Neeranam]

57 minutes ago, Capella said:

Thai passports are now valid for 10 years (a recent change). You can apply for a new one anytime you like - no need to let the old one run out. 

Great, I got one earlier this year, only 5 years.

[david143]

5 years 1000THB
10 Years 1500THB
I will apply straight 10 Years 

[Neeranam]

What are the consequences of using our old passports in Thailand, for example registering for a Covid vaccine?

[GarryP]

1 hour ago, Capella said:

Thai passports are now valid for 10 years (a recent change). You can apply for a new one anytime you like - no need to let the old one run out. 

Yes, I renewed my Thai passport one day before the official change to 10 years. Only learned about the change afterwards. Typical of my luck.  

[david143]

Just now, Neeranam said:

What are the consequences of using our old passports in Thailand, for example registering for a Covid vaccine?

my second Dose is on 26 August 2021 Astra
I already checked with Vimut hospital and they said  after 2nd shot we can request Data change once ID in hand

[GarryP]

4 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

Great, I got one earlier this year, only 5 years.

Me too. But it also changed to 10 years later this year. For me, the day after renewal of my 5 year passport. ????

[GabbaGabbaHey]

48 minutes ago, GarryP said:

Me too. But it also changed to 10 years later this year. For me, the day after renewal of my 5 year passport. ????

Why not make a new one to get 10 years? technically all you will lose is 1000 baht -the cost of the one you just did-, I mean, if it has importance to you.