Obviously, the solution is to just shut down everything forever. Just close every single business, and you will be allowed two tokens per week: one token to visit the grocery store, and one to go outside to stretch your legs,  for 1 hour.  At all times you will be able required to stand in a queue, not unlike the Soviet Union.
 

The entire world should definitely be put on hold, and countless people should be subject to destitution and poverty, because this doomsday virus threatens everyone. After all, unless you are an elderly older person, you may have a less than 1% to die from it, statistically speaking.

 

 

Look, I’m not denying the science of COVID, and I recognize that it’s a contagious and deadly virus to certain demographics. That much is true. 
 

I just don’t agree with that it’s the ultimate doomsday virus that everyone needs to put their life on hold for, for Christ’s sake. Thai Culture is obsessed with the idea of saving face, as if being wrong is the ultimate shame and no one could ever recognize your mistakes as normal and just human nature.

 

Admitting that you are wrong sometimes is not shameful. That is the human condition. Nobody knows the answers 100%, and it’s purely selfish to insist that you are always right even when the sciences or real world outcome says you are wrong.

 

I seriously don’t understand the notion behind the idea that if you are wrong sometimes, it means you are a worthless person or a dishonorable loser or social leper. Learning from mistakes and admitting when you are wrong is not a bad thing. I don’t understand why Thai people just can’t admit to mistakes or missteps. 

 

 

12 minutes ago, anchadian said:

3 with no underlying diseases

I always amend this in my head to........No known underlying disease.......feel much happier with that.

7 minutes ago, jerrymahoney said:

Delta Variant Outbreak in Israel Infects Some Vaccinated Adults
Updated June 25, 2021 11:39 am ET

TEL AVIV—About half of adults infected in an outbreak of the Delta variant of Covid-19 in Israel were fully inoculated with the Pfizer Inc. vaccine, prompting the government to reimpose an indoor mask requirement and other measures to contain the highly transmissible strain.

 

https://www.wsj.com/articles/vaccinated-people-account-for-half-of-new-covid-19-delta-cases-in-israeli-outbreak-11624624326

 

 

Just goes to show how serious the delta variant is in Thailand when they only have Sinovac  which has far less effectiveness than Pfizer and AZ not doing as well either.

11 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

Just goes to show how serious the delta variant is in Thailand when they only have Sinovac  which has far less effectiveness than Pfizer and AZ not doing as well either.

If I remember right one of the top leading infectious disease doctor from the US, who had been vaccinated with Pfizer, but had gone to India to help also died over a month ago from the Delta Variant.

https://news.yahoo.com/vaccinated-american-doctor-dies-travelling-231602887.html

1 minute ago, ThailandRyan said:

If I remember right one of the top leading infectious disease doctor from the US, who had been vaccinated with Pfizer, but had gone to India to help also died over a month ago from the Delta Variant.

https://news.yahoo.com/vaccinated-american-doctor-dies-travelling-231602887.html

mmm thats not good but hopefully very rare, Pfizer at the moment seems to be the most effective in real world 96% protection against hospitalization and 79% protection against symptomatic infection by the Delta variant. 

14 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

Just goes to show how serious the delta variant is in Thailand when they only have Sinovac  which has far less effectiveness than Pfizer and AZ not doing as well either.

Well Pfizer is not readily available in Thailand so those that have been vaccinated with other vaccines will have to be prevented from being exposed to the Delta as best as possible.

1 hour ago, Rampant Rabbit said:

BUT  does  that mean they will  get seriously  ill and die or  that the vaccine WILL  stop it  going to that stage?

Don't know. Interesting point. Another point would be does it stop transmission of Delta as these two have that variant. This is vaccine breakthrough of the variant and this is new to science. Do some vaccines allow this breakthrough over others? There are many questions about this virus that seems to be very, very able to change it's nature. A perfect virus that seems to have evolved like nothing else.

So there you have it! If they had stuck to the first wave philosophy of No Test No Have, the Phuket Sandbox may have had a chance, but now with the daily deaths racking up it is more than likely that countries will be adding Thailand to their RED lists sooner rather than later and therefore no tourists to kick off the mass tourism return.

 

However I remember reading on this forum some months ago that Thailand's reliance on tourism is a small part of GDP, So no problem for the economy. All is well in the LOS.

Just now, jerrymahoney said:

Well Pfizer is not reaeily available in Thailand so those that have been vaccinated with other vaccines will have to be prevented from being exposed to the  Delta as best as possible.

Thats exactly why I mentioned AZ and Sinovac that are here presently:

 

"Thailand when they only have Sinovac  which has far less effectiveness than Pfizer and AZ not doing as well either"

 

 

5 minutes ago, dinsdale said:

Don't know. Interesting point. Another point would be does it stop transmission of Delta as these two have that variant. This is vaccine breakthrough of the variant and this is new to science. Do some vaccines allow this breakthrough over others? There are many questions about this virus that seems to be very, very able to change it's nature. A perfect virus that seems to have evolved like nothing else.

Delta is so contagious that experts say more than 80% of a population would need to be given shots in order to just contain it — a challenging target even for nations with significant vaccination programs. 

19 minutes ago, HandsomeTallFarang said:

Obviously, the solution is to just shut down everything forever. Just close every single business, and you will be allowed two tokens per week: one token to visit the grocery store, and one to go outside to stretch your legs,  for 1 hour.  At all times you will be able required to stand in a queue, not unlike the Soviet Union.
 

The entire world should definitely be put on hold, and countless people should be subject to destitution and poverty, because this doomsday virus threatens everyone. After all, unless you are an elderly older person, you may have a less than 1% to die from it, statistically speaking.

 

 

Look, I’m not denying the science of COVID, and I recognize that it’s a contagious and deadly virus to certain demographics. That much is true. 
 

I just don’t agree with that it’s the ultimate doomsday virus that everyone needs to put their life on hold for, for Christ’s sake. Thai Culture is obsessed with the idea of saving face, as if being wrong is the ultimate shame and no one could ever recognize your mistakes as normal and just human nature.

 

Admitting that you are wrong sometimes is not shameful. That is the human condition. Nobody knows the answers 100%, and it’s purely selfish to insist that you are always right even when the sciences or real world outcome says you are wrong.

 

I seriously don’t understand the notion behind the idea that if you are wrong sometimes, it means you are a worthless person or a dishonorable loser or social leper. Learning from mistakes and admitting when you are wrong is not a bad thing. I don’t understand why Thai people just can’t admit to mistakes or missteps. 

 

 

Almost 4,000,000 dead in less than 1.5 years and going on to 200,000,000 infected. Yep have to agree. Can't be that bad.????

4 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

Thats exactly why I mentioned AZ and Sinovac that are here presently:

 

"Thailand when they only have Sinovac  which has far less effectiveness than Pfizer and AZ not doing as well either"

 

 

Great -- and that's why I mentioned how to handle the situation with AZ and Sinovac which are here rather than just saying  that Pfizer would have been better.

1 minute ago, jerrymahoney said:

Great -- and that's why I mentioned how to handle the situation with AZ and Sinovac which are here rather than just saying  that Pfizer would have been better.

How would you handle the situation here?

2 minutes ago, dinsdale said:

Almost 4,000,000 dead in less than 1.5 years and going on to 200,000,000 infected. Yep have to agree. Can't be that bad.????

Yes and there are still many out there who just claim it is the same as the flu.

 

 

Seasonal flu kills 291,000 to 646,000 people worldwide each year, according to a new estimate that's higher than the previous one of 250,000 to 500,000 deaths a year.

The new figures from the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention and other groups were published Dec. 13 in The Lancet medical journal.

2 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

How would you handle the situation here?

I already said.

5 hours ago, DrJack54 said:

Serious question. 

If they did want to ramp up testing, (I don't mean hospitals), I mean in the general population. Not clusters etc, but rather general random testing.....how is that actually done? 

Set up a testing station and rely on people turning up.? 

Yep, just set up testing centres. In the UK when surge testing they will also go door to door in areas. Only problem Thailand has is reluctance of people to test if not sick for fear of been locked up for 2 weeks, away from family and loss of income with very little if any government support financially. 

1 minute ago, jerrymahoney said:

I already said.

You said "prevented from being exposed to the Delta as best as possible."

 

We would all like that but what do you consider to be the best way to presently do that right now in Thailand.

Knowing that hospitals in Bangkok have been sending away people seeking a test, to avoid having to find a bed for them in case they happen to test positive, the number for Bangkok has basically become meaningless and it's anyone's guess what the true number might be.

4 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

You said "prevented from being exposed to the Delta as best as possible."

 

We would all like that but what do you consider to be the best way to presently do that right now in Thailand.

Beats me.

24 minutes ago, jerrymahoney said:

Delta Variant Outbreak in Israel Infects Some Vaccinated Adults
Updated June 25, 2021 11:39 am ET

TEL AVIV—About half of adults infected in an outbreak of the Delta variant of Covid-19 in Israel were fully inoculated with the Pfizer Inc. vaccine, prompting the government to reimpose an indoor mask requirement and other measures to contain the highly transmissible strain.

 

https://www.wsj.com/articles/vaccinated-people-account-for-half-of-new-covid-19-delta-cases-in-israeli-outbreak-11624624326

 

 

 

Did the makers of the vaccines ever claim they would stop people catching the virus?    The only thing that they said they would do is reduce the severity of the illness as they train cells to make proteins to deal with it - of course this won’t stop people catching it.    People can still catch covid and test positive after receiving both jabs and as the vaccines are not 100% effective at preventing serious illness, then it is even expected that people will still get ill and die from covid, but a much smaller percentage than would have otherwise.

 

Surely the only important number here is how many of those double vaccinated people became seriously ill and/or died from the virus.     Since the vaccines are 90-95% effective at preventing serious illness then it should only be a concern if more than 10% of double vaccinated people are becoming seriously ill.   

 

There were 2 ways of reporting this story.    It could have been “vaccines do their job as despite virus outbreak, hardly any increase in hospital admissions occurred”, but instead it’s reported as “outbreak infects some vaccinated adults”.   

6 minutes ago, James105 said:

There were 2 ways of reporting this story.    It could have been “vaccines do their job as despite virus outbreak, hardly any increase in hospital admissions occurred”, but instead it’s reported as “outbreak infects some vaccinated adults”.  

And a third way -- which is what the WSJ acturally reported -- is that Israel is saying no matter if you are fully vaccinated, do not let your guard down. Which I guess could apply to here in Thailand as well.

36 minutes ago, Caldera said:

Knowing that hospitals in Bangkok have been sending away people seeking a test, to avoid having to find a bed for them in case they happen to test positive, the number for Bangkok has basically become meaningless and it's anyone's guess what the true number might be.

I think positive cases will be coming down next week, not only because of multiple hospitals not carrying out tests because of lack of beds and lack of staff but additionally with over 500 workers camps now effectively sealed within their bubble.

 

So need more need to test in those previous cluster hotspots. They are completely sealed so plenty of time for them all to get herd immunity and as a result they will also be last on the list to get any spare vaccines. Yes extremely inhumane and plenty of reports on the disgusting conditions but the fact is Thailand has now done this.

 

The major problem they are overlooking is that its already out in the wild and will keep brewing and brewing until it explodes again, this time it won't be the camps but throughout the whole community. This is the doomsday scenario they are risking because sure as hell their vaccine roll out is nowhere near enough to combat this.

Lack of medical assistance for Covid-infected worker raises concerns

 

A Facebook post of a Covid-19 infected worker waiting for medical personnel to pick him up in front of a dormitory in Pathum Thani province went viral among netizens on Saturday.

A famous Facebook page said he had waited for three days after being abandoned by the dormitory owner.

 

 

https://www.nationthailand.com/in-focus/40002518

6 hours ago, Ron jeremy said:

Little India 

How does 27 compare to 284.

Of course you can always make a point with the decimal.

44 minutes ago, bkk6060 said:

Yes and there are still many out there who just claim it is the same as the flu.

 

 

Seasonal flu kills 291,000 to 646,000 people worldwide each year, according to a new estimate that's higher than the previous one of 250,000 to 500,000 deaths a year.

The new figures from the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention and other groups were published Dec. 13 in The Lancet medical journal.

UK, anybody who dies within 28 days of a positive test is a covid death,sure no wonder the numbers are so high. 

July will be a critical month for the Thai health system – Rural Doctor Society

Next month will be critical for the Thai health system, because hospitals will be overwhelmed and there won’t be enough beds to accommodate the increasing number of COVID-19 patients. Worse still, only about half of the 15 million doses of vaccines expected for the July will actually arrive, according to the Rural Doctor Society RDS).

 

In its Facebook post today (Sunday), the RDS said that COVID-19 infections are spreading, not just in Bangkok but in several other provinces as well, straining the healthcare system to the extent that patients have outnumbered hospital beds, resulting in them being kept at home awaiting admission.

 

With the ICU facilities fully occupied, severe cases who need urgent medical treatment will not survive and this is being reflected in the daily increase in fatalities, said the society.

 

https://www.thaipbsworld.com/july-will-be-a-critical-month-for-the-thai-health-system-rural-doctor-society/

6 hours ago, ftpjtm said:

According to Worldometer Thailand is number 145 in tests per million population. Bangkok hospitals are refusing tests because they can't treat infected persons. At the Sattahip morning market vendors are running away from people performing tests because they are afraid of being locked out of work for 14 days if they test positive. 

 

And in spite of all of the above, Thailand is in the top 20 list of most new daily infections. 

You have ignored the most important figure, deaths per million of population.

Most of the west is thousands of deaths per million, how does Thailand compare?

Last night, there was an order to close worker camps in Bangkok and its vicinity for a month. Today, Mittraphap Road from Muak Lek to Pak Chong is very congested. Coincidence? #Thailand

 

https://twitter.com/RichardBarrow/status/1409064847954702337

 

5 hours ago, Bkk Brian said:

Tell that to those who can't get a hospital bed in Bangkok and are suffering serious effects from covid

And now on top of the fact that people cannot get a Hospital bed in BKK, the obscene practice of " Migrant Dumping " seems to be on the increase again.

It  was reported in the BP this AM, that Public health Ministry Pre - Admission  Centre is closing its door to migrant Workers, who are Covid positive, as so many have now been abandoned there by their Employers.

I guess this is Thailands way of stating to the whole World, that they are the master Race in SE Asia

6 minutes ago, Daithi85 said:

UK, anybody who dies within 28 days of a positive test is a covid death,sure no wonder the numbers are so high. 

Nope.

 

That was just a story spread by the media.

 

The official procedure for determining  cause of death in the UK remains the same as before Covid19.