Netanyahu rejects claims accusing Israel of genocide in Gaza

[ezzra]

Those posters here who repeatedly scream and cry "war crimes, Genocide, Indict Netanyahou for war crimes"

Show me one war in history where civilians were not hurt either by design, on purpose or as a results of collateral damages?

 

How can you have a war without a third party being caught in the middle and Israel has a war on it's hands as we speak,

from Lebanon, Syria, the west Bank and Gaza, are you going to blame the Hezbollah for war crimes lobbing rockets indiscriminately

on an Israeli cities and towns? and if not, why not? people citizens are dying there just like in Gaza so what Hezbollah and Hamas

doing is not a war crimes but what Israel doing to defends it's self is a war crimes?...

[placeholder]

4 hours ago, coolcarer said:

Thou does protest too much. Justifying an attempted smart Alec intro……lol

Whatever smart alec intro you may be alleging, the fact is that you clearly didn't read that article in its entirety.. But what's more important, you didn't have a clue about the World /Food Programme's functions in Israel. You might want to educate yourself about how much effort and care goes into the creation of its reports:

https://archive.ph/iRA27

https://www.newyorker.com/news/q-and-a/gaza-is-starving

And on the grfowing list of facts you ignore is the subsequent survey by Unicef of the level of hunger in Gaza among nursing mothers and children.

And, to top it off, you complete just ignore Blinken's characterization of the situation in Gaza.

Apart from these quibbles, your post was spot on.

[ezzra]

 

Israel has killed top Hezbollah commander Wissam al-Tawil in an air strike in southern Lebanon, the Lebanese armed group says.

 

 

A reminder to Nasrallah and a rude awakening yesterday that he too, just as vulnerable, and his days are numbered

should he continues doing what he's doing now...

[Yellowtail]

1 hour ago, placeholder said:

Whatever smart alec intro you may be alleging, the fact is that you clearly didn't read that article in its entirety.. But what's more important, you didn't have a clue about the World /Food Programme's functions in Israel. You might want to educate yourself about how much effort and care goes into the creation of its reports:

https://archive.ph/iRA27

https://www.newyorker.com/news/q-and-a/gaza-is-starving

And on the grfowing list of facts you ignore is the subsequent survey by Unicef of the level of hunger in Gaza among nursing mothers and children.

And, to top it off, you complete just ignore Blinken's characterization of the situation in Gaza.

Apart from these quibbles, your post was spot on.

What is it you think Israel should be doing differently? 

[placeholder]

On 1/5/2024 at 1:42 PM, Bkk Brian said:

"We have eyewitness reporst from the Wall Street Journal, one of the best and most accurate media sources there is"

 

Really, its had its fair share of failed fact checks, not sure how you can claim its one of the most accurate sources there is? 

 

Regardless so we don't get into that debate on credible sources again and go off topic, can you provide a link to the eyewitness reports in the Wall Street Journal?

 

The report dated 21st Dec from the New Yorker with headline "Gaza Is Starving". Interesting how different media have a take on this, here's the report from the New York Times, dated 1st Jan:

 

Half of Gazans Are at Risk of Starving, U.N. Warns

“I’ve been doing this for about 20 years,” Mr. Husain said. “I’ve been to pretty much any conflict, whether Yemen, whether it was South Sudan, northeast Nigeria, Ethiopia, you name it. And I have never seen anything like this, both in terms of its scale, its magnitude, but also at the pace that this has unfolded.”
Eylon Levy, an Israeli government spokesman, contended that Israel did not stand in the way of humanitarian assistance and blamed Hamas, the Palestinian group that rules Gaza, for any shortages. He accused Hamas of seizing some of the aid for its own uses. He did not provide evidence, but Western and Arab officials have said that Hamas is known to have a large stockpile of supplies, including food, fuel and medicine.

https://archive.ph/0liiq

https://www.nytimes.com/2024/01/01/world/middleeast/gaza-israel-hunger.html

 

The source report however offers more, link to it is the the article above. Some of its data input was from a survey of local Gazans taken in the November ceasefire and of course local UN agencies including some of those who are well known to be infiltrated with Hamas supporters. The remainder of the first section of the report is based on data input between 24 November - 7 December 2023 only, not for the present.

 

We know that the second border crossing was opened on the 17th Dec through Israel's Kerem Shalom border crossing and that led to a significant increase in food aid delivery. The remaining sections of the report is predictions based on differing scenarios, those predictions go up to Feb 2024.

 

Bottom line, the first section of the report is already out of date since the new border crossing opened and more aid started to enter. So pointless debating further.

You should definitely share this information with Anthony Blinken about the current conditions with Anthony Bliniken. Clearly, he needs an update.

“We are intensely focused on the very difficult and indeed deteriorating food situation for men, women, and children in Gaza, and it’s something we’re working on 24/7,” Blinken said.

https://www.timesofisrael.com/blinken-warns-against-gazans-displacement-says-war-may-metastasize-to-wider-region/'

The only small and niggling problem with this is that his comment is dated January, 7, 2024.

Can you share with us what your take on the meaning of "deteriorating" is?

[Bkk Brian]

6 minutes ago, placeholder said:

You should definitely share this information with Anthony Blinken about the current conditions with Anthony Bliniken. Clearly, he needs an update.

“We are intensely focused on the very difficult and indeed deteriorating food situation for men, women, and children in Gaza, and it’s something we’re working on 24/7,” Blinken said.

https://www.timesofisrael.com/blinken-warns-against-gazans-displacement-says-war-may-metastasize-to-wider-region/'

The only small and niggling problem with this is that his comment is dated January, 7, 2024.

Can you share with us what your take on the meaning of "deteriorating" is?

Why? and why do you think I need to to explain to you what deteriorating means?

[placeholder]

40 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

Why? and why do you think I need to to explain to you what deteriorating means?

When you write something, do you actually read it? Here's what you wrote: How do you reconcile this with "deteriorating"?

"Bottom line, the first section of the report is already out of date since the new border crossing opened and more aid started to enter. So pointless debating further."

How do you reconcile this with "deteriorating"?

[Morch]

9 hours ago, placeholder said:

Is Anthony Blinken also an employee of Haaretz?  I think I've come up with a suitable adjective for the comments of those who deny the fact of ongoing starvation in Gaza: Trumpworthy.

 

9 hours ago, placeholder said:

If his article was alone in depicting what life is like for starving Palestinians in Gaza, you'd have a better point. 

 

My post had to do with the news source and the author's political stance (which you referenced yourself, if wrongly). As you are well aware, it is quite possible to present news items in a manner fitting an agenda. The author's Israel Bad agenda is nothing new. I have not commented on what you posted - so as usual, no actual point to your 'complaints'.

[beautifulthailand99]

3 hours ago, ezzra said:

Those posters here who repeatedly scream and cry "war crimes, Genocide, Indict Netanyahou for war crimes"

Show me one war in history where civilians were not hurt either by design, on purpose or as a results of collateral damages?

 

How can you have a war without a third party being caught in the middle and Israel has a war on it's hands as we speak,

from Lebanon, Syria, the west Bank and Gaza, are you going to blame the Hezbollah for war crimes lobbing rockets indiscriminately

on an Israeli cities and towns? and if not, why not? people citizens are dying there just like in Gaza so what Hezbollah and Hamas

doing is not a war crimes but what Israel doing to defends it's self is a war crimes?...

Probably the first war in history where raw uncensored images of human suffering and death particularly of women and children and other non combatants have been widely seen and shared globally to a world populace who are nearly all connected to the Internet. Combat soldiers know the reality of war which is why so many come back from it scarred and broken for life whilst their leaders safe in their bunkers plan the next one. This changes the debate particularly in the global South and the 1.8 billion Muslim world. Their leaders will find it difficult or maybe impossible to ignore the anger on the Arab street lest they lose power themselves and for the first time in my lifetime a spotlight has been shone on Israel like never before. The new axis of evil looks on the carnage in Gaza with grim satisfaction as they can amply illustrate their western whataboutism with the freshly minted corpses of Palestinian babies. The Israel that comes out of this will be one that is never at peace with it neighbours, always existing in a state of heavily armed paranoia with a huge drop off of global support and just as importantly Jews that are prepared to settle in such a state.

[Morch]

3 minutes ago, beautifulthailand99 said:

Probably the first war in history where raw uncensored images of human suffering and death particularly of women and children and other non combatants have been widely seen and shared globally to a world populace who are nearly all connected to the Internet. Combat soldiers know the reality of war which is why so many come back from it scarred and broken for life whilst their leaders safe in their bunkers plan the next one. This changes the debate particularly in the global South and the 1.8 billion Muslim world. Their leaders will find it difficult or maybe impossible to ignore the anger on the Arab street lest they lose power themselves and for the first time in my lifetime a spotlight has been shone on Israel like never before. The new axis of evil looks on the carnage in Gaza with grim satisfaction as they can amply illustrate their western whataboutism with the freshly minted corpses of Palestinian babies. The Israel that comes out of this will be one that is never at peace with it neighbours, always existing in a state of heavily armed paranoia with a huge drop off of global support and just as importantly Jews that are prepared to settle in such a state.

 

Which Arab/ME countries have cut relations with Israel? Embraced the Hamas agenda? Or actively got involved in what's happening?

 

A year (at most) after the fighting is over, and all will be back on track.

 

[Bkk Brian]

14 minutes ago, placeholder said:

When you write something, do you actually read it? Here's what you wrote: How do you reconcile this with "deteriorating"?

"Bottom line, the first section of the report is already out of date since the new border crossing opened and more aid started to enter. So pointless debating further."

How do you reconcile this with "deteriorating"?

Yes I do read what I write thanks. Would you like me to repeat it again for you? 

[beautifulthailand99]

2 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

Which Arab/ME countries have cut relations with Israel? Embraced the Hamas agenda? Or actively got involved in what's happening?

 

A year (at most) after the fighting is over, and all will be back on track.

 

They don't need to embrace Hamas just further distance themselves from Israel. Turkey being a case in point and of course Russia which had especially warm relations with Netanhyu via Putin. With Russia pivoting to Iran that's a biggie particularly in tech transfer and pariah state mutual support. In a year's time probably the whole world will be a worse place , Israel included.

[placeholder]

11 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

 

My post had to do with the news source and the author's political stance (which you referenced yourself, if wrongly). As you are well aware, it is quite possible to present news items in a manner fitting an agenda. The author's Israel Bad agenda is nothing new. I have not commented on what you posted - so as usual, no actual point to your 'complaints'.

More evasion from you. The fact is that the reports from Haaretz about the food situation in Gaza jibes with other eyewitness reports. And your attempt to cast doubt on the report from the World Food Programme by offering speculative comments about possible machinations behind the report have been belied. Ya think Blinken chose to make his comments at WFP warehouse about the deteriorating food situation in Gaza despite their report? 

[placeholder]

6 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

Yes I do read what I write thanks. Would you like me to repeat it again for you? 

And you still have no answer for why Blinken described the food situation as "deteriorating" or why that contradicts what you wrote. You've got nothing. Except some lovely photos of a food market.

[Morch]

3 minutes ago, beautifulthailand99 said:

They don't need to embrace Hamas just further distance themselves from Israel. Turkey being a case in point and of course Russia which had especially warm relations with Netanhyu via Putin. With Russia pivoting to Iran that's a biggie particularly in tech transfer and pariah state mutual support. In a year's time probably the whole world will be a worse place , Israel included.

 

Turkey's foreign relations, under current management, are always unstable. One day he's denouncing a country, the next they are buddies. Same flip flops with more than one ME country over the years (Israel included). Russia does what's best for Russia - they ain't nobody's 'friend', even if Netanyahu was trying hard to give this impression. Again, not the first time Russia turned it's back on Israel. Nothing new. And not so much 'pivoting' to Iran, just a matter of need and deepening existing connections.

 

Comments like you've made always appear whenever things flare up between Israel and the Palestinians (or Hezbollah). The long term trend does not support them.

[Morch]

4 minutes ago, placeholder said:

More evasion from you. The fact is that the reports from Haaretz about the food situation in Gaza jibes with other eyewitness reports. And your attempt to cast doubt on the report from the World Food Programme by offering speculative comments about possible machinations behind the report have been belied. Ya think Blinken chose to make his comments at WFP warehouse about the deteriorating food situation in Gaza despite their report? 

 

More nonsense from you. I was not commenting on the content, but on the source. You keep making allegations as to stuff I haven't commented on.

 

Give it a rest.

[Bkk Brian]

1 minute ago, placeholder said:

And you still have no answer for why Blinken described the food situation as "deteriorating" or why that contradicts what you wrote. You've got nothing. Except some lovely photos of a food market.

 

1 hour ago, Bkk Brian said:

Why? and why do you think I need to to explain to you what deteriorating means?

You insisted. I will leave you to it.

[ezzra]

21 minutes ago, beautifulthailand99 said:

They don't need to embrace Hamas just further distance themselves from Israel. Turkey being a case in point and of course Russia which had especially warm relations with Netanhyu via Putin. With Russia pivoting to Iran that's a biggie particularly in tech transfer and pariah state mutual support. In a year's time probably the whole world will be a worse place , Israel included.

If you can imagine a scenario where, if given the chance, somehow, Hypothetically, a million Muslims are amassed on Israel's fronts,weapons and all, do you think for one moment that ,they will not take the opportunity to storm Israel and burn, torture and slaughter all Israelis, men, women and children? the above scenario is not a fantasy and

it could happen and this is why Israel hast o do what ever should be done to defend itself...

 

[Photoguy21]

I agree with him

[thaibeachlovers]

38 minutes ago, beautifulthailand99 said:

The Israel that comes out of this will be one that is never at peace with it neighbours, always existing in a state of heavily armed paranoia with a huge drop off of global support

I certainly agree with that, having said similar before on this forum.

Also a casualty in this disaster is the US, which will never again be seen as an honest broker in the Middle East ( or possibly anywhere ), IMO. There is a cost for unconditional support ( and providing the means to do so ) for the killing of thousands of defenseless children in full view of the world television audience. There is no hiding the reality when Al Jazeera broadcasts hour by hour the unfolding atrocity, while world leaders wring their hands and hide behind the UN fiasco to do nothing that would make a difference. There are no innocent leaders in this one, except perhaps South African ones, as they have at least referred the matter to a world body to judge.

 

IMO prior to this there was a chance, though slim, for a two state solution, but it's apparent now that netanyahu and his cabal of war makers has no interest in such.

[thaibeachlovers]

20 minutes ago, ezzra said:

If you can imagine a scenario where, if given the chance, somehow, Hypothetically, a million Muslims are amassed on Israel's fronts,weapons and all, do you think for one moment that ,they will not take the opportunity to storm Israel and burn, torture and slaughter all Israelis, men, women and children? the above scenario is not a fantasy and

it could happen and this is why Israel hast o do what ever should be done to defend itself...

 

Please explain then how 9,000 dead children will keep Israel safe? Is it not more likely that the Muslim world will seek to avenge the dead of Gaza?

At this point in time, the ones doing the slaughtering of men, women and children are Israelis.

 

the above scenario is not a fantasy and

it could happen

and IMO if it happens it will be because of the situation in Gaza now.

[placeholder]

1 hour ago, Morch said:

 

More nonsense from you. I was not commenting on the content, but on the source. You keep making allegations as to stuff I haven't commented on.

 

Give it a rest.

That's exactly the point. You weren't commenting on the content. The question is why and the answer is obvious. Your efforts to undermine the factuality of  reports about actual ongoing starvation in Gaza haven't gone unnoticed. You are the party who claimed it was nitpicking to cite the difference between reports predicting starvation and reports of actual ongoing starvation. Using words like "nitpicking" is your usual recourse when you are cornered and have no salient response. As regards to starvation situation in Gaza, ithat tiredtactic establishes that you  don't have much use for reality.

[Morch]

1 hour ago, ezzra said:

If you can imagine a scenario where, if given the chance, somehow, Hypothetically, a million Muslims are amassed on Israel's fronts,weapons and all, do you think for one moment that ,they will not take the opportunity to storm Israel and burn, torture and slaughter all Israelis, men, women and children? the above scenario is not a fantasy and

it could happen and this is why Israel hast o do what ever should be done to defend itself...

 

 

What 'million Muslims' are you on about? When was the last time (if ever) a 'million Muslims' cooperated and gathered for something of the sort? In reality (as opposed to fantasies aired) Israel got long lasting, stable peace agreements with two of its Arab neighbors. The likelihood of post-civil-war Syria gearing up for that, or Lebanon fully committed to Hezbollah's agenda is slim.

 

One can assert Israel's need and right to defend itself without getting hysterical.

[Morch]

1 hour ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I certainly agree with that, having said similar before on this forum.

Also a casualty in this disaster is the US, which will never again be seen as an honest broker in the Middle East ( or possibly anywhere ), IMO. There is a cost for unconditional support ( and providing the means to do so ) for the killing of thousands of defenseless children in full view of the world television audience. There is no hiding the reality when Al Jazeera broadcasts hour by hour the unfolding atrocity, while world leaders wring their hands and hide behind the UN fiasco to do nothing that would make a difference. There are no innocent leaders in this one, except perhaps South African ones, as they have at least referred the matter to a world body to judge.

 

IMO prior to this there was a chance, though slim, for a two state solution, but it's apparent now that netanyahu and his cabal of war makers has no interest in such.

 

@thaibeachlovers

 

You agree with nonsense similar to the nonsense you post, how surprising.

 

Your predictions about the USA are not based on anything much. People keep saying that the USA is not 'an honest broker', that its role as mediator in the ME is over - reality is quite different (Abraham Accords, Israel-Lebanon border negotiations, and current diplomatic efforts regarding the situation).

 

South African leaders are 'innocent'? Guess that's you having no clue, or rather quick to embrace anyone supporting your anti-Israel cause.

 

As for your one-sided take about a two-state solution - just how was there 'a chance' with Hamas agenda being what it is?

 

Do you have anything whatsoever to support your opinions with?

[Morch]

1 hour ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Please explain then how 9,000 dead children will keep Israel safe? Is it not more likely that the Muslim world will seek to avenge the dead of Gaza?

At this point in time, the ones doing the slaughtering of men, women and children are Israelis.

 

the above scenario is not a fantasy and

it could happen

and IMO if it happens it will be because of the situation in Gaza now.

 

@thaibeachlovers

 

A united Muslim world bent on something like this is a figment of your imagination (and, in a different way, the poster you replied to).

 

At this point in time, you continue to do your best to erase, minimize and normalize the 7/10 attack. None of what's going on now would have happened otherwise.

 

Again, anything whatsoever to support your opinions with?

[Jeff the Chef]

2 hours ago, Morch said:

 

Turkey's foreign relations, under current management, are always unstable. One day he's denouncing a country, the next they are buddies. Same flip flops with more than one ME country over the years (Israel included). Russia does what's best for Russia - they ain't nobody's 'friend', even if Netanyahu was trying hard to give this impression. Again, not the first time Russia turned it's back on Israel. Nothing new. And not so much 'pivoting' to Iran, just a matter of need and deepening existing connections.

 

Comments like you've made always appear whenever things flare up between Israel and the Palestinians (or Hezbollah). The long term trend does not support them.

 

Maybe the long term trend is going to change now that the social media brigade are avidly watching and learning.

[Morch]

13 minutes ago, placeholder said:

That's exactly the point. You weren't commenting on the content. The question is why and the answer is obvious. Your efforts to undermine the factuality of  reports about actual ongoing starvation in Gaza haven't gone unnoticed. You are the party who claimed it was nitpicking to cite the difference between reports predicting starvation and reports of actual ongoing starvation. Using words like "nitpicking" is your usual recourse when you are cornered and have no salient response. As regards to starvation situation in Gaza, ithat tiredtactic establishes that you  don't have much use for reality.

 

The point is that you try hard to push a certain issue. It doesn't get as much traction as you expect, so you do whatever you can to 'engage' posters on anything semi-related, so that you can sneak it in again.

 

I'm not obligated to comment on what you wish me to. You do not get to dictate such things.

 

I said that you were nitpicking (a whole lot of posts ago, which goes toward the 'give it a rest' part), and you were.

 

Cornered how? I have not even commented on what you're trying to push. You're just making up stuff about the discussion.

[Morch]

Just now, Jeff the Chef said:

 

Maybe the long term trend is going to change now that the social media brigade are avidly watching and learning.

 

Sure it will.

Anything to indicate such changes?

[Nick Carter icp]

1 minute ago, Jeff the Chef said:

 

Maybe the long term trend is going to change now that the social media brigade are avidly watching and learning.

 

   The X army, formerly know as Twitter , could develop a military wing and they could attack Israel from the North and the Whatsapp Army could  attack Israel from the South and the AEANNOW brigade could try and retake Jerusalem from within ??

[Rimmer]

An off topic post has been removed, please check the OP and topic title:

 

Netanyahu rejects claims accusing Israel of genocide in Gaza