Assault on Kiev: Russian helicopters swoop above Ukraine's capital

[Chomper Higgot]

It is now being reported that Kazakhstan has turned down Putin’s request to supply troops to fight in Ukraine and is too not recognizing justification for the invasion:

 

[second article down]
 

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/live-blog/russia-ukraine-live-updates-n1289976/ncrd1289985#liveBlogCards

 

Why the mighty Russian army needs support is a question to be answered.

[Bkk Brian]

3 hours ago, Credo said:

I highly doubt the west has special forces in Ukraine.  Special Forces are usually engaged in a very specific mission, things like extracting a person, eliminating someone, destroying a specific target, etc..  They usually aren't just roaming around helping fight a war.   At any rate, I'll await the many, many Special Forces retirees gracing the bar stools to give us more insight.   

 

I suspect there are plenty of spies, informants and others passing on information.

Extraction is one of the very reasons they maybe in there, they certainly were there till very recently, Canada sent a small contingent there back in Jan although they have said they've now left but who knows.

 

"The unit has also been tasked with helping to develop evacuation plans for Canadian diplomatic personnel in the event of a full-scale invasion, sources said.

Neither the government nor the Canadian Forces would officially confirm the special forces presence in Ukraine when contacted by Global News, other than to say special forces operators have been involved in Canada’s broader assistance to Ukraine."

 

I have no doubt other countries also sent theirs although whether some still remain who knows?

[Bkk Brian]

SAN FRANCISCO, Feb 26 (Reuters) - SpaceX billionaire Elon Musk said on Saturday that the company's Starlink satellite broadband service is available in Ukraine and SpaceX is sending more terminals to the country, whose internet has been disrupted due to the Russian invasion.

 

[Lacessit]

Latest news: The EU and USA will cut Russian banks out of the SWIFT payment system.

In trying to restore the USSR, Putin does not realize he is now taking his country back to the depths of the Cold War, when Russia stagnated.

It is ordinary Russians who will suffer, not that he cares.

 

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2022-02-27/russia-ukraine-war-live-blog-updates-kyiv/100865142#live-blog-post-1209109667

[Berkshire]

3,500 Russians killed in 3 days?  If true, that's pretty massive losses.  In comparison, the US lost 2,500 service members in Afghanistan.  In 20 years.  Anyhow, not sure if these numbers are accurate or been confirmed.

 

[More than 3,500 Russian soldiers have been killed since the invasion of Ukraine began earlier this week, according to the Ukrainian military.]

 

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/ukraine-killed-3-500-russians-ex-president-says-amid-fierce-kyiv-battles/ar-AAUlDsS

 

[Lacessit]

I understand it was Thomas Macaulay who remarked on the Russian aristocracy "dripping with pearls and vermin".

 

"Journey into Russia" by Sir Lauren van der Post is one of the best books I have read on how ordinary Russians are generous and hospitable, while subject to one of the world's most stifling political systems, and led by people with all the wrong motives. Peter and Catherine were probably the only leaders they had that were worthy of the name.

[Denim]

5 hours ago, Credo said:

I highly doubt the west has special forces in Ukraine. 

Me too. I think the bulk of them are posting on here or cluttering up the watering holes of Bangkok and Pattaya.

 

Easy to spot. Combat sandals and socks

 

 

 

Edited February 27, 2022 by Denim

[Lacessit]

10 minutes ago, Berkshire said:

3,500 Russians killed in 3 days?  If true, that's pretty massive losses.  In comparison, the US lost 2,500 service members in Afghanistan.  In 20 years.  Anyhow, not sure if these numbers are accurate or been confirmed.

 

[More than 3,500 Russian soldiers have been killed since the invasion of Ukraine began earlier this week, according to the Ukrainian military.]

 

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/ukraine-killed-3-500-russians-ex-president-says-amid-fierce-kyiv-battles/ar-AAUlDsS

 

Von Moltke: " No plan survives contact with the enemy".

 

Mike Tyson: " Everyone has a plan until they get punched in the mouth".

 

I don't know what the true figures are either, but I'd say the plan is probably ailing.

[spidermike007]

16 hours ago, rudi49jr said:

The crazy (and sad) thing is that so many in the west still defend Russia and Putin. In my country there are right-wing political parties putting the blame squarely on the west for this conflict, and expressing sympathy for Russia/Putin.
A January poll in the USA showed that a majority of Republicans would choose Putin over any Democrat. Think about that for a minute, and let that sink in. Putin is a stone-cold dictator, a killer, anyone opposing him and his clique gets silenced, one way or another. There is no freedom of press anymore. The power is in the hands of a very small group of very rich people, who couldn’t care less about the fate of the average Russian. And many Americans would choose a man like that over any Democrat. That’s just insane.

But then again, many people in Germany (and not only Germany) still admire Hitler. Lots of Russians still admire Stalin. People in Spain admire Franco. The list goes on. Apparently there are many people who like living under a totalitarian regime, and being told exactly what they can and cannot do, so they don’t have to think for themselves. Madness.

There are a majority of people in this world, who are not critical thinkers. They listen to what they have been told. It is easier to be like that, on a certain level. There seems to be a desire for what people perceive to be a "strong leader", whatever that means. Biden is not impressive to me. But, I will take him over Putin. I can blog about Biden with fear of being assassinated, which Putin seems to do for sport. Hey, after all Americans chose Trump. If he had his way, he would be quite similar to Putin. Likely, the same applies to Prayuth, who thankfully has a very limited amount of power, or ability to carry out his messianic dreams. 

[sirineou]

31 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

There are a majority of people in this world, who are not critical thinkers. They listen to what they have been told. It is easier to be like that, on a certain level. There seems to be a desire for what people perceive to be a "strong leader", whatever that means. Biden is not impressive to me. But, I will take him over Putin. I can blog about Biden with fear of being assassinated, which Putin seems to do for sport. Hey, after all Americans chose Trump. If he had his way, he would be quite similar to Putin. Likely, the same applies to Prayuth, who thankfully has a very limited amount of power, or ability to carry out his messianic dreams. 

I have no love lost for Putin or the current political situation in Russia , but if we are to not be part in the above group of people who lack critical thinking, then we should also apply some of that to ourselves and not buy the the western line hook and sinker.

Putin is not Russia, and Russia has  historical, cultural and strategic claims in the Ukraine. Russia , if they can help it, will not allowed the Ukraine to be part on NATO just as we would not have allowed countries in our back door to have been  part of the  Warsaw Pact. when the USSR was a thing.   

 

The situation in the Ukraine is more complicated than the black  and white  picture  the west would like us to believe .

So  , has the US abandoned the Monroe doctrine, or are we to believe in  American exceptionalism, and that such attitude concerning a sphere of influence only applies to the US?  

 

Edited February 27, 2022 by sirineou

[Lacessit]

36 minutes ago, sirineou said:

I have no love lost for Putin or the current political situation in Russia , but if we are to not be part in the above group of people who lack critical thinking, then we should also apply some of that to ourselves and not buy the the western line hook and sinker.

Putin is not Russia, and Russia has  historical, cultural and strategic claims in the Ukraine. Russia , if they can help it, will not allowed the Ukraine to be part on NATO just as we would not have allowed countries in our back door to have been  part of the  Warsaw Pact. when the USSR was a thing.   

 

The situation in the Ukraine is more complicated than the black  and white  picture  the west would like us to believe .

So  , has the US abandoned the Monroe doctrine, or are we to believe in  American exceptionalism, and that such attitude concerning a sphere of influence only applies to the US?  

 

Critical thinking says Ukrainians do not speak Russian, they speak Ukrainian. Different alphabet, different vocabulary.

https://askanydifference.com/difference-between-russian-and-ukrainian/

 

The historical and cultural claims IMO are BS, the strategic claims may be valid from a Russian point of view.

I can buy a need for the Russians to prevent the Ukraine from joining NATO. I don't buy the need for an invasion to achieve that end.

One does not need critical thinking to know Putin wants to restore the USSR to its former "glory".

He has said it himself.

His idea of that concept, and those of the Ukraine and Baltic states, probably differ substantially.

Remove Putin, and I suspect the Russian hierarchy would become much more pragmatic, a la Gorbachev.

 

Edited February 27, 2022 by Lacessit

[Jingthing]

The irony is IF Ukraine survives this intact which might mean after resistance to a Putin puppet the case for swift inclusion in Nato and or EU will be stronger. 

As it stands now Putin the Evil has created hatred towards Russia in Ukraine and internationally that will last generations. In other words he's not as smart as many in the west including alt right pro autocracy white nationalists give him credit for.

There was no urgency about Nato before this 

Putin may have lets hope so planted the seeds of the destruction of his own regime with this stupid stupid war crimes invasion.

Edited February 27, 2022 by Jingthing

[John Drake]

3 hours ago, Bkk Brian said:

SAN FRANCISCO, Feb 26 (Reuters) - SpaceX billionaire Elon Musk said on Saturday that the company's Starlink satellite broadband service is available in Ukraine and SpaceX is sending more terminals to the country, whose internet has been disrupted due to the Russian invasion.

 

Well, that's important. The most bloodthirsty and aggressive warriors are on Twitter.

[Chris.B]

3 minutes ago, John Drake said:

Well, that's important. The most bloodthirsty and aggressive warriors are on Twitter.

I would guess the internet is extremely important for Ukraine to keep in touch with it's civilian militia and other armed civilians. 

 

[John Drake]

1 minute ago, Chris.B said:

I would guess the internet is extremely important for Ukraine to keep in touch with it's civilian militia and other armed civilians. 

 

There are important reasons to maintain online connectivity, no doubt. But don't get carried away. At one point Ukrainian officials were asking people not to post photos or video online, because it might reveal their operations and movements to Russia. 

[John Drake]

Asean statement on Ukraine: 

 

FWIW, the Taliban issued a stronger response than this: 

 

[Jingthing]

Such weak tea from Asean!

Like they are blaming both sides.

Wrong.

This is Putin's war.

His choice only to start it or stop it.

[spidermike007]

1 hour ago, sirineou said:

I have no love lost for Putin or the current political situation in Russia , but if we are to not be part in the above group of people who lack critical thinking, then we should also apply some of that to ourselves and not buy the the western line hook and sinker.

Putin is not Russia, and Russia has  historical, cultural and strategic claims in the Ukraine. Russia , if they can help it, will not allowed the Ukraine to be part on NATO just as we would not have allowed countries in our back door to have been  part of the  Warsaw Pact. when the USSR was a thing.   

 

The situation in the Ukraine is more complicated than the black  and white  picture  the west would like us to believe .

So  , has the US abandoned the Monroe doctrine, or are we to believe in  American exceptionalism, and that such attitude concerning a sphere of influence only applies to the US?  

 

It is a complex situation. Putin is essentially trying to establish his own Monroe doctrine, applied to the region. Ukraine was Russia's colony for a far shorter period than India was the UK's colony. Does that give the UK permanent rights to claim India as it's own, in the 21st century? Things are evolving, and territorial claims that made sense 100 or 200 years ago, do not apply anymore.

 

For years, Putin has questioned the legitimacy of former Soviet republics, claiming that Lenin planted a “time bomb” by allowing them self-determination in the early years of the U.S.S.R. In his speeches, he appears to be attempting to turn back the clock, not to the heyday of Soviet Communism but to the time of an imperial Russia.

 

https://www.newyorker.com/news/q-and-a/vladimir-putins-revisionist-history-of-russia-and-ukraine

 

 

Ukrainian history goes way back before 1918. I mean, there are medieval events which flow into it, early modern events that flow into it. There was a national movement in the 19th century. All of that is, going back to your earlier question, all that falls into completely normal European parameters. So Ukraine didn’t get created in any sense when the Soviet Union was created. It was already there, and it already had an extremely interesting history.

 

https://www.vox.com/22950915/ukraine-history-timothy-snyder-today-explained

 

Simply put, Putin has no credibility whatsoever. And Russia barely does either. Russia is an objectively weak state — “Upper Volta with nuclear weapons,” as someone once quipped — with a nominal G.D.P. smaller than that of South Korea. Outside of energy, minerals and second-rate military equipment, it produces almost nothing that outsiders want: no Russian iPhone, Lexus or “Fauda.” Putin’s problem with Ukraine, starting with the Maidan uprising of 2014, is that Ukrainians want nothing to do with him. If he were a Disney character, he’d be Rapunzel’s mother.

 

 

Edited February 27, 2022 by spidermike007

[DragonQuest]

WW III

[Jingthing]

1 minute ago, DragonQuest said:

WW III

Could be.

But its not inevitable yet.

Ukraine somehow getting through this intact would help a lot.

[thaibeachlovers]

On 2/25/2022 at 8:50 PM, 4MyEgo said:

The one thing you forgot here, is that Iraq was a push over, Russia is a nuclear power, so the USA and others will not get involved militarily because the last thing anyone wants is a nuclear war and Putin is not the late Saddam Hussain. 

I think you misunderstand my post. I'm saying that RUSSIA is acting like America during the gulf war. Obviously America does not want to get involved here.

[Jingthing]

4 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I think you misunderstand my post. I'm saying that RUSSIA is acting like America during the gulf war. Obviously America does not want to get involved here.

Not defending past American foreign policy mistakes and there many but there are differences.

 

Limiting this to post WW2.

 

So for example  the US goes into Iraq but the goal was never to make Iraq  part of the US, to claim Iraq doesn't exist and isn't a real country.

 

 

[ExpatOilWorker]

If Russia can't win this war or are at the brink of down right losing it, could Putin use nuclear weapon? 

Would his military follow through with his order?

[Jingthing]

3 minutes ago, ExpatOilWorker said:

If Russia can't win this war or are at the brink of down right losing it, could Putin use nuclear weapon? 

Would his military follow through with his order?

Of course he could. If backed to the wall and its looking like that might happen, so he might. 

People not following orders would be erased.

So from that perspective perhaps we should be hoping Putin gets what he wants.

Edited February 27, 2022 by Jingthing

[Bkk Brian]

1 hour ago, John Drake said:

Well, that's important. The most bloodthirsty and aggressive warriors are on Twitter.

Yes Putin is indeed one of those bloodthirsty warriors.

 

However twitter and general internet access is how Ukraine is keeping in contact with the world including Volodymyr Zelensky their president who has been on the frontline alongside his troops and civilians defending their country.

https://mobile.twitter.com/zelenskyyua?lang=en

 

Unlike precious Putin barking his orders from afar..................

 

Edited February 27, 2022 by Bkk Brian

[thaibeachlovers]

1 minute ago, Jingthing said:

Not defending past American foreign policy mistakes and there many but there are differences.

 

Limiting this to post WW2.

 

So for example  the US goes into Iraq but the goal was never to make Iraq  part of the US, to claim Iraq doesn't exist and isn't a real country.

 

 

Had you read my first post on the subject I was saying that Russia was acting LIKE the US when it went into Iraq, thinking it would be all over quickly, but the reality is that nothing is that easy.

As for American plans for Iraq, they may not have wanted to take it over, but I doubt they were expending American lives and treasure without hope of a payoff.

[thaibeachlovers]

5 minutes ago, ExpatOilWorker said:

If Russia can't win this war or are at the brink of down right losing it, could Putin use nuclear weapon? 

Would his military follow through with his order?

I doubt any of us could answer that. However, I'm sure dependable ( to Putin ) hands are on the nuclear arsenal.

[Denim]

4 minutes ago, ExpatOilWorker said:

If Russia can't win this war or are at the brink of down right losing it, could Putin use nuclear weapon? 

Would his military follow through with his order?

Who knows. I never thought he would be crazy enough to attack Ukraine but he has , so I was wrong.

 

My experience is that people like Putin are invariably surrounded by their yes men. Men who if they were in another profession would be known as fluffers.  People who have strongly differing views to Putin are unlikely to form part of his praetorian guard . So , being surround by a lot of fawning and obsequious cronies , he has probably had nothing from them except encouragement and agreement on his fantasy of easy conquest. Thus , believing that it would all be over inside a few days he is now staring at the stark reality that things are rapidly going pear shaped.

 

I don't suppose that Russian media will allow pictures of returning body bags to be circulated but if ever they do it might give even his erstwhile supporters second thoughts on the wisdom of getting bogged down in a long drawn out struggle.

[Rimmer]

Off topic post and reply removed

[Bkk Brian]

1 hour ago, John Drake said:

There are important reasons to maintain online connectivity, no doubt. But don't get carried away. At one point Ukrainian officials were asking people not to post photos or video online, because it might reveal their operations and movements to Russia. 

Who's getting carried away, having internet access is vital and thanks to Elon Musk and Starlink that method of communication will remain despite Putin's cowardly actions.