Fairly large nest egg needed to retire comfortably in Thailand

[JimTripper]

My answer to that is you should have had more children.

[KhunLA]

1 hour ago, GarryP said:

Her mum will get another 600 from the government, unless she has already hit 70, in which case she will get 700. 

Surely Thais don't expect to live their same lifestyle on the Thai soc sec scheme.  That's silly.  Especially the pittance they give here, and should be quite embarrassed about it.

 

Just as I certainly didn't expect or depend on USA soc sec to fund my retirement.   That would simply give me an existence in the USA.  MY USA soc sec is a bit more than most (average dispersed), and actually qualifies me for a retirement visa here.  With equity built up, home ownership, would be fine there.

 

Many Thais have equity built up, in home & land owned here.  Does anyone past a certain age, not think about a plan for their retirement ?

[Harveyboy]

2 hours ago, bkk6060 said:

The younger people are developing more western thinking.  They don't want to take care of old people.

oh dear what terrible news ..so my young wife i married to look after me in my old age....is going to <deleted> off and get a toy boy eh.. oh woe is me !!!!

[onekoolguy]

2 hours ago, KhunLA said:

How many Thais expect to live to be near 100.  Someone posted life expectancy is 77.7 yrs old here, so we are to assume they are retiring at 47 yrs old.

 

My estimated budget for wife's monthly living expense after I c r a p out, is about ฿10k, with nice account for emergencies, if needed.  Since Thai, she gets almost free healthcare.  Consider the house, car & motorbike will be paid for, and electric, powered by solar, as will the house, owned free & clear.  So about ฿300 a day to feed herself, and more than enough, as we do mostly in home food now anyway.

 

At 65 yrs old, ฿10k X 15 yrs / 180 months, and only 1.8 mill needed, and a few years past life expectancy.  Nobody (parents or siblings) has lived past 70 yrs old, and she's the baby, 20+ yrs younger than oldest sibling, having 8.

 

So if people retire at about 65 ish, and plan on living to near 100, then the article is accurate, but very unrealistic.

 

In my wife's case, without a big saving account, and if she goes through the proposed budget, then she could always sell the house for more than a few million baht, and finance another 10 or 20 yrs of living comfy.

I think that the largest problem for her will be her reletives trying to get loans (gifts) from her if they know that she has a large sum of cash? I have the same situation. Not sure how to get around it? Just leave her the funds and if she gives it away then its her choice?

[TropicalGuy]

3 hours ago, Bluespunk said:

''The National Economic and Social Development Council estimates that each person now needs approximately 3.1 million baht to spend around 30 retirement years in relative comfort.''

 

Really? That's just over 71,000 pounds-must cost more than that to live ''comfortably'' for 30 years.

About right in my case.With House Paid. 850 baht year Basic Local Operating Spend for couple with retired dependent. No Hiso Activity or Capital Spend. Increase by 200k for Capital Spend ; transport  / holidays/ house Renovations, etc.  Min. 1mill year. 

[KhunLA]

3 minutes ago, onekoolguy said:

I think that the largest problem for her will be her reletives trying to get loans (gifts) from her if they know that she has a large sum of cash? I have the same situation. Not sure how to get around it? Just leave her the funds and if she gives it away then its her choice?

Nah, we are actually the poor folks of the family.  All her siblings are older, with a lot more 'equity' and all self sufficient.  Half already retired, and early, and that Thai soc sec buys 1 meal out a month for them, if they are receiving. Maybe 3 of them, over 60.   All self employed, so do they even qualify ?

 

Her brother, now in USA, coming back soon, and going to give her a rai as having too many.  70 rai lot around a lake in NBLP, and giving everyone a rai.  Nephew, his son, just built a house there.  Think he expects all to build something & holiday there after he returns.  His own little commune.

 

She has no plans on leaving PKK for the NE.  Maybe a studio hut for once a year holiday there.  We couldn't wait to leave Udon Thani, sure not returning to the NE.  We visit for weddings & funerals.  She has one more parcel to sell in UT.  So one more trip up to there, hopefully this year, and will fund the EV purchase, instead of savings.  

[Jingthing]

Hmm.

Well this info is for Thais but I think a major variable is whether housing is owned.

As an expat even forgetting visa qualification money (which we can't but just for fun) 3 million baht with no or very very low Thai level pension would most certainly not last me 30 years. Not even close.

 

[GarryP]

2 minutes ago, KhunLA said:

Nah, we are actually the poor folks of the family.  All her siblings are older, with a lot more 'equity' and all self sufficient.  Half already retired, and early, and that Thai soc sec buys 1 meal out a month for them, if they are receiving. Maybe 3 of them, over 60.   All self employed, so do they even qualify ?

 

Her brother, now in USA, coming back soon, and going to give her a rai as having too many.  70 rai lot around a lake in NBLP, and giving everyone a rai.  Nephew, his son, just built a house there.  Think he expects all to build something & holiday there after he returns.  His own little commune.

 

She has no plans on leaving PKK for the NE.  Maybe a studio hut for once a year holiday there.  We couldn't wait to leave Udon Thani, sure not returning to the NE.  We visit for weddings & funerals.  She has one more parcel to sell in UT.  So one more trip up to there, hopefully this year, and will fund the EV purchase, instead of savings.  

After living in Bangkok for 40 years I'll be moving up to the North East (Kalasin) when I retire at the end of this year. We once contemplated moving to your neck of the woods but changed our minds. Reduced cost of living and being close to family were the main reasons. Two of my wife's sisters and her parents will all be in walking distance. Not rich but certainly not poor. Each of the sisters has her own small business and they all chip in to cover costs for their parents. 

[Chris Renaix]

4 hours ago, Bluespunk said:

''The National Economic and Social Development Council estimates that each person now needs approximately 3.1 million baht to spend around 30 retirement years in relative comfort.''

 

Really? That's just over 71,000 pounds-must cost more than that to live ''comfortably'' for 30 years.

You're absolutely right.  That comes to 8611 Baht/month, and with the inflation we're seeing these days...  they forgot to add another zero, I guess...

[Jingthing]

Another factor if you only have 3 million is what you do with the money.

I retired early with much less money than most westerners would have dared well before pension age so no income but I invested it aggressively. 

That could have backfired but happily it definitely didn't. 

Of course lottery tickets don't count.

Bitcoin? (ha ha)

[mahtin]

Does anyone past a certain age, not think about a plan for their retirement ?

 

(Outside the USA, you should have added.)

I would say yes.

 

 

[GarryP]

1 minute ago, mahtin said:

Does anyone past a certain age, not think about a plan for their retirement ?

 

(Outside the USA, you should have added.)

I would say yes.

 

 

Many would not really have a plan because without money, a plan is meaningless. How much are farmers and factory workers able to save. Probably very little. Blue collar workers paying in to the social security scheme here will receive at most about Baht 5,000 per month and that is probably what they will rely on. No other plans apart from slowly building a house on family land (if they have any). 

 

In the west, what with paying off mortgages for 30 or more years, many won't have much in the form of savings either when they retire so will rely on state pension or some other pension scheme. Retirement age in the west is continuing to increase too, so perhaps you don't need to put aside much as you'll not live too long after retirement. State pension age in the UK is now 66 but will increase to 67 in the next few years. 

 

I'll be retiring at 60 because I can. I don't want to continue working, but many may not have that choice here. They'll have to find something to do to bring in the money just to put food on the table.    

[sawadee1947]

It's going the same way as in Western Countries.

Not surprising. ????

[rwill]

And when these kids that don't want to support their parents what will they expect when they get old?

 

My brother-in-law has 4 kids.  Only one of them support him.

[Pouatchee]

4 hours ago, KhunLA said:

Consider the house, car & motorbike will be paid for, and electric, powered by solar, as will the house, owned free & clear.

You are not really realistic. How long do batteries last on a solar system? Not as long as you expect. Cars are high maintenance after a while and so will the solar system. 

[Gottfrid]

I just find it very good, that they finally starts to understand that you need money to retire. That´s a giant leap for Thaikind.

[Oxx]

Complete and utter tosh.  The Government in its wisdom has decided 600 baht pension paid monthly is enough for those aged under 69.  I'm sure they know better than armchair (or barstool) experts here on this site.

[KanchanaburiGuy]

Hmmm...........

 

There seems to be a lot of confusion about what "life expectancy" means. 

 

When actuarials talk about Thai people's "life expectancy" being "77.7 years," they're talking about the "life expectancy" of a person BORN THIS YEAR! And this number is based on knowing that some will die much younger, and some will live well passed that point. It's a projected AVERAGE. 

 

But here's the thing............. 

 

The longer a person has already lived, the progressively longer their projected "life expectancy" becomes!

 

Why is this? This is because all those younger ages when they might have died..... get factored out. They've already lived PAST those ages! Therefore, the average gets recalibrated!

 

Take me, for example......... 

 

When I was 38, I had a heart attack. Pretty young for one of those. But because I had a heart attack so young, my "life expectancy" got recalibrated from the 68-or-so it had been when I was born.............. to a disappointing 58! YIKES!

 

The expectation from having a heart attack so young was........... I'll probably have another one, and that one'll kill me....... well before "ripe old age" kicks in! (That was the good 'ol dying-at-younger-ages thing, dragging my projected average down! 555) 

 

When I turned 58 and was still kicking, I looked up my "life expectancy," yet again. SURPRISE! 

 

My NEW "life expectancy" was now 85! WOOHOO! 

 

Why? Because I had already survived all those younger years when I.......... (because of the heart attack)......... had a high likelihood of dying! The average got recalibrate! (I'm 64, now.) 

 

So........... 

 

If you know someone in their, say, mid-50s to mid-60s, their "life expectancy" now ISN'T "77.7 years!" 

 

Their "life expectancy" NOW is probably more like mid-to-late 80s, or maybe even 90s! And the longer they live......... the more might-have-died-already years they put behind them........... the higher that number will go! 

 

Are there people today with "life expectancies" into their 100s? Well, if they are already in their mid-to-late 80s or 90s........... there's a good chance there are! 

 

Continuing to survive pushes your "life expectancy" higher and higher! Anyone who's 80 today........... has probably already lived 15 years past what their "life expectancy" was when they were born!

 

And, I say, more power to 'em! 555

 

A "life expectancy" number can be pretty scary. It certainly was for me, as I skated my way towards  "58!"

 

But if you know how "life expectancy" actually works......... and if you know how long you've survived already........... then "life expectancy" shouldn't be a scary number, at all! 

 

And it especially.......... ESPECIALLY........ should never be a number on which you make a PLAN! Because "life expectancy" is.......... and always has been.............. a moving target. It's a target that's constantly........ always and forever....... moving AWAY from you! 

 

So, cheer up, y'all! 

 

555

 

Cheers!

[piewarmer]

26 minutes ago, rwill said:

And when these kids that don't want to support their parents what will they expect when they get old?

 

My brother-in-law has 4 kids.  Only one of them support him.

I see the same, many ladies I know in their 40's have grown up kids, no support from the young ones.

[Bluespunk]

1 hour ago, TropicalGuy said:

About right in my case.With House Paid. 850 baht year Basic Local Operating Spend for couple with retired dependent. No Hiso Activity or Capital Spend. Increase by 200k for Capital Spend ; transport  / holidays/ house Renovations, etc.  Min. 1mill year. 

Yeah, well if that's the case for you then fine.

 

I couldn't survive 30 years on 71,000.

[GarryP]

8 minutes ago, Oxx said:

Complete and utter tosh.  The Government in its wisdom has decided 600 baht pension paid monthly is enough for those aged under 69.  I'm sure they know better than armchair (or barstool) experts here on this site.

Those that have been paying in to the Social Security system here will also be entitled to a lump sum or pension, depending on how many years they have paid in. If they have paid in for 15 years or more, the lump sum option is removed and they will get a pension of approx. Baht 5,000. My pension will be arround Baht 5,300/month as I have paid in a few years more than 15. I believe that I will also receive the Baht 600 payment purely based on age. I don't think anyone believes that 600 is enough. It was first introduced when Abisit Vejjajiva was prime minister  about 12 years ago and was probably another attempt at winning votes through populist policies that seem to be standard here regardless the government. 

[Isaan sailor]

That’s a win for us.  No wonder the Thai women love us.

[KhunLA]

54 minutes ago, Pouatchee said:

You are not really realistic. How long do batteries last on a solar system? Not as long as you expect. Cars are high maintenance after a while and so will the solar system. 

Think the batteries (solar) have 10 yr warranty, panels, 20, I think.  EV car are low maintenance, (9k over 5yrs) and without me, the battery pack would last about 20 years or more, as she's not an out & about person, more 5-10k kms a year.  I'm the out & about person, and she just tags along.

 

That 10k is a negative figure, with a huge (relative) oops fund.  And, I'm still alive contributing every  year, and hard to spend 800k a year, when our bills are minimal, and will be even less when the house is done.  I'm thrifty, and she's a CC (Charlette), even with out & abouts we don't spend 800k a year.

 

When the house is done, we'll live comfy on 15k a month, if hanging out around town, within 2 hrs of house.  Leaves quite a bit, 50k a month, to play with or save.  I'm good for at least 5 more, if not 10 more years.

[overherebc]

5 hours ago, Bluespunk said:

''The National Economic and Social Development Council estimates that each person now needs approximately 3.1 million baht to spend around 30 retirement years in relative comfort.''

 

Really? That's just over 71,000 pounds-must cost more than that to live ''comfortably'' for 30 years.

Yep, 100,000 baht a year, and not even looking at inflation over 30 years is base survival, not comfortable.

[overherebc]

6 minutes ago, KhunLA said:

Think the batteries (solar) have 10 yr warranty, panels, 20, I think.  EV car are low maintenance, (9k over 5yrs) and without me, the battery pack would last about 20 years or more, as she's not an out & about person, more 5-10k kms a year.  I'm the out & about person, and she just tags along.

 

That 10k is a negative figure, with a huge (relative) oops fund.  And, I'm still alive contributing every  year, and hard to spend 800k a year, when our bills are minimal, and will be even less when the house is done.  I'm thrifty, and she's a CC (Charlette), even with out & abouts we don't spend 800k a year.

 

When the house is done, we'll live comfy on 15k a month, if hanging out around town, within 2 hrs of house.  Leaves quite a bit, 50k a month, to play with or save.  I'm good for at least 5 more, if not 10 more years.

Just don't get seriously ill or have a serious accident.

[puchooay]

Required funds are going to differ drastically depending on location.

 

In the villages, older people tend not to retire totally. Many will be involved in some kind of farming for living off the land. Take my wife's family village for example. All own the land they live on so no rent to pay. Most of the family still have rice land. The elder family members rent the land and get 30% of the yield. That is plenty to last the year. Mum has a smaller plot of land where she grows veggies and fruit. There are always a few chickens and ducks around to provide eggs and meat. Occasionally Mum might raise a pig or two. 

 

A couple of thousand baht a month from the kids. She lives well and is very happy.

 

In contrast, those living in the town or those with no land will need more money per month.

[KhunLA]

13 minutes ago, overherebc said:

Just don't get seriously ill or have a serious accident.

Again ... oops fund ????

 

I'm on a planned retirement fund plan, not the agent scamming, 'go fund me' if I stump my toe retirement plan.  

Edited April 13, 2022 by KhunLA

[zzaa09]

Retire?

Hmmmm...

[wwest5829]

Noted, developing economy from agricultural base extended family orientation to a middle class nuclear family orientation. Many countries have gone through this progression. Out of necessity in the US, called for the founding of Social Security and later, Medicare. Thailand is far ahead with the national healthcare program that the U.S. refuses in favor of paying the highest medical bills of all democratic countries.

[wwest5829]

5 hours ago, bkk6060 said:

The younger people are developing more western thinking.  They don't want to take care of old people.

I think economics plays heavily into this … not necessarily not wanting take care of parents … but unable as a result of the working middle class squeeze over the past 50+/- years … at least in the US.