You can't get a good pizza

[Purdey]

Most Italian pizzas in Italy are not the same as pizzas from elsewhere. They tend to be plainer. 

[Photoguy21]

On 12/26/2023 at 12:27 PM, georgegeorgia said:

I'm going to be honest 

I love pizza 

 

Last time I was in Pattaya I went  to the  the New York pizza I think it was on third road

 

I didn't enjoy it , service was good though , just the pizzas wernt to my liking ,

 

I absolutely love HAWAIIAN pizza 

 

That Pizza company also wasn't great ,so in Pattaya Im looking for the best pizza 

 

I would like real pizza , maybe I should try a real Italian one when I'm back next month Hawaiian ,pepperoni , 

 

I would love real tasty pizza , maybe even a sit down place maybe even Italian red wine to go with it 

 

Is there any real pizza places in Pattaya you love ?

It is hard to get a good pizza. I was spoilt since I lived for a while in Italy where they know how to make a pizza. Unfortunately unless you find and Italian pizza place your chances of a good pizza are at best slim.

[Jingthing]

Any comments on the pizza at Oregano restaurant at Rompho Jomtien?

I just started eating there and the Italian food is very good. I meant to order a pizza there yesterday but was too early. They open at 3 pm but told pizza starts a 5.

 

https://www.tripadvisor.com/Restaurant_Review-g3366878-d24016884-Reviews-Oregano-Jomtien_Beach_Pattaya_Chonburi_Province.html

[GypsyT]

7 hours ago, Fat is a type of crazy said:

In Australia we put beetroot on hamburgers which seems strange to some too but is a nice combination. 

Do you put that strange stuff - Vegemite - to pizza too?

 

PS. What is it made of?

 

[Fat is a type of crazy]

23 minutes ago, GypsyT said:

Do you put that strange stuff - Vegemite - to pizza too?

 

PS. What is it made of?

 

No. It would be too much of a salty taste as far as I'm concerned. I knew it as yeast extract but apparently it is more specifically brewer's yeast extract - a left over from the beer brewing process. 

[noobexpat]

Italian pizza is a bit boring. 

I like toppings, deep dish. 

I had a pad krapao pizza last week. One half of it was anyway.

[Jingthing]

7 minutes ago, noobexpat said:

Italian pizza is a bit boring. 

I like toppings, deep dish. 

I had a pad krapao pizza last week. One half of it was anyway.

I've assumed real deep dish isn't much of a thing in Thailand because it uses a massive amount of cheese. So to do it right with quality ingredients here would mean a product that most wouldn't buy. 

 

Another thing which I can't really explain. I've had great Chicago style pizza in ... you guessed it ... Chicago.

 

But when I've tried it in other places even with chain brands from Chicago -- not as good. 

[kwilco]

On 12/26/2023 at 5:27 AM, georgegeorgia said:

HAWAIIAN pizza 

I don't know what that is but if it's got pineapple on it, you need to be shot!

[kwilco]

Anyone who has eaten pizza in Italy would never call the monstrosities available outside that country pizzas.

They may be entertaining to eat (i perosnally will eat anything) but thy are not pizzas.

[Jingthing]

18 minutes ago, kwilco said:

Anyone who has eaten pizza in Italy would never call the monstrosities available outside that country pizzas.

They may be entertaining to eat (i perosnally will eat anything) but thy are not pizzas.

That's kind of silly. 

Authentic Italian pizzas are available globally.

[noobexpat]

2 hours ago, Jingthing said:

I've assumed real deep dish isn't much of a thing in Thailand because it uses a massive amount of cheese. So to do it right with quality ingredients here would mean a product that most wouldn't buy. 

 

Yes, USA standard deep dish isn't going to be found here.

Mosts pizza places are rather stingy with the cheese ...because 'authentic' italian 

I'm taking liberties with my deep dish description!

 

[Ralf001]

8 hours ago, GypsyT said:

Do you put that strange stuff - Vegemite - to pizza too?

 

PS. What is it made of?

 

 

Cheese and vegemite pizza goes pretty good.

[kwilco]

5 hours ago, Jingthing said:

That's kind of silly. 

Authentic Italian pizzas are available globally.

Sorry but they aren't and those who think they are don't know Italian cooking very well.

[GammaGlobulin]

On 12/26/2023 at 12:27 PM, georgegeorgia said:

I'm going to be honest 

I love pizza 

 

I thought you were going to tell us....

 

I'm going to be honest:  I murdered my sister ten years ago, or something.

 

If you wish to be honest, then why not be honest about something important?

 

 

[GammaGlobulin]

New York Pizza is not bad.....

 

 

I do not eat GARBAGE PIZZA in Asia....

 

I would not stoop to such a thing.

 

Most guys in Asia know no better.

 

Garbage...

 

First, you gotta have good cheese.

Nobody has good cheese in Thailand.

 

In Thailand, we only got good rice.

 

 

[Jingthing]

1 hour ago, kwilco said:

Sorry but they aren't and those who think they are don't know Italian cooking very well.

I'm sorry you're so CLOSED MINDED.

Look, I well understand that Italians are remarkably chauvinistic about their food.

But the truth is no nation OWNS a particular kind of food.

You might have misunderstood me. 

I'm not saying most or all pizzas sold globally are authentically Italian.

But some are.

Let's take Neopolitan style.

Say you have a place with an authentic oven that uses imported from Italy ingredients, with either a trained Italian chef or competently trained in that style of any nationality.

Do you seriously believe that can't be authentic Italian pizza just because it's not cooked in Italy?!?

Come on man.

 

[jacko45k]

4 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Do you seriously believe that can't be authentic Italian pizza just because it's not cooked in Italy?!?

Well sort of, the name suggests it is made in Italy, and to arrogantly add 'authentic' , compounds the lie. If someone sold me an 'authentic Swiss Rolex', made in China, I would not like that too!

[Ralf001]

41 minutes ago, GammaGlobulin said:

 

 

 

 

First, you gotta have good cheese.

Nobody has good cheese in Thailand.

 

 

 

 

 

Just shows how little you know.

[kwilco]

15 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

I'm sorry you're so CLOSED MINDED.

Look, I well understand that Italians are remarkably chauvinistic about their food.

But the truth is no nation OWNS a particular kind of food.

You might have misunderstood me. 

I'm not saying most or all pizzas sold globally are authentically Italian.

But some are.

Let's take Neopolitan style.

Say you have a place with an authentic oven that uses imported from Italy ingredients, with either a trained Italian chef or competently trained in that style of any nationality.

Do you seriously believe that can't be authentic Italian pizza just because it's not cooked in Italy?!?

Come on man.

 

 

Everything you say in your post is misinformed you show you totally don't understand Italian food when you say "Let's take Neapolitan style." - it not a "style" - Naples is where the pizza originated. 

you can't just "import" the ingredients and even with a competent chef get the right result.

Pizza comes from native ingredients and local skills that simply don't travel - in fact some of the worst "Italian" food is the result of Italian emigrants. Pizza has a history and a reason for being - it celbrated a newly unified Italy and is a traditon of flatbreads common in por societies around the world, each has its own unique local methodology and flavourings and people who think Neapolitan is a "style" re the ones whose minds are closed., to the real histroy and cgharacter of a pizza.

THe fact is if you eat pizza in Italy - you will never regard any pizza outsode as the same thing, whether it's the flour, the condiments, the water or just the air - it is never reproduced outsode Italy where they respect regional dishes and know that pizza is not a style -it IS Neapolitan.

 

 

I quite like some American pizza replicas - but the fact they call it a pie just sums up that it ISN"T a pizza....it's just a nice pastry. (the toppings are joke, though)

 

Italian food doesn't travel.

 

PS - to get an idea most people on this site who live in Thailand should be aware that Thai food doesn't travel well either.

[Jingthing]

4 minutes ago, jacko45k said:

Well sort of, the name suggests it is made in Italy, and to arrogantly add 'authentic' , compounds the lie. If someone sold me an 'authentic Swiss Rolex', made in China, I would not like that too!

I get what you're saying that authentic can be a cringe red flag word but I think that word was needed here to communicate the issue.

There are many different pizza styles in the world and there are also multiple styles in Italy.

Is a Philadelphia pizza Italian even though not an Italian style? People might disagree and I'm not sure it matters. 

Just because something started in Italy doesn't mean variations developed elsewhere can't be good.

A good example is burritos in the U.S. vs. Mexico. The U.S. versions in general are much better but not authentically Mexican. 

[Ralf001]

7 hours ago, kwilco said:

Anyone who has eaten pizza in Italy would never call the monstrosities available outside that country pizzas.

They may be entertaining to eat (i perosnally will eat anything) but thy are not pizzas.

 

Give Sicily at Mabrachan lake a try.

 

https://www.sicily.restaurant/

https://www.sicily.restaurant/menus

https://www.sicily.restaurant/post/sicily-restaurant-s-award-winning-chef

 

 

[Jingthing]

Just now, kwilco said:

 

Everything you say in your post is misinformed you show you totally don't understand Italian food when you say "Let's take Neapolitan style." - it not a "style" - Naples is where the pizza originated. 

you can't just "import" the ingredients and even with a competent chef get the right result.

Pizza comes from native ingredients and local skills that simply don't travel - in fact some of the worst "Italian" food is the result of Italian emigrants. Pizza has a history and a reason for being - it celbrated a newly unified Italy and is a traditon of flatbreads common in por societies around the world, each has its own unique local methodology and flavourings and people who think Neapolitan is a "style" re the ones whose minds are closed., to the real histroy and cgharacter of a pizza.

THe fact is if you eat pizza in Italy - you will never regard any pizza outsode as the same thing, whether it's the flour, the condiments, the water or just the air - it is never reproduced outsode Italy where they respect regional dishes and know that pizza is not a style -it IS Neapolitan.

 

 

I quite like some American pizza replicas - but the fact they call it a pie just sums up that it ISN"T a pizza....it's just a nice pastry. (the toppings are joke, though)

Neapolitan pizza is an Italian style.

I can't take you seriously if you don't realize that.

And yes, I've eaten pizza in Italy.

I KNOW YOU'RE WRONG.

Bye.

 

[Ben Zioner]

On 12/26/2023 at 2:52 PM, fredwiggy said:

I haven't yet been to Italy, but some of my friends have said the pizza there compares to the best in the New York

Amazing isn't? 

[save the frogs]

21 minutes ago, kwilco said:

the water or just the air -

haha, yeah the air.

are all aspects of your life so utterly sorted out that you have that much time on your hands to be ridiculously snobbish about pizza?

i salute you.

if we blindfolded you, you wouldn't be able to tell the difference between an authentic neapolitain pizza from italy and half of the so-called fake neopolitan pizzas made in southeast asia. 

give it a rest. 

it's the same with wine. i challenge all wine snobs to blindfold taste tests. 

[KhunLA]

1 hour ago, GammaGlobulin said:

First, you gotta have good cheese.

Nobody has good cheese in Thailand.

 

In Thailand, we only got good rice.

That's why I usually get pepperoni pizzas, adding lots of 'flavor' so I can forget, forgive them for not using quality (expensive) cheeses.  You really do need a hot pizza oven to get the cheese cooked just right.

 

Why I get better results at home when using the 2 step method.  Cast iron on the hob, to crust up the bottom, then highest temp in over, and directly under the heating elements (broiler) to melt the cheese and get some crusting on the top ingredients.  With a careful eye not to burn.

[kwilco]

42 minutes ago, save the frogs said:

haha, yeah the air.

are all aspects of your life so utterly sorted out that you have that much time on your hands to be ridiculously snobbish about pizza?

i salute you.

if we blindfolded you, you wouldn't be able to tell the difference between an authentic neapolitain pizza from italy and half of the so-called fake neopolitan pizzas made in southeast asia. 

give it a rest. 

it's the same with wine. i challenge all wine snobs to blindfold taste tests. 

You don't drink wine with pizza, it's eaten with beer.

I don't drink anymore

You can tell the difference easily - just buy me a pizza in Italy and I will tell you.

 

[kwilco]

47 minutes ago, save the frogs said:

are all aspects of your life so utterly sorted out that you have that much time on your hands to be ridiculously snobbish about pizza?

i salute you.

thank tyou - I know it goes beyond what the bootless and unhorsed can conceive - and if you can't conceive, you probably don't think it exists...such a blinkered and philistine mindset. I bet you drink and smoke and still think you have a sense of taste?

[kwilco]

It’s not just pizza, it’s all Italian food - Italian food encompasses a vast range of culinary traditions from different regions, each with its own unique flavours and ingredients. In typical Italian tradition, Pizza is a regional dish.

 

Here are some reasons why you will find differences in Italian food outside of Italy:

 

Firstly the ingredients. Freshness and quality: Italy has a strong emphasis on using the freshest, seasonal ingredients. Outside of Italy, it is usually impossible to access the same quality and variety of produce, especially the regional varieties and specialties.

(Similarly, I usually buy chillies in Thailand to take back to UK family restaurant as they have quite a different taste from the chillies usually available in UK which come from India.)

Certain ingredients are just not readily available and are substituted with inferior versions, leading to a different taste profile. Even the most diligent “competent” chef can’t avoid this.

 

Italy has farming that often differ from those in other countries, resulting in variations in flavours and texture of ingredients that may look identical – even though they are genetically different.

Italian cooking techniques and traditions don’t travel – chefs take short cut or “innovate” or “improve” – to the cost of authenticity. This is often dictated by availability and economics

 

Most  restaurants outside of Italy don’t traditional techniques and recipes. They adapt dishes to suit local tastes or use shortcuts, which can alter the flavour.

They lack skill and knowledge. Even if they are of Italian decent, it is still necessary to master traditional Italian cooking and this takes time and the experience of mentors. Cooks outside Italy simply don’t have the same level of expertise, leading to variations in execution.

The way food is prepared and presented in Italy is often connected to specific cultural rituals and traditions. Recreating those aspects outside of Italy can prove impossible, impacting the overall experience.

What we expect is often erroneous. What we consider to be "Italian food" outside of Italy is often influenced by stereotypes - popular restaurants and media misrepresentations, which are inaccurate reproductions of the diverse culinary landscape of Italy.

 

Taste is of course subjective, and what one person finds delicious, another might find uninspiring – or they may not have ever tasted Italian food in Italy. I personally don’t mind eating things called “pizza” from other parts of the world – (but then my nick name is “dustbin”) – but they are not real Italian pizzas as anyone from Italy will know. I’m sure conversely you will be able to find bad pizzas in Italy – especially in the most touristic areas.

 

Italian food has constantly evolved throughout history, influenced by regional variations and external factors. So, even "authentic" Italian food can look and taste different depending on the specific region and time period. But it still won’t travel outside the country.

 

Ultimately, the best way to appreciate Italian food is to keep an open mind and try dishes from different regions and restaurants, both inside and outside of Italy.  Then you’ll realise that Italian food just doesn’t travel outside Italy

[georgegeorgia]

1 hour ago, kwilco said:

You don't drink wine with pizza, it's eaten with beer.

I don't drink anymore

You can tell the difference easily - just buy me a pizza in Italy and I will tell you.

 

Beer? Not me 

I like a good Italian red 🍷 with mine 👌

 

[GammaGlobulin]

5 hours ago, kwilco said:

thank tyou - I know it goes beyond what the bootless and unhorsed can conceive - and if you can't conceive, you probably don't think it exists...such a blinkered and philistine mindset. I bet you drink and smoke and still think you have a sense of taste?

 

The pizza here in Asia is not worth the dough.

Too much dough.

And too much dough.

And, no flavor.

 

You are right about smoking and drinking and food tasting.