Time to revise ALL the different entry and retirement marriage visas?

[WhiteBuffaloATM]

Too many cheap charlie illegal farang immigrants playing hobbyist rice farmers or intl. playboys to relax internal visa controls.The internal three month / reg. address visa control system is there for a reason…….

Stopping “Visa Exempt” entry would remove most riff raff types overnight.

Require all Tourists to secure Embassy Issued non- extendable Three / Six Month Tourist Visas.

Resulting in Immediate Tourism Reset to High Quality People Only.

Stop All Internal Visa / Extention Issues / Agent Use for non-Property Owners.

Longstay Visas from Thai Embassy Only, including Police Clearance.

Problem is such measures would drastically cut Imm. Income, so wont happen.

These suggestions are Post- Covid of course.

[Andycoops]

Never going to happen.

[Rampant Rabbit]

18 hours ago, DrJack54 said:

OP, on one hand you refer to tourists and same breathe refer to "only one year visas". Don't sound like tourists to me.

As for retirees, I am one and find it a very straight forward walk in the park system.

90 day reports are stupid agreed. 

I think that Thailand has a very relaxed clear and simple system. 

 

Fascinating ????

[ubonjoe]

31 minutes ago, Rinrada said:

Yes.. have had to do all of that ....jfi...a small point...ref "walk to Amphur for updated marriage certificate"...Maybe a local thing but got all the paperwork done for First extension last year...but seems said updated marriage certificate... now Not Required..?...Our local Amphur manager.. wife knows her well confirmed.."No Need"..?..Will pick up my second extension in a few weeks time...so...will see..

You get a print out of your Kor Ror 2 (or 22 for foreign marriages) to prove you have not gotten divorced.

A marriage certificate cannot be updated.

I think most offices want a new Kor Ror 2 every year. IMO it is best to get a new one every year unless told it is not needed.

It only takes my wife a few minutes to get one a few days before I do the application.

[WhiteBuffaloATM]

Too many cheap charlie illegal farang immigrants playing hobbyist rice farmers or intl. playboys to relax internal visa controls.The internal three month / reg. address visa control system is there for a reason…….

Stopping “Visa Exempt” entry would remove most riff raff types overnight.

Require all Tourists to secure Embassy Issued non- extendable Three / Six Month Tourist Visas.

Resulting in Immediate Tourism Reset to High Quality People Only.

Stop All Internal Visa / Extention Issues / Agent Use for non-Property Owners.

Longstay Visas from Thai Embassy Only, including Police Clearance.

Problem is such measures would drastically cut Imm. Income, so wont happen.

These suggestions are Post- Covid of course.

 

Major Blunt Post Wake Up Calls:

 

Immigration here is a BUSINESS to Maximise Profits. To Pinch not help Foreigners. Rules intended to drive exasperated Foreigners to Agents or disadvantage Direct Customers ( 800k in thai bank, etc).

Clue: Genuine Immigration does not permit “Agents”.

Everybody here without Permanent Residency is treated as, and  effectively is, a TOURIST.

The clue is in the term “Longstay” Visa ( not “ Residence” Visa).

[NanLaew]

As mentioned earlier, Vietnam has stopped the back-to-back visa route for foreigners to long-stay, Indonesia are putting the kibosh on backpackers and Malaysia's rejigged M2H visa entitlement is going to be so expensive that a whole lot of pensioners currently in country will probably be selling up and going home.

 

Thailand isn't about to buck the regional 'we don't need you any more' trend now is it?

Edited September 15, 2021 by NanLaew

[jwest10]

20 hours ago, Dmaxdan said:

If you relax the visa rules, you run the risk of attracting more riff raff and we don't want that, do we?

Yes, we still have many and the liars and cheats giving false addresses in the UK and others and get their State pensions increased every year and there are more.

[WhiteBuffaloATM]

spidermike: hideous treatment over your Marriage Stay Extention. first class corrective action though.

Refer my above opinions ….. attitude is “you are just a glorified Tourist. Go Back Home. Apply There”.

And no Agent Income as you had the temerity to apply Direct……plus IO a likely poor govt worker with poor thai husband so big time jealously thing….why did you not avoid female IO !? Getting sloppy are we in your dotage ? he he just joking….. personally would never marry ( again) here or anywhere….

wife status gives women waaaaay too much power over the husband….. could easily take everything here from you, including your sanity……my property & car here in my name….but Will leaves All to my great Lady / Kid…..

[jwest10]

18 hours ago, Kopitiam said:

Must be a boring day.  Its too early to dream.

LOL for you maybe but the same issues daily , granted. SURVIVAL

[VocalNeal]

18 hours ago, itsallmine68 said:

I am talking about the whole system and revising it tourist,

retirees etc 

Forget the why. Think about the how? 

[VocalNeal]

I don't mind the 90 day reporting. In BKK I paid a guy to do it for me. Up north I drive 15kms and do it myself, then go for lunch. There is hardly ever anyone in the Immigration Office.    

Edited September 15, 2021 by VocalNeal

[CM Dad]

19 hours ago, DrJack54 said:

Why don't you suggest exactly what changes you have in mind. At the end of your OP you use words ....."relax the rules". What do you have in mind.

Skip the 90 report part. It's a given that it should be ditched.

What else...??

Those who are married to Thais and have families here should be given something like the Green Card that is given to Thais married to citizens in the US.

[DrJack54]

1 hour ago, CM Dad said:

Those who are married to Thais and have families here should be given something like the Green Card that is given to Thais married to citizens in the US.

Why?

Did USA make the blueprint for worldwide immigration rules.

[tracker1]

3 hours ago, Rinrada said:

Yes.. have had to do all of that ....jfi...a small point...ref "walk to Amphur for updated marriage certificate"...Maybe a local thing but got all the paperwork done for First extension last year...but seems said updated marriage certificate... now Not Required..?...Our local Amphur manager.. wife knows her well confirmed.."No Need"..?..Will pick up my second extension in a few weeks time...so...will see..

which off

 

3 hours ago, 4MyEgo said:

Yes I have heard things vary from office to office, i.e. never had to get one in 3 years, then all of a sudden, needed it, suffice to say every year things change with them handing me paperwork back that was required the year before.

Same here the first 7 years just a copy of the marriage certificate then last year needed a updated Marriage Certificate oh and the bedroom photos  and the Map page they supplied that was headed Map seems every time they think up something new !

[Tropposurfer]

23 hours ago, Dmaxdan said:

If you relax the visa rules, you run the risk of attracting more riff raff and we don't want that, do we?

 

3 hours ago, spidermike007 said:

I agree. With the lack of tourists, and the tens of thousands of ex-pats who have quit Thailand for good, one would have thought it might have been an opportunity for immigration and this administration to develop some humility. Wow, was I ever wrong. I think the primay issue is they are either incapable or learning and adapting, like ancient dinosaurs, or they are simply too arrogant and out of touch to do so. 

 

Recently returned from immigration, after renewing my marriage visa. The upside to this visa, is that only 400,000 is needed as a deposit, and it does not have to stay in the bank, once your visa is granted. The downsides are:
The hurdles you need to jump over, in order to get a marriage visa are stupid, ridiculous, unnecessary, draconian, wasteful, and silly.

I understand the need for them to verify that you are a legitimate couple. Upon the first application.

But, the dumb requirements should not relate to renewals. You should not be required to show fresh images of the house each time, copies of the marriage papers, the house documents, either come with a local Thai witness, or bring a signed affidavit from a local Thai each time, provide new maps to the house, and dozens of other requirements.

I just do not even know what to say about the process. I felt like a street dog by the time I left. After hours of paperwork, copy after copy after copy, each page having to be signed, and then being grilling by the surly officer, I literally felt like a rabid stray dog. The level of disrespect that immigration shows married couples here, and foreigners in general, is totally uncalled for, beyond the pale, and inane. The copy woman, the guy sorting our papers, they were all nice. But, the officers? Such sourpusses. The woman who was helping us was so difficult to work with, when she finally rejected us over the tiniest thing she did not like, after nearly an hour of reviewing every document with a microscope, so to speak, and said no, I responded by saying yes. I a very loud voice, I said YES, you are going to do this. YES, you are going to do this right now. YES, you are going to stop saying NO to me right now. This ends now. She looked at me and did not know what to say. I asked for the manager. The top brass came over, and we had it sorted in 30 minutes. Took nearly 3 hours. And as usual, it will be a month, until I have final approval. Is it worth it? NO. It is my last marriage visa. I will go back to a retirement visa next year, or leave the country, before I subject myself to that abuse one more time.

They inevitably like to throw in something, to increase the difficulty of the process. Frankly, I think at least some of this comes from the rather extreme level of xenophobia and the toxic racism of the army. It filters down throughout the government. I do not think they want us here. And making these procedures difficult is one way of expressing that. Do not even mention how easy the retirement visa is. I understand all that. 
 
Fortunately, I feel very little of that racist sentiment from the non governmental Thai people. 

 

So, here is my suggestion. You qualify, you are not a criminal, and you have the money in the bank. We really need you. So, we will start visiting your home for a new visa. Only one page will be required, for you to sign, and we will give you multiple entry, five year visas, from now on, on the spot! For free! To show our gratitude, and eliminate all the dumb paperwork.

Let's hope somehow, someway these inane behaviours and procedures are changed i.e. as you mention new 'saner' visa rules an d procedures.

I often think that some of the systems are simply there to give people jobs.

As to the contradiction, meanness, and pettiness you describe it seems to be real too, and the only way one has any chance to circumvent, avoid, or to deflect it is to pay more money ... to someone, somewhere.  Jingoism sure isn't just a western malady that's for sure lol !

I watch/ed the goings on when buying my villa, car, drivers licenses, etc etc and it does seem like some time-warp colonial time revisited.

I have retirement visa - Elite and find this great, as I do the support from Elite in anything I am unsure about (I've called my support contact a few times about IO stuff and they helped negotiate 'face' and other things on the phone asap and with good spirit and happiness on all sides. 

[tracker1]

A big problem if not the biggest is that all Government Offices not just Immigration and Officers interrupt the rules individually sometimes not even in accordance with the printed rules !

[4MyEgo]

45 minutes ago, tracker1 said:

Same here the first 7 years just a copy of the marriage certificate then last year needed a updated Marriage Certificate oh and the bedroom photos  and the Map page they supplied that was headed Map seems every time they think up something new !

Sakon Nakhon, although they do say that the division they send it to for approval changes the rules every time so they have to make sure we comply so that it gets approved.

Edited September 15, 2021 by 4MyEgo

[Rinrada]

4 hours ago, ubonjoe said:

You get a print out of your Kor Ror 2 (or 22 for foreign marriages) to prove you have not gotten divorced.

A marriage certificate cannot be updated.

I think most offices want a new Kor Ror 2 every year. IMO it is best to get a new one every year unless told it is not needed.

It only takes my wife a few minutes to get one a few days before I do the application.

Update wrong word...I was of course ref to a new one.

[nahkit]

1 hour ago, DrJack54 said:

3 hours ago, CM Dad said:

Those who are married to Thais and have families here should be given something like the Green Card that is given to Thais married to citizens in the US.

Why?

Did USA make the blueprint for worldwide immigration rules.

Why? Because its a much fairer system, that's why.

 

When I applied for my US green card my wife and children (including my stepson) all qualified for cards as well. Once we were accepted that was it, no requirement for any of us to report our whereabouts every 90 days, no requirement for my wife to get me to sign a paper each year saying she can remain in the US.

[DrJack54]

1 hour ago, nahkit said:

Why? Because its a much fairer system, that's why.

 

When I applied for my US green card my wife and children (including my stepson) all qualified for cards as well. Once we were accepted that was it, no requirement for any of us to report our whereabouts every 90 days, no requirement for my wife to get me to sign a paper each year saying she can remain in the US.

Go and live in USA.

What they do in that country has nothing to do with immigration rules/policy in Thailand.

Your attitude is often typical. Sadly.

[khunPer]

On 9/14/2021 at 10:27 AM, itsallmine68 said:

With Thailand wanting to increase it not only Tourist trade but increase their number of retirees one would think they would relax the rules.

They already have, 10-years visa without 90-days reports, but the "good guys in" are those with money...????

[nahkit]

2 hours ago, DrJack54 said:

Go and live in USA.

What they do in that country has nothing to do with immigration rules/policy in Thailand.

Your attitude is often typical. Sadly.

You asked a question, I answered. Your reply is the typical immature response of person who can't stand to be contradicted.

 

[DrJack54]

8 minutes ago, nahkit said:

You asked a question, I answered. Your reply is the typical immature response of person who can't stand to be contradicted.

 

In part your answer is.......

 

"Why? Because its a much fairer system, that's why"

 

You call that a reply. 

You then follow up with details of the USA system. 

Zero to do with what Thailand has as it's immigration policy. 

[Gottfrid]

On 9/14/2021 at 5:16 PM, itsallmine68 said:

I am talking about the whole system and revising it tourist,

retirees etc 

I am not sure what you are talking about. First you start the thread with a post about the whole system. Then, when Dmaxdan make a post, you turn around and only focus on 90 day report. Now you are saying that you talk about the whole system again???? Very confusing!

Just take it easy. Everything is like DrJack54 post. It´s easy and like a walk in the park. The only time the system becomes hard, is when people want to stay without having the means to meet the visa requirements. It all says itself, if you do not meet the requirements there is always another place in the world where you will be able to stay. It´s always the ones that wish to fit in, but have no possibility that want things to change to fit them. That´s not how the world works.

[JUARNETTE]

On 9/14/2021 at 5:24 PM, mfd101 said:

There is a major cultural problem to overcome first: Thais love complexity. You just need to look at traditional Thai architecture to see that, and its effects on modern hiso houses.

 

Everything new in processes is an add-on, not a replacement. That's why you can have reasonably modern computing alongside 1960s bureaucratic practices (photocopies & mountains of paper) and poor education that encourages conformity not thinking.

 

So the Thai concept of 'order' looks to a Westerner like a counter-productive maze of contradictory instructions. Simplification is not likely, just more complexity.

You forgot to mention the one key item that starts the circle of chaos, and that is that EVERY Thai citizen has a scam going, and is dependent on it to maintain a level of living, if not for survival in many cases

[cheapcanuck]

We can dream...

[Seismic]

On 9/14/2021 at 5:16 PM, itsallmine68 said:

I am talking about the whole system and revising it tourist,

retirees etc 

Be careful what you wish for!